Apple’s Mac Pro debacle: Failure and future

“Apple execs have finally acknowledged their inexplicable failure to update the high-end Mac Pro,” Jean-Louis Gassée writes for Monday Note. “While there were plenty of apologies, there were too few details about how they plan to correct course.”

“First, we have the Jimmy Swaggart confession: Indeed, we have sinned against thee, thou Mac Pro faithful. The top-of-the-line Mac was announced in June 2013 — and won’t have a successor until 2018,” Gassée writes. “Then there’s the contorted explanation for Apple’s puzzling failure to come up with a Mac Pro successor: ‘We designed ourselves into a bit of a thermal corner,’ ‘We were boxed by a circle.'”

“Apple’s commitment to the Mac is restated for the umpteenth time, with an unsubtle You Ain’t Seen Nothin’ Yet tease (particularly regarding the iMac and an inexplicably absent Apple large external screen). But how long must we wait for our eyes to be opened? Without any hard details on future Macs, Pro or not, the Apple execs’ attempt to console their flock was a mission impossible, a Dance of The Seven Veils meant to arouse without actual contact,” Gassée writes. “To borrow from our dearly departed Steve Jobs, Mac PCs — whether late 2017 iMacs or Mac Pros in 2018 — will continue to be trucks… The cars in Steve’s metaphors are Mac laptops, destined to be progressively cannibalized by iPads. Such cars are tightly integrated, no lifting the hood and tinkering with the engine or suspension. Trucks, Mac Pros, are modular, welcoming computer age shade-tree mechanics.”

Much more in the full article here.

MacDailyNews Take: Apple hates shade-tree mechanics’ guts.

Here’s hoping Apple’s properly chastened by their painfully obvious mismanagement of the desktop professional Mac and they do actually deliver a user-extensible Mac Pro instead of another dead-end vanity project. If Apple fails here again, it’ll be the last straw for professionals who need powerful, expandable, configurable Macintosh computers.

SEE ALSO:
Grasping for straws about Apple’s next-gen Mac Pro – April 28, 2017
Apple may be converting Mac Pro from a dead-end vanity project to a serious powerhouse – April 28, 2017
Apple updates ‘Mac Pro’ trademark to cover augmented reality displays, smartglasses and more – April 26, 2017
It’s not that hard for Apple to design a new Mac Pro – April 20, 2017
Why is Apple’s next-gen Mac Pro taking so long? – April 18, 2017
Apple’s Mac Pro rethink is a good idea, but will it be good enough? – April 14, 2017
Laggard, trailing Apple needs to catch up HP’s workstation designs – April 7, 2017
Why Apple’s promise of a new ‘modular’ Mac Pro matters so much – April 6, 2017
Apple’s cheese grater Mac Pro was flexible, expandable, and powerful – imagine that – April 6, 2017
More about Apple’s Mac Pro – April 6, 2017
Apple’s desperate Mac Pro damage control message hints at a confused, divided company – April 6, 2017
Who has taken over at Apple? – April 5, 2017
Apple’s embarrassing Mac Pro mea culpa – April 4, 2017
Who’s going to buy a Mac Pro now? – April 4, 2017
Mac Pro: Why did it take Apple so long to wake up? – April 4, 2017
Apple sorry for what happened with the Mac Pro over the last 3+ years – namely, nothing – April 4, 2017
Apple to unveil ‘iMac Pro’ later this year; rethought, modular Mac Pro and Apple pro displays in the pipeline – April 4, 2017
Apple’s apparent antipathy towards the Mac prompts calls for macOS licensing – March 27, 2017
Why Apple’s new Mac Pro might never arrive – March 10, 2017
Dare we hold out hope for the Mac Pro? – March 1, 2017
Apple CEO Cook pledges support to pro users, says ‘we don’t like politics’ at Apple’s annual shareholders meeting – February 28, 2017
Yes, I just bought a ‘new’ Mac Pro (released on December 19, 2013 and never updated) – January 4, 2017
Attention, Tim Cook! Apple isn’t firing on all cylinders and you need to fix it – January 4, 2017
No, Apple, do not simplify, get better – December 23, 2016
Rare video shows Steve Jobs warning Apple to focus less on profits and more on great products – December 23, 2016
Marco Arment: Apple’s Mac Pro is ‘very likely dead’ – December 20, 2016
How Tim Cook’s Apple alienated Mac loyalists – December 20, 2016
Apple’s not very good, really quite poor 2016 – December 19, 2016
Apple’s software has been anything but ‘magical’ lately – December 19, 2016
Lazy Apple. It’s not hard to imagine Steve Jobs asking, ‘What have you been doing for the last four years?’ – December 9, 2016
Rush Limbaugh: Is Apple losing their edge? – December 9, 2016
AirPods: MIA for the holidays; delayed product damages Apple’s credibility, stokes customer frustration – December 9, 2016
Apple may have finally gotten too big for its unusual corporate structure – November 28, 2016
Apple has no idea what they’re doing in the TV space, and it’s embarrassing – November 3, 2016
Apple’s disgracefully outdated, utterly mismanaged Mac lineup is killing sales – October 13, 2016
Apple takes its eye off the ball: Why users are complaining about Apple’s software – February 9, 2016
Open letter to Tim Cook: Apple needs to do better – January 5, 2015

49 Comments

  1. Apple had to deliver on this.

    It has to be faultless execution.

    I would say that Apple’s answer for the professional Mac market is as important as Apple’s answer to the entire tech market all those years ago when they released the Bondi Blue iMac.

    They could still lose the entire desktop market to Microsoft and become a maker of boutique tech fashion retailer.

    Your move Apple – make it a good one.

  2. I have a Quad Core Cheesegrater Mac Pro that I have kept running as I will not but the Mac mini Pro HTPC d.b.a. the New Mac Pro. If it dies before Apple gets it’s head out of it’s ass I will be buying an HP Workstation. if Apple fucks up and ships another Jony Project, I will be buying an HP Workstation.

    I have been buying Macs since not long after launch and Apples longer than that. I never switched to the Mac unless you include migrating from the Apple ][. I have owned PCs, but never as my main computer.

    To be honest, at this time I wish Apple would just partner with H-P, which is really trying to make some great hardware these days, and let us buy a license for Mac OS/OS X and just let us go our way. By this time it is more than obvious Apple gives not a fuck about the Mac and even less about the hardware.

    Here is a picture of the CEO of Apple using an iPad with an iMac sitting unused next to it. I think that just about sums it up.

    ?quality=85&w=1100

    1. I have been buying tons of Macs since 1992. I have owned 2005 G5 and 2007 Intel Mac Pros. I should’ve bought a 2012 model but the 2007 was holding up fairly well with an SSD and a ATI 5770 video card at the time (Whew! Not now.)

      When I saw the 2013 MP I knew it wasn’t for me – too limited and why Apple couldn’t know this when they were designing it if they had talked to any competent pro and were getting feedback we’ll probably never know. In 2014 I bought a MBP 15″ Retina as an interim solution. But I’m ready and hoping then for Apple to come to their senses and make a MP tower again for pros that need it like me. Surely they were hearing this in the halls of Cupertino? Maybe in 2015?

      I’m certainly ready by 2015 – nothing. Same old 2013 MP, no improvements, no upgrades, and the same exorbitant price and limitations.

      I’m more than ready and little desperate by 2016 – nothing. Same old 2013 MP, no improvements, no upgrades, and the same exorbitant price and limitations. I am resistant to buying a used 2012 MP 3.46 12-Core and upgrading it even though friends have and are getting very good results.

      2017 rolls around and a pall hangs in the air with the feeling Apple will be leaving the pro market but then at the near last gasp we hear “We’re sorry! We just realized 4 years later this is NOT the Mac Pro you were looking for. Huh. Our bad! And our bad for not noticing a lot sooner, like years sooner. No worries – we just started this morning on a new one that will come out sometime – but not this year. We really get it this time. Sorry about the “Can’t innovate my ass” remark since it’s obvious we innovated all over ourselves nearly right out of the pro market. No worries though this next machine will be the Bee’s Knee’s. But it won’t be a damn upgradeable & versatile tower that you absolutely love!! Just not fruity enough, sorry. But you trust us don’t you? Don’t mind waiting longer? In the meantime here’s a little bit priced off the old one’s you don’t want since we need to clear out these boat buoy’s no one’s buying.”

      Do you know of any company that would bury and ignore a sector of it’s market over an extended period like this, leaving easy money on the table by virtue of ignorance, arrogance and stupidity?

      Now you have to ask yourself how will Apple truly improve the pro Mac paradigm with another inevitably non-tower design since a tower WORKS SO DAMN WELL. Then you ask yourself “will they charge a ton of money and exclude all the nice things a tower has and I’ll need to attach and buy separately thus adding another 50% or more to my costs? Will they only include Thunderbolt 3 & USB 3.1 as a way to attach peripherals?”

      I’m talking to Puget Systems (who understand how to provide real service to pro needs) and designing and getting the workstation of my dreams, well except for the macOS ‘n stuff.

      This whole episode is the stuff of nightmares Apple has foisted on those of us apparently suffering from macOS Stockholm Syndrome – “No no way can we leave Apple and macOS!” My feeling is if Apple doesn’t care about us (which is abundantly clear despite cheap talk) why should we care about them? Actions – not words – are what matter and we’ve had precious little of the former.

        1. I already do thanks. Our 4K web series is being cut on a PC at a partners that I personally upgraded to house a RAID and new Nvidia GTX 1080 card. I am also a longtime professional in the film industry, belong to many prominent industry organizations and have used PC’s, Linux and Mac’s. I just prefer Mac’s but a pros gotta do what a pros gotta do if Apple doesn’t supply it. So you’re being redundant of what I’ve been saying.

          You know the problem with the 2013 Mac Pro is it was selfishly designed to be an FCPX monster but the problem is it’s not an FCPX-only world (even less so today for sure) and Apple owes it to pros to design a machine that can be tuned to whatever purpose and application they so desire.

      1. I believe, Peter, that what Apple thought is that people like you would quietly go into the night leaving them alone to pursue their real interests.

        Apple is no longer a computer company. I respectfully submit, once again, that they are evolving into a consumer electronics company, which includes consumer information appliances and services.

        Like you, I’ve gone elsewhere for my enterprise, server, high performance workstation, AI, big data, and advanced computing needs, not to mention things like VR and gaming. It’s not just professional creatives they’re giving up. My future, after all these years, seems to be with Windows and Linux.

        I don’t think Apple expected the noise from the world in general, about dropping support for pro level machines.

        The other thing they are not considering is like when I walked into a client office yesterday to demo a document management system, I was carrying a brand new Razer Blade Pro laptop, not a MacBook Pro and everyone went Gaga over it. They’re losing an army of unpaid ambassadors and evangelists.

        It has seemed for a while to me now that Apple is floundering. Some people say they’ve lost focus. I say they have no central mission statement, vision or goals. They’re making cars and watches and reality tv and phones and computers. The most focus is on the iPhone. Well, if my main computer is no longer a Mac, I also don’t need iPhones and Apple services.

        Someone there really needs to connect the dots between the products and services and crystallize the focus.

        1. After taking years to reverse Mac losses and now with some gains and the minimal effort it would take with their resources to totally OWN the PC market, well, it is a shame. Those slight gains could be astounding gains if they were half trying. And yes the story they’re missing for their lack of attentiveness is the lack of connecting dots as people move away.

          As you probably know I have been a fervent fan of Apple since ’92 but then this recent admissions over the Mac Pro broke something. To start to lose guys like me – major supporters – says something.

          Thanks for your personal take. I am still in a bit of anguish over it (suffering from Stockholm’s Mac Syndrome) but getting over it and moving on, also to Linux & Windows. Let’s hope more developers port to Linux.

          And I hate to say but I think it’s Tim Cook’s poor leadership, lack of insight & foresight that’s bringing this side of Apple down. Mac has become the poor & ignored step-child.

  3. Was the Mac Pro dead prior to the 2013 refresh?, it hadn’t changed much at all since it went Intel and Thunderbolt, which would put it at the 2009/2010 threshold.

    I recall a phylosphical explanation, when updates are far and few and changes are minimalistic, then the product is dead. iOS is alive and kicking. Mac OS has seen annual changes, but smaller ones. This and the iPhone is where Apple has focused its life and blood.

    There needs to be a young dedicated team devoted to the Mac Pro. They need to be excited and show us how modern computing should be done. Without that investment, it’s like Apple doesn’t care anymore. But I know they do care.

    Maybe bringing manufacturing back to the US, for the Mac Pro, was a mistake. Maybe they painted themselves in the corner with the cylinder and it took them this long to give up. Maybe it’s just on guy, near the top who has to go through 6 degrees of separation before pulling the plug.

    Frankly I think I can get excited for a Quad Core i7 Mac Mini, with dual 4K support. The thing – it doesn’t exist.

    1. I agree 100%. I own a late 2012 Quad core i7 Mini that I maxed out with 16 GB of memory and added a fast SSD to the 1 GB internal laptop drive via affordable updates from OWC. Apple’s 2014 “update” of the Mini was a joke – sealed box that would cost WAY more to be equivalent to mine, and NO QUAD CORE i7, crappy Intel graphics. Compare that with the value that HP provides in their Z2 workstations. I totally skipped the long awaited current Mac Pro. It turned out to be an overpriced, niche “designer” product that was the farthest thing imaginable from what Mac professionals had been awaiting. C’mon Apple, you can do it. It shouldn’t take more years of wait to properly rethink the Pro & Mini. If they design something that pro’s can use that offers something more than planned obsolescence, they will sell like crazy.

  4. I’m still confused as to why it seems so difficult and time-consuming for Apple—with $200 BILLION in the bank—to ramp up a modular, demi-Cheesegrater Mac.

    They must have convinced themselves that the demi-Trashcan Mac was the be-all, end-all for the next half century, and completely abandoned any further development ideas of a Pro-style Mac.

    As I’ve said before–minimum 4 RAM slots, 2 HD slots, 2 PCI slots, (one for the user replaceable GPU), 2 Ethernet ports, lots of USB 3/TB3 back AND front, and quiet enough to run in an audio recording situation.

    And otherwise, size, weight, and power consumption should not be on the priority list—except it might be nice to fit such a device in a standard 19″ rack! But it doesn’t need to have razor sharp edges.

  5. Future. How hard can it be for Apple to design a fully-functional high-end pro computer? I’m sure they already know how. All they have to do is want to do it. We all know that the iPhone is a powerhouse of hand-held computing. It’s not as though Apple doesn’t know how to design a powerful product. Apple already had the powerful cheesegrater MacPro and it shouldn’t be very difficult to improve upon a similar device.

    My only concern is whether they want to build some power-hungry computer when Apple is so heavily into greenifying everything. I have a difficult time seeing Apple building a computer with a huge power supply. I’m not really certain how much power dual Radeon D700s drew in the trashcan MacPro but a new MacPro isn’t likely to draw much more power than that. Apple can’t have it both ways, so there is likely to be some energy compromise made on a new MacPro.

    I’d be satisfied if I could just get some iMac that runs an equivalent of a Founders Edition GTX 1080 GPU. I don’t need anything more than that. Maybe even a GTX 1070 will do. It’s not for gaming but doing video encoding. I don’t think that’s asking too much. It probably doesn’t make much sense for Apple to build an iMac like that and I realize it. It’s just that other companies can put a GTX 1080 in laptops, so it certainly wouldn’t be an impossibility in an iMac if Apple wanted to do it as a CTO option. I know it’s not going to happen but it’s nice to dream about it.

  6. People’s livelihoods depend on Apple doing their job and understanding different market’s needs. What part of that does Tim Cook not understand? Bottom line it’s Cook’s responsibly to light a fire under his Lieutenant’s butts or assign people or dept. to keep on top of things like the Mac Pro. Also get outside the corporate HQ and talk to your intended customers to get input once in a while, and never stop doing that.

    1. Doesn’t people’s livelihoods really depend on them determining what’s best for them? Like, if I was a guy that needed a computer with 64 cores, six internal drives, and 4TB of RAM, would I:
      A) Continue to complain and wait for Apple to provide a solution or
      B) Go out and buy the system I want and dump Apple?

      I’m not saying that Power Users can’t have what they want and I wish they could with an Apple machine. However, either Apple is unable to fulfill the need (not likely) or they are not INTERESTED in fulfilling the need (far more likely).

      “If Apple fails here again, it’ll be the last straw…”
      I think it was the LAST straw awhile ago. I really don’t understand how Pro’s can continue to wait on Apple to put out something ANYTHING they’d even be marginally interested in.

      1. Apple needs to design a pro machine that is malleable enough to suit many needs and not force pros to conform to Apple’s own misguided designs, ideas and ways of working. The user should be driving this bus. He or she’s the one who has to use the darn thing.

        And yes if Apple is unwilling or unable to get beyond foolish excessive design that suits few to none then we have choices, and they will have a plummeting pro market share and yet more apologies to make.

        No worries though since HP, Puget Systems, BOXX, Origin PC, Digital Storm, Falcon Northwest, Xidax, Cyberpower PC & many others are dying to get our business and are all about giving their customers what they need and want, if you don’t just DIY it yourself. You can’t imagine how wonderful it feels to get what you want from many options offered instead of accepting the one thing that’s offered, however well built and comes wrapped in macOS.

        Believe me I no likey thinking this way. Apple is fully responsible for bringing us to this situation. All they had to do to avoid it is notice and then act – 2 years ago.

        1. Some of those vendors are companies I’ve helped people to migrate to. 🙂 These are folks that were steeped in Apple having owned many machines for many years and it wasn’t an entirely happy or easy transition. However, now that they’ve made the step, the ONLY decision they really have to make is “What piece do I want to upgrade this year”. They could not care less about what Apple will or won’t do for a MacPro in 2 or three years. They’ve got the computer that they want right now and… if a better one comes out, EVEN MADE BY ANOTHER VENDOR, it’s just a matter of setting it up, testing it for a few weeks to make sure there’s no bugs, then putting it in primary use.

          I really think that whatever “PRO” machine they come out with will be cool to the IPad and MacBook set, but inadequate for those holding on to a cheese grater hoping, just HOPING that Apple still cares about the Pro market.

          1. Amen to choices and not being beholden to one company making the right choices on your behalf. Sometimes that just isn’t necessary nor desirable. And why put yourself out trying to figure a middle ground to everyone when the answer is easy and obvious and you already marketed that form once before. “Can you say Cheeeeese – grater.”

            It’s true that Apple is attempting to overthink and innovate themselves right out of the pro market.

      2. ‘dump Apple…. I don’t understand how pros can wait…”

        supposing you have a bunch of Macs?
        I bought a cheese Grater from a company that got rid of and upgraded 60 plus Mac Pros.
        Do you think a small business changing over say 20 macs and associated software to Windows is cheap or easy? Not to mention retraining or hiring new staff? small business just going to throw away say $100,000 worth of investments? ( note: When you upgrade to new macs vs changing OS you don’t have to change everything)

        many small Mac using businesses like graphics shops are crazy busy, I used to work 12 hrs a day and some weekends to make datelines. changing OS for those with complex workflows. is a monumental task …

        over and over again people comment on Mac pro users without understanding how pro users work.

        1. Much easier if all you have to worry about is yourself. An organization is a whole different thing of course and only underlines how important it is for Apple not to mess with people’s livelihoods by issuing less than desirable machines, neglecting them and then forcing a switch which costs time and money too. Excellent point. Mac Pro needs to be a bit of a SAK – Swiss Army Knife – in order to satisfy all pro customer particular needs and then of course with regular YEARLY updates.

        2. The same thing happened when companies switched from PC to Mac. Heck, something similar happened when they went from MacOS9 to OSX. Transition costs money and if your company NEEDS to run the best and the fastest AND you’re using Macs, then you’re getting beaten to the punch every day. How many accounts lost? How many projects coming in late? How many needless overtime hours paid waiting for work to be complete?

          Lose enough money, and you’ll either make the switch OR go out of business. If your business is NOT materially impacted by the fact that Mac Pro’s are slower than pretty much all the completition… well, then you don’t really NEED a new Mac Pro, right? Most companies are NOT going to be upgrading 20+ Macs every year, they may do it every 4 years or so. Which, coincidentally, is the apparent refresh rate of the Mac Pro. Maybe Apple actually knows the Pro market pretty well.

          1. What you are describing in your second paragraph ‘about not changing and going broke’ is hardly a happy scenario as we’re being ‘forced’. Also that OS9 to OSX is a specious argument as the transition was gradual, you can use OS9 apps for a long time on OSX etc, not to mention there was IMPROVEMENT in Mac performance (where the improvement for us in Apple neglecting Mac ? ) .

            Also as I explained in a lengthy post yesterday : is it ETHICAL for Apple? as TC keeps talking ‘ethics’ everywhere. Apple gave us a marketing spiel that they were for pros (all the pro ads, the Mac vs Windows shootout demos, buying FCP, etc Aperture all Apple efforts aimed at getting pros into the eco system) and then ABANDONING or neglecting them. Pro users, their staff, families livelihoods are jeopardized by Apple’s attitude (see my post above for costs of changing to Windows).

            Is Apple ethics just for OUTSIDERS but for CUSTOMERS all that counts is the almighty dollar? So for dollar and market share Tim Cook ethics on Fairness etc go down the drain? Is that good PR? (count that cost as Pros like me are VERY VOCAL in blogs etc).

            (Note I don’t even think a tower MP will lose money, just make less than stuff like iPhone. Macs in general make a lot, more than iPad and more than all the other hardware like Watch, iPod, TV, AirPods COMBINED ).

            seriously I DO NOT think Apple’s policy is like THAT (abandoning pros) because (even if BELATEDLY) they acknowledge error and say that new high end iMacs and MPs are coming. (we’re just still complaining that it’s too SLOW) .

            1. I’m not saying it’s happy, a lot of times doing what’s right for your business won’t necessarily make you happy. When you see that big job go to a Windows competitor because they were able to rework their bid due to new hardware they ran out and bought yesterday (a few recent video cards perhaps) you’re not happy you lost the contract AND not happy that it may appear that you need to go Windows to keep up.

              And no, not specious. For those that stuck with OS9 for hardware requirements (many Pros had LOTS of legacy hardware) there eventually came a time where you couldn’t buy a new machine that would run OS9 natively. Gradual or not there was still a significant cash hit over time that had to be taken into account.

              All I’m saying is that Apple SUCKS when you consider how they support Pros. I’m truly surprised that there are any left using OSX. I will be REALLY surprised after they ship the next Mac Pro and it’s not what Pro’s need… again. Of course, if a 5 year refresh cycle is your cup of tea, you may find this next Mac Pro exactly what you need.

  7. For development purposes Apple, needs to have computers that are more powerful than Laptops and iMac’s and if Intel isn’t building the cpu’s for the future, Apple needs to move on.

    1. For development? Like developing for iOS? Requires computers that are more powerful than Laptops and iMacs? I ask because there are developers that are making a decent living from the App Store ad they’re using 2-3 year old MacBookk Pros. So, I don’t see developers NEEDING more. Sure everyone wants more… but I don’t think it’s a need.

      1. what About Developing apple HARDWARE?
        will they use Windows with powerful GPUs (to do 3D etc?) to design AirPods, iPhones etc ?

        as I’ve shown often before Jony Ive is still using Cheese graters in his studio in late 2015 photo (probably for upgraded GPUs, can’t be to save costs as dozens of Cylinders would cost less than a million and they spent 60+ million on Ahrendts first year salary. The GPUs in Cylinders are weak ).

        Using Windows in Apple’s multi billion state of the art New Campus — what a joke, imagine the PR hit , cost in repairing Apple’s reputation would be worse than the cost in building tower MPs…

        1. Jony Ive still using cheese graters…. which my current MacBook Pro can run circles around. So, you just proved the point that developers don’t NEED anything faster than a current MacBook Pro or iMac.

          “Imagine the PR hit”
          Yeah, I remember how the media was all over the fact that one of the new data centers didn’t have Mac servers in them. No wait, NONE of them have Mac servers. Apple doesn’t make servers. And Apple doesn’t make workstations. So, if there’s a need for one in the chip design unit, I’m positive they’re not using a Mac workstation. Again primarily due to the lack of existence.

          1. My Cheese Grater with 980 Ti is 2-3 times faster in GPU than the new MBP . (you can check the various benchmark sites yourself).
            (you can even upgrade newer Cheese Graters with newer Xeons or even i7 chips etc ).
            Nvidia has also announced their drivers now for the 1000 series like the 1080 which would give even better performance.

            Modern Pcs with high multicore processors , fast subsystems AND those high end cards would be SO MUCH faster than the MBP (The MBP is good executive laptop but hardly a 3D design ‘truck’. )
            Note From hundreds of benchmark test around the world compiled by Geekbench, the FASTEST MACS are all Hackintoshes!

            Surely servers in a isolated server farm somewhere are a different thing than Windows machines on the desks in the New Campus?
            (they spent one and half years designing the DOOR HANDLES of the Campus, how long do you think they worked on the handles on the server farm? ).

            also you always ignore what I’ve said that Macs make the most in hardware next to iPhone (more than iPad and like twice Watch, TV, iPod, Airpods, Beats COMBINED) — so not having a FLAGSHIP for your second highest hardware earner — i.e people can keep quoting rival products being so much faster etc — that to you is a GOOD thing? If that PR hit costs a drop in Mac sales is that worth it? (if you believe that is good business that is no arguing with you, not to mention like I pointed out above ETHICAL concerns. ).

            and like I said You are wasting your time because Apple HAS apologized for its mistake (like us Pros have been saying) and has said they ARE making high end machines so they are not dropping pros (we’re just complaining that it’s slow).

            1. “Modern Pcs with high multicore processors , fast subsystems AND those high end cards would be SO MUCH faster than the MBP”
              Yes, but, to your original statement, you were talking about Macs more powerful than MBP’s and iMacs being NEEDED for development. And, they’re just not needed for code or hardware development. IF a high powered machine is needed for ANY chip or hardware development, there’s any number of extremely powerful Linux boxes that can fill that purpose.

              “For development purposes Apple, needs to have computers that are more powerful than Laptops and iMacs”
              I’ll agree that yes, for some edge cases they may be needed, but they don’t need to run macOS.

              “and has said they ARE making high end machines”
              I suppose I’m just not willing to give Apple any slack based on the last 10 years. My guess is that it’ll be a fine machine for a lot of people, and it may be price competitive for 8 months or so. BUT there is NO way that Apple will be able to meet Pro demands of flexibility and expandability as well as some of the vendors listed above.

            2. ‘Modern Pcs with high multicore processors , fast subsystems AND those high end cards would be SO MUCH faster than the MBP … Yes, but, to your original statement, you were talking about Macs more powerful than MBP’s ”

              ????
              My first line I talked about : “My Cheese Grater with 980 Ti is 2-3 times faster in GPU than the new MBP .”

              so I actually talked about Cheese Graters (Macs) being faster BEFORE I mentioned the PCs.

              that’s your problem, you keep cherry picking stuff and not reading.

              Let me elaborate:
              I told you my Cheese Grater MAC with 980 Ti card would be 2-3 times faster in GPU than your MBP (which you said could run circles around a Cheese Grater) . And I specifically stated GPUs are needed for high end 3D design etc. I didn’t talk about Software development AT ALL , I emphasized in CAP : HARDWARE designing in my post with the Photo of ive’s lab
              .
              I also have 48 GB of RAM vs your 16 max in your MBP.

              As I have a newer Cheese Grater I have upgraded the 6 core Xeon,
              I can even put in a 3.3 GHz i7 matching the highest end MBP (but with way more RAM. The i7 is a consumer chip btw vs the industrial Xeons)
              do you think your MBP can outperform my 48 GB 980 Ti Cheese Grater rotating high polygon models ?

              And we are not even talking 12 core cheese Graters which can have 128 GB or RAM , high end GTX card and upgraded processors …

              BUT YOU ARE NOT LOOKING AT FACTS ARE YOU? Facts of Machine speeds or that Ive actually has Cheese Graters in his studio vs Cylinders etc.

              (btw Cheese graters with update cards are also way faster in GPU than the Retina iMac or Cylinder D700. An upgraded processor 12 core CG will also destroy an iMac in multicore CPU. )

              You just want to go on about your theories just cherry picking stuff like I said not even acknowledging the bulk of facts in my post so it’s pointless discussing .

              The facts are on my side and LIKE I KEEP REPEATING TO YOU: THE SVPS have already apologized and acknowledged most of the complaints of people like me (i.e we were right) and have promised to give us pro iMacs and MPs with powerful GPUs, therefore all your arguments of things like hypothetical Apple’s plans for ” Linux boxes that can fill that purpose.” are moot.

            3. Sorry, I was referring to Danox’s original statement, the OP in the thread. I had thought the OP was replying, so I was referring to the fact that they said that more powerful computers are needed for development. The fact is, they are not. Apple even said during the Mac Pro announcement that most of their Pros are using MBP’s and then iMacs and then, in the single digit percentages, Mac Pro’s.

              “The facts are…”
              That a new Mac Pro has not shipped since 2013. The facts are that what’s out RIGHT now, not vaporware and promises, but something you can actually buy, does not meet the needs for Pro’s. The facts are that I have no reason to believe that Apple will do any better THIS time. The facts are that you’re hoping REALLLY hard that they do.

            4. ok, I get too hot up sometimes too.

              reasoned discussion is fine.

              Yes, it’s still all ‘promises’. (but as an Apple fan — in spite of my ranting at them … ranting to get Apple SVPs off their butts — I hope they surprise us with great machines )

              peace.

  8. In 2013 when Apple announced the current MacPro it was after years of neglect and a call from Pros to do something so this is nothing new. We need a commitment with whatever Apple brings out to updates on an annual basis.

  9. Just up voting all the great posts today. Keep hammering TC and those hibernating Apple staffers people and maybe we’ll get some results!

    Spent last night assembling an ergotron arm for my 27 in Cintiq which will be hooked up to my second Cheese Grater, 48GB RAM, 980 TI card, USB 3, upgraded 6 core Xeon. (So many of us complaining about the TC squared MP (trash can tim Cook ) seem to have cheese Graters).

    love MacOS, don’t want Windows, Apple needs to build us the products we want to spend our bucks on…

  10. Jesus, guys, stop twiddling your thumbs. Grow a pair and put out a fucking box with the basics. DOH!!

    It will take you all of six months to do it.

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