Amid President Trump’s ‘Made in America’ push, six U.S. states vie for Foxconn’s $10+ billion U.S. display factory

“President Donald Trump has called for firms to build more products in the United States,” Jess Macy Yu and J.R. Wu report for Reuters. “He has made several announcements since his election in November about U.S. investments by both foreign and domestic manufacturers, building on his campaign focus on preserving and creating American jobs.”

“Foxconn, the world’s largest contract electronics maker and a major Apple Inc supplier, plans to invest more than $10 billion in a display-making factory in the United States and will decide on the location of the plant next month,” Yu and Wu report. “Foxconn operates vast factories in China, where it employs a million people and makes most of Apple’s iPhones, but so far it has not invested heavily in manufacturing in the United States. ‘This time we go to America, it’s not just to build a factory, but to move our entire supply chain there,'” [Founder and Chairman of Foxconn Terry] Gou told shareholders, without providing specific details.”

“‘In the U.S., the state governors’ sincerity and confidence to attract investment… is beyond my imagination,’ Gou said,” Yu and Wu report. “According to Tai Jeng-wu, CEO of Foxconn’s Japanese unit Sharp Corp, six U.S. states were being looked at for a possible location for the display-making plant.”

Read more in the full article here.

MacDailyNews Take: Gou said the first investment agreement should cover at least three states, with at least three more eyed for later investments; a total of six states. He mentioned seven individual states that are in the running: Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Illinois, Wisconsin, Indiana, and Texas.

China Premier Li visits Apple supplier Foxconn after CEO’s meeting with President Trump – May 10, 2017
Apple’s top manufacturing partner to meet with U.S. President Trump today – April 27, 2017
Under pressure from President Trump, Apple CEO stresses commitment to U.S.; says company spent $50 billion last year with U.S. suppliers – March 1, 2017
Apple supplier Sharp may begin building $7 billion U.S. plant in within months as Japan PM meets President Trump – February 8, 2017
Can President Trump bring Apple iPhone factories back to America? – February 4, 2017
Foxconn-Sharp considering LCD plant in USA, plans in response to President-elect Trump’s ‘Make in America’ call – January 13, 2017
With President Trump soon to take office, Apple looks to boost its ‘Made in America’ credentials – January 10, 2017
Make America Insanely Great Again: Apple seeks to expand Made in USA manufacturing – January 9, 2017
Apple invests $1 billion in SoftBank’s massive tech fund; may help company get in President Trump’s good graces – January 4, 2017
Apple in talks to invest $1 billion in SoftBank tech fund – December 13, 2016
Softbank to invest $50 billion in the U.S., create 50,000 new tech jobs after meeting with President-elect Trump – and Apple supplier Foxconn is in on the deal – December 6, 2016
President-elect Trump invites tech leaders to roundtable in Manhattan next week – December 6, 2016
Apple iPhone production in the actually straightforward and not expensive – November 24, 2016
President-elect Trump tells Apple CEO Tim Cook that he’d like to see Apple make products in the U.S. – November 23, 2016
President-elect Trump says Apple CEO Tim Cook called him after election victory – November 22, 2016
Could President Trump be the catalyst for an all-American iPhone? – November 18, 2016
Apple could make iPhones in the U.S.A. under President Trump, sources say – November 17, 2016


    1. What’s so special about Michigan and Wisconsin?

      You don’t live there.

      Minnesota rivals The People’s Republic of Kalifornia for nuts. As proof, I offer: Governor Jesse Ventura. That makes Governor Jerry Brown seem sane.

            1. I told you I did some time. No mystery there but in true American fashion, I got past that. I believe the war on drugs does more harm that good, just like most intelligent people.

              Is there some point to your whining about me?

            2. I’m pretty bland actually. I always described myself besides the cowboy, pioneer, explorer labels as charlie brown.

              I did have access to a lot of speed at one point in my life. Like a quarter million bennies. Interesting story if you want to hear it. I did have my moments with them. Like not sleeping for 13 days. I ran over Marshall Dillion on morning on the 101 just before hill up to Torrey Pines. Actually stopped my 55 Buick (sweet car) on the road and backed up to see his body. Of course, it was just a hallucination.

              There is a turd for you to play with. True story. I can tell you about my first arrest. Story in itself.

              Beyond that period of my life, I pretty much have not abused drugs. Just not in my nature.

              I will give you a free clue. I do not consider drug use abuse and will only accept your probable use of alcohol if you describe it as abuse also.

            3. Making All of America Great Again…

              Unemployment among black Americans ages 16 years and over fell to 7.5 percent in May, its lowest level since December 2000.
              Black unemployment has been on the decline since February — falling from (February) 8.1, (March) 8.0, (April) 7.9, and (May) 7.5 percent, according to data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics.

              The national unemployment rate in May was 4.3 percent, its lowest level since May 2001.

              Unemployment for black Americans has historically hovered below their white counterparts. The Great Recession drove black unemployment near Great Depression-era levels, reaching 16.8 percent in March 2010. While most Americans were feeling the negative affects of the housing crisis, it was black lawmakers who were beginning to publicly blame President Obama for black America’s morass.

              In August 2011, Congresswoman Maxine Waters called the black unemployment rate “unconscionable.

    1. But they missed out on the best state in the union: Minnesota! How could they be so shortsighted to choose Michigan and Ohio over a state that’s beautiful and has wonderful people. From what I’ve heard and seen, none of those states fit that description.

      1. OH is a nutjob state. Filled with lots of little small business elitist cliques and India inc looters. CoC mafia runs the state. I know – I have family there.

        1. You’re full of shit asshole. I’m sure the family you have here is some of the welfare scum that leaches off of the workers. So what state is so lucky to have your dimwitted carcass in residence?

      2. Minnesota, the “Land of 10,000 Lakes,” actually had 11,842 accoding to a 1968 survey and as many as 21,871 depending on basin area and water content. Minnesota has more lakes than unique names for them [Wikipedia]. When you are fed up with some jerk and tell him to “go jump in the lake,” he becomes very confused.

        Frank Zappa immortalised Minnesota (along with Kansas and Washington, D.C.) in It can’t Happen Here, a satire of middle-class liberal denial. The man’s every word dripped with irony in 1966. In 2017, we’ve discovered that it can happen here, and did.

          1. tRump=

            Agent Orange
            Putin’s Butt Boy (or Boi)
            Android Lover

            That Shithead in the White House will also work well.

            Just awaiting the Debt Ceiling increase where the Republicans will have to bump it up or shut the government down. Either way, it will be on their dime.

            The Fool on the Hill (Paul Ryan) and the Closeted Old Owl (McConnell) will have to work with Drumpf or their base won’t get their Gubmint Checks and be veeery pissed off.

            1. You will need a lot more than cutesy mocking terms to derail President Trump’s steam engine rolling along day by day.

              Actually, I’m quite surprised you are not incessantly ranting about how the DNC and Shrillary team in back room deals threw Sanders under the bus?

              Hard to break Democrat ranks, yeah, I understand …

            1. I’m the IT guy. My job is to sit there and look at servers and stuff all day. Gets boring things are running so well.

              Self taught too with one caveat. While I was in sales, I did put myself through IBM. Apple, Compaq technician courses. Went to an IBM communications class in Olympia, WA. It was great. They show these short films during training. (something I adopted when I was a trainer for Intuit in Tucson but I showed “Leningrad Cowboys Go America). Before and after the session, at breaks and at lunch. I gives the class a minute or so to settle down is what they said.
              One day the projector broke before the last break showing of “The IBM Coffee Bean”. They scoured Olympia high and low to find another projector and held us over 45 minutes to show that film. I don’t know whether to be impressed or disturbed.

            2. And yes, I was a trainer for Intuit. Working Tech Support in San Diego and they wanted to open a call center in Tucson. Moved out there, had input on the design and setup of a brand new call center for 1600 people. And get this.. got to design a training program for 1600 people that would be hired in December and had to be ready for calls by January 1st.

              I designed the format and materials for the training program for Mac and Windows. I trained all of the Mac support personnel.

              Had those big Panasonic projection tv’s connected to a Compaq computer with a TV card. VCR. So I would use The Leningrad Cowboys Go America movie as my settle down video. If you are familiar with the movie, you will understand why.

              Anyway.. .just a computer history anecdote.

              True story. I got a million of em.

        1. Once more for the terminally or willfully ignorant.
          (That includes you First, whatever)

          All Democrats are not Liberals or Progressives.
          All Liberals are not Democrats or Progressives.
          All Progressives are not Democrats or Liberals.

          Just as

          All Republicans are not Tea Party or Libertarians.
          All Tea Party are not Libertarians or Republicans.
          All Libertarians are not Republicans or Tea Party.

          We return you to the regular scheduled programming…

            1. “…when the moon is in the seventh house, and Michael Moore aligns with Mars, then grease will rule the planets and lard will steer the stars!”

        2. Yes, Trump is playing everyone like a master Stradivarius.

          The media, the politicians, the Washington establishment, celebrities, foreign leaders — et al.

          It is truly amazing to watch …

            1. Shut up?

              Call me childish names?

              Act smugly superior?

              That all you got, MORON?

              Pay attention and you can do it if you try real hard:

              YOU. LOSE. AGAIN.

              Now, STFU!

            2. LOLOLOLOL….
              pot meet kettle. You still haven’t said anything worthwhile. I made some claims about prison and computer business history, bot said I was delusional and a megalomaniac… I agree about the megalomania but the delusional part is actual history. Then you fall out of bot ass like a floating turd. You know that means? It means you are full of fat, hence like a turd, you float and just pop up when you least expect it. Shut up.

              Want to talk political philosophy.. then do it. Want to talk computers.. then do it. Want to present your anonymous coward credentials as to why we should listen to you.. at least be somebody. I’ll tell you who I am.. where I have been and why the fuck I say what I say. It’s not because my dear leader has his shrunken cock deep in my throat. You have never said anything.

            3. Sorry to break it to you.


              Drive by insults and VULGAR LANGUAGE in voluminous posts means NOTHING to me.

              So, STFU!

            4. And yeah. I studied with the best. Ron Karenga. Look up who he is. US. United Slaves. I learned civics in jail in a better education system than you probably had. I studied with Panthers that studied with the Soledad Brothers. My heroes are George Washington and Eldridge Cleaver.

              I also chatted with Bill Gates in his office about me selling fucking Fortran and Cobol and SoftCards. This was before he struck the lottery with IBM.

              If you are going to fuck with me, come strong. Don’t sit there and snivel because your a choking on that tiny dick you chose to swallow.

            5. Is this you bot trying to get some backup?

              You are not just a cockholtser.. but cockhungry. and you admit that you have been manipulated.

              Go ahead, snivel to MDN and get me banned or moderated. It must have been your snively ass that did that before.

              MDN… if you are going to ban and moderate people, then I am offended by the smut from bc2014 and bot and all the rwnj on here promoting their disgusting political agenda

            6. Where are the site monitors? Shouldn’t there be some civility in these comment sections? The anti-soil behavior is why I stopped reading MDN.

        1. Hey 2014bc…I’ve long thought that the divide was coming.. class warfare, climate change, Natural disaster or just the sheer numbers of people in an unsustainable world. Your “rationale” is bogus and only serves to stop debate. What the hell can I say about your idiotic class warfare and identity politics “accusation”. It’s bullshit and you know it.

          I may as well say you are a right wing nut job waiting to fellate tRump. So I’ll go ahead and say it. You are a right wing nut job waiting to fellate tRump.

          Now that we have that out of the way, tell me why tax cuts for the rich and not ‘promoting the general welfare”‘ is a good thing.

          1. Hey now, I’m not a Trump supporter in any way shape or form. I may be Autistic, but I will never stoop low to support anyone who hates Autistics, Gays, Autistic Gays (like me) or immigrants. Quite frankly, you have rustled my jimmies. I deserve an apology.

            1. Trump has certainly vexed people with leftist political views. He has also vexed centrists, conservatives and reactionaries.

              I feel safe in saying that his magnetism resides in a supremely self-confident, business-maverick nature that blasts through all the cant swirling around his natural eminence.

              He is, finally, a self-referential character in a Punch and Judy show, someone that does not need explanation or caricature, someone trying out new rules just for the hell of it. Someone like Napoleon Bonaparte, who also had small hands.

            1. No computers. Took over our education sales in 81 and pretty much all we were selling to schools was Soroc IQ-120 terminals. I spent plenty of time in the computer center they show in War Games.

              The U of W liked my service and prices so much they would consider the value of buying from us even though the major items were slightly higher. Used to get 16% margin on big stuff. 60% on those small items. ended up with a respectable 25% margin overall.

              $50.00 boxes of floppy disk. Those were the days.

            2. I’ve never done crack. Meth a couple of times. That is a couple. Don’t make me out to be a crack whore. I know you like those dried cat turds I drop.. they do keep you distracted though. Stray from the subject.

        1. Botty, you need to stop. You are willingly serving yourself up as his lunch. He’s making mincemeat out of you. Like me, he seems to be quite intelligent and not susceptible to your sarcastic aggression no matter how strongly you pour it on.

          1. Thanks for the comments Michelle. All these stories are true, including the prison ones. I actually consider them more valuable than anything I learned after 10th grade. Maybe it’s just my learning style. Not to discount the management, computer, sales training I received from various jobs.

            Anyway, without writing a long screed. Thanks again.

        1. Michigan is in the state it is in because it has a Republican Governor and Legislature full of clueless hacks afraid of the DeVos Crime/Cult (AmWay) Family.

          Used to be a nice place, glad I got out in 1971.

          1. DavGreg: C’mon. You gave such an instructive comment (tongue in cheek) about not all Lib/Progs/Dems/Repubs/T-Partiers are…and what do you do sentences later? You often claim the position of reason and then you fall into the tit for tat pit yourself.

            1. The statement I made is accurate.

              Michigan once had a nice moderate Republican Party- George Romney was a very good Republican Governor back in the day. Gerald Ford was our Congressman when I was a kid and he was a good, honest, decent hardworking representative of the district.

              The DeVos family who own AmWay are extremely radical Right Wingers and have been pouring money into Michigan’s Republican Party for decades. They have pushed extreme stuff and there is little space for moderate Republicans. One of the Family is Drumpf’s Education Secretary and another founded Blackwater. These are some cray-cray people.

            2. Gerald Ford, by his own omission, raised JFK’s back wound on Warren Report so that it would “plausibly” align with a fictional throat exit wound to support The Great Liar’s, Arlen Specter,”Magic Bullet.” Ford, when confronted with this intentional manipulation of evidence, admitted it and said he did it for “clarity.” Gerald Ford is a piece of shit.

            3. All of us will be dead soon. The question is, what becomes of those we leave behind — trapped in a world they never made? — F*** ’em doesn’t seem like the best possible answer.

        2. Yes. But keep in mind why Apple contracted manufacturing in China: Criminal Nation.

          A) Cheap labor
          B) Cheap labor
          C) Cheap labor

          Would Michigan’s potential employees put up with Chinese wages? I think we know the answer.

          This is a new US economy. Sadly, it involves drastically ‘Lowered Expectations’ if you want to work in it.

    1. India Incs are looting the USA into the ground.

      InfoSys is being sued by a former American manager because they hired 94% Indian-only workers. 94%! Can you believe this goes on in USA?

  1. They will just bring more Asian looter workers in to staff it and say Americans are too dumb and more US wealth will be siphoned out in remittances as American workers are kicked to the curb again. India Incs are looting the US into the ground.

        1. processed, is a better descriptor… you have the intellect of a dull, yellow brick of Velveeta setting out in the El Paso noonday sun.

          …in August.

    1. I was with The Byte Shop when this was taken.. At that time I had every issue of Omni Magazine. All of them in excellent condition, some new as some months I bought 2 copies. I had to have the picture.

    1. That’s right. It’s silly. Not as silly as “democrat healthcare,” but still: Government shouldn’t be in the health insurance business at all beyond simple common sense regulation.

      The federal government is bloated beyond all recognition. This is not what the founder’s intended.

      Government is not your mommy. The state is not your nanny.

        1. Wow. A Dem/Lib/Prog non-believer. What a huge surprise.

          Why is the Angry Left so angry?

          “Progressives” convince themselves that everything they’re doing is for the greater good, which supersedes the rights of any individual. It’s a case of “the humanitarian with the guillotine“: we’re doing this for the overall good of humanity, so it’s OK to start killing people. Or to be really, really mean to them in the comments field.

          There’s the fact that advocacy of big government is by its very nature a quest for power and control, for the ability to use force against others—a cause that naturally attracts the bitter and intolerant.

          There’s the fact that those of us on the right are accustomed to encountering a lot of ideological opposition. For most of our lives, the left has controlled the high ground of the culture, such as it is: the mainstream media, Hollywood, the universities, the arts. So we’re not used to crawling into a “safe space” and hiding from ideas we disagree with, which makes it easier for us to regard ideological opposition with a degree of equanimity.

          But beneath all of these factors, there is something deeper, something more elemental. Something metaphysical… It’s all about immanentizing the eschaton.

          For the secular leftist, the end state is social and necessarily political. It is all about getting everybody else on board and herding them into his imagined utopia. There are so many “problematic” aspects of life that need to be reengineered, so many vast social systems that need to be overthrown and replaced. But the rest of us are all screwing it up, all the time, through our greed, our denial, our apathy, our refusal to listen to him banging on about his tired socialist ideology.

          For the Christian, the ideal end state is safely in the next world and therefore is never in doubt. For the individualist, it’s in his own life, and it’s mostly under his direct control. For the leftist, however, it is all outside his control. It requires other people, a LOT of other people, and those SOBs usually refuse to cooperate. Talk about rage-inducing.

          If the whole focus of your life is on getting everybody else to agree with you on every detail of your politics and adopt your plans for a perfect society, then you’re setting yourself up to be at war with most of the human race most of the time.

          Which means an awful lot for the Angry Left to get angry about. — Robert Tracinski

          Read more: Why is the Angry Left so angry?

            1. You’re still in the “angry” stage of denial. You might consider another psychological evaluation to help you through this…eight years is a long time.

            2. Actually not. I’m living large, looking forward to retiring in January. Looking for a place to buy away from the big city so that when thing fall apart from your cornholer, I’ll be out of the big city.

              Nothing but blue since the shrub was gone. Until now.

          1. First of all I am not a Democrat or a Liberal. I am an Independent Progressive which started in the Republican Party.

            As to religion, I have visited and studied the various faiths and find they all share more than most of the zealots of any one would ever be comfortable accepting as fact. The current preoccupation with Ultra-Conservative Politics is nothing new for organized religion as it is dedicated to maintaining the status quo.

            1. …which suggests either that the story is true, or that human brains are addled in much the same way across cultural boundaries.

              Either way, nobody is really interested in their origins. People are more into the sensational parts of the story, the parts where outsiders and unbelievers get to be vilified and mutilated without consequence. The moral of the story never seems to register.

          1. Because I have a brain. Even when I was a child. Understand that I went to a Baptist Church. My father was a deacon. They built I(literally) the church and I went dutifully every sunday. 12 kids in the family and 11 baptized. Guess who wasn’t?

            1. Is it your 11 siblings that are posting the fake upvotes for your posts or is it your girlfriend again?

              You have a moral compass that points in only one direction: downward.

            2. …further, a more plausible analysis of your “moral compass” is an insecure malcontent scurrying from computer-to-computer, clicking fake upvotes and fake downvotes in the false hope that cheating somehow makes for “right” and doing it all on his employer’s equipment and salary…more cheating. A desperate and frustrated Alinskyite who sees his world crumbling around him as the juggernaut of MAGA destroys his lies, one-by-one-by-one.

              It must suck being you.

            3. Glad you pointed that out. Phony, for certain!

              What reasonable voting mass of good honorable people would keep up voting a vulgar, hit-run insult artist prone to errors in facts, spelling and wild exaggeration.

              You can’t spell the town you live in? Case closed ….

    1. Someone should have told The Bard of Baltimore that the United States is not a democracy….you know, right before Mencken came out in support of the Nazi regime.

      …you forgot that part.

      you lose.


        1. Had you paid attention in any American history class instead of dropping acid, you would have known that. You have the intellectual veneer of a game show host.

          1. Weak again. People pull that democracy/republic pitiful response when they have run out of arguments.

            You can’t address the central point predicted 97 years ago. Someday the morons will elect a fool and narcissistic moron to the white house.

            And they have. Moron.

            1. Your referenced quote, that you note “says it all,” actually says nothing because (A) of its inaccuracy defining what type of government the United States is and (B) Mencken was an avid supporter of the Hitler regime, who certainly was an enemy of our Republic.

              Like I said earlier, you have the intellectual depth of a game show host, which is the prime reason you embrace the socialist agenda.

            2. In a sentence, the fallacy of Mencken’s quote is he supported “the narcissistic moron and fool” in The Reichstag.

              do you get it now?

            3. like your game show host president. stepped right into that pile of scat didn’t you?

              Your examples don’t negate the fact that we have a fool and narcissistic moron in the white house. A game show host.

          2. donald tRump, game show host president and all his viewers in their silly hats and costumes groveling for crumbs. Thinking he cares about them. That magically everything will be all right as long as you can bury the memory of that Black Man That Dared Be President.

  2. The real reason why the Dem/Lib/Progs are so incensed:

    Obama’s signature achievement wiped off the face of the earth and into the dustbin of history. Obama’s legacy is simple: Failure on a grand scale that was clearly (to anyone with a brain) presaged by fake, styrofoam Greek columns and empty rhetoric spouted by an empty suit.

    1. Wow, as a Progressive I did not know I was supposed to be so incensed. Should I be?

      I didn’t vote for Obama, or Ms Clinton or Bill Clinton. All are about where Colin Powell are on the Left Right Scale.

      Bruce Bartlett – friend and advisor to President Reagan -wrote a famous article in The American Conservative (Nov/Dec 2014) Obama is a Republican.

      Here is the Conclusion:
      “I don’t expect any conservatives to recognize the truth of Obama’s fundamental conservatism for at least a couple of decades—perhaps only after a real progressive presidency. In any case, today they are too invested in painting him as the devil incarnate in order to frighten grassroots Republicans into voting to keep Obama from confiscating all their guns, throwing them into FEMA re-education camps, and other nonsense that is believed by many Republicans. But just as they eventually came to appreciate Bill Clinton’s core conservatism, Republicans will someday see that Obama was no less conservative.”×414.jpeg

      1. You make an excellent point and it really needs to be understood more fully. I think it has a lot to do with the
        integration of the Presidents political leanings as much as perception of the Presidents political leanings years later.

        Does that make sense?

  3. Taxpayers will watch the race to the bottom as states roll out corporate welfare in an attempt to lure employers, then will be powerless to stop those employers from displacing those workers with automation.

    At one time the Ford River Rouge factory was almost entirely self sufficient. Raw material — real raw — came in one end of the complex and finished cars out the other. Total vertical integration. Workers were paid enough to realistically afford to buy anything they made. Now Wall St claims it is better to ship parts all around the world in search of slave labor rates. Money managers skim all profits. Those who make products will not afford to buy them in their lifetime. And because Manufacturing jobs are disappearing kids don’t develop skills to repair or maintain stuff. Wally World trained them that everything is disposable. Even if they get lucky and find a solid middle class service job, many kids don’t expect to own anything. They flock to overpriced cities where home and car ownership makes no financial sense.

    Wall St will make assholes like uber dork Travis K a multimillionaire, his workers minimum wage dependents with no way to climb the ladder, looking at a future to be replaced by a car with aerospace grade autopilot that even multimillionaires would have to stretch to afford. Not a sustainable future for anyone.

    Federal and state governments in the USA need to learn how Germany is so successful at maintaining a strong industrial base which is critical to achieving full employment with meaningful work for everyone. For the past two generations, the USA has been outsourcing its future, and it shows.

    1. Re- Apelock
      Not a fan of RTW laws but the economics are clear:

      VW USA Plant Tennessee
      Mercedes USA Plant Alabama
      BMW US Plant South Carolina
      Toyota US Plants Kentucky, Texas and Mississippi
      Nissan US Plants Tennessee and Mississippi
      Hyundai US Plant Mississippi

      Honda is the exception in Ohio.

      The Mitsubishi plant in Illinois, VW plant in Pennsylvania and Mazda plant in Michigan were sold or closed.

      Do you notice a trend?

            1. No. She gave me the keys to the high school. My own boredom, drugs, (whispers – it was so fucking easy to open back doors of businesses back then.. it was).

              You’ve never been awake for 2 weeks have you. One night… I was stopped by the FBI while in an office in an strip mall. They told me to put everything back. I said ok. I did and when I was finished, they were gone. So I took it all.

              Sadly (not) it’s part of me and you could say has barely affected my life.

            2. It’s wonderful, the story you’re telling about yourself — in a strange way, it’s filling out another story, the story of why a small group of persistent visitors to an out-of-the-way forum like MDN devote so much energy to political and platform advocacy.

              I wish the other virtual combatants had the guts to tell their stories, the way you did. I’ve tried to do the same thing, but it made little difference — people despised me for being an obnoxious twit. It’s far, far worse when standing up for another person, I’ve found. Far worse.

            3. Earth to Herself.

              You’re in cyberspace and anyone can say anything about themselves.

              Unlike journalism, no checks and balances exist.

              But I understand your faith in posts and good intentions …

            4. I understand and this isn’t normal. I may have had opinions in the past but seeing the response to Obama who did a good job under difficult circumstances and the reaction and the environment now just boggles my mind and I guess I’ve just given up on fucks. Quite literally, the comment I made about life being good is because I don’t have to worry about it now. truth be told, this is all predictable.. society changes and sometimes it’s not pretty . speaking of bot.. I’ve been many things. I was on public access TV in Tucson with the Arizona Militia accusing Clinton of burning children alive at waco. I’ve seen the UN trucks on the road between I-10 an I-8.

              I think bot sees liberal and that defines me. I see racism in trump, misogyny, hate, sexism and sexual abuse as a self confessed sexual predator and unfaithful husband. confession, that is also a failure of mine in the 80’s. This guy is horrible and the antithesis of their faith and values and they literally idolize him. Idol worship.

              Tell you the truth it’s fascinating.

              And still I hold back.

            5. About the stories. I made the claim that if they wrote the comprehensive history of the computer business, I would be a chapter. That’s a significant claim and I don’t make it lightly. I associated with the pioneers from 80 to 85 and have been in the computer business steadily since then in many capacities. I have a lot of stories to tell and bot said I was delusional aobut it. Nope. It’s all real, gates, jobs, The Terrells, Pava, Morrow, Kay, Bushnell were all associates as a major sales and retail figure.

              I ws just a salesman and store manager and “jobs like” figure to the organization. Certainly not jobs or gates.

              Maybe a couple of pages in that chapter. There are magazine articles quoting me from the day.

            6. stories
              Aww man bot. I would think that first hand stories about unboxing an Apple Lisa to set up on the display floor would be interesting. Trying to grasp the desktop concept, waiting for things to load…. or maybe coming in one monday and Mike says we got a new computer. An Apple III. Came dead so I did the Sol Drop Test and it started up. Sold one later that morning.
              Or, since you are fixated on my plantation mentality for some doG awful reason there is this. Ruth. All long dresses and peasant blouses. Oh yeah. combat boots too. All natural all over. We’d spend a few days at my second floor victorian place in Eureka… a few days at her cabin overlooking big lagoon, north of Trinidad, WA. A drafty cabin, cold with northwest nights, crisp and cold. It was a drafty cabin too. I learned to be natural then. Eating granola bars and checking mucus at 4:30 in the morning for birth control. Do a search for big lagoon. Look at the images. The ones from the north looking south… that was my view…
              ooops.. looks like I got distracted.
              Computer stories. This is a computer site.

              Something I wrote to bot.

    1. Well, you could be right, but that raises the spectre of a single-party regime. Historically, that has not worked out well for anybody.

      When you remove the imps and demons of the opposition party, you create a vacuum of competition that can only result in your own corruption. Human nature will not, and never has been, denied. We are natural-born killers and proud of it. When there is no one left to kill, we look inward.

      1. I don’t read you had a problem with Democrats ruling Congress for what was it, 45 years? Until the Gingrich revolution in 1994 destroyed the juggernaut …

        1. Well, except for when raygun cut taxes and had to raise them again and the war on drugs created a war on the streets and mentally ill people were dumped on the streets and the CIA started selling crack cocaine to raise funds for arms and the simple minded fell for the boogeyman with dark skin… you mean the good old days before all that happened?

        2. Don’t be dense. I’m talking about Pinochet, Hitler, Khomeini. Here in the USA we have a robust system that resists those kinds of outright coups and takeovers. Some on the left might be making those comparisons but they are talking nonsense.

          My response to botvinnik, who claimed that the demise of the plantation party was imminent, was literal. If that party dies, who replaces it as the loyal opposition? Without any opposition, excesses are bound to occur. Without competition, there can be no accountability. Without accountability, there can be no justice. Without justice, life is hardly worth living.

          1. Dense? You did not address my factual post, but that’s fine. Let’s move on.

            Botty saying the Plantation Party will die can be interpreted in many ways.

            Unlike you, I interpret it as the Democrat Party will inherit its overdue comuppenance as a power hungry and control freak RULER.

            On the depleted sidelines, they will NOT give up their opposition despite your theory and musings …

            1. Yes, your interpretation is milder and more on target. I generally agree with you, but don’t say my interpretation is baseless. botvinnik is a loose cannon that needs to be rolled back to its slot on the gunwale whenever an ocean swell knocks it loose. His exuberance has gotten him banned in the past, and I feel protective of him. Is that so wrong of me?

            2. Your interpretation of Botty, at least how I read it right or wrong, is if the Plantation Party is diminished it will go away as the opposition voice of resistance. Not true. Dems live for politics, power and control and will NEVER STOP.

              Now, if I misinterpreted your post, please set me straight.

              That said, looking out for Botty is a good thing and totally agree. Provided you do not misinterpret his post …

            3. You don’t get it, probably because you’re a man and can’t help seeing a snake under every rock. I care about public policy in the same way I care about my vegetable garden and the purity of the local groundwater. That is, I care about the quality of my personal life. If a ballot measure comes up that would restrict my freedom to cultivate, I get involved. If a gun control initiative threatens to shut down local firing ranges, I react publicly. Electricity rate hikes? I’m there at the hearings wearing my power suit and brandishing a folder of legal challenges from other districts.

              For me and I think most other ordinary people, politics is all local. Regions have specific needs. Every city, every county, has a mayor or supervisor and a board filled with local farmers and businessmen and women that understand what’s going on in the places we live and work, and we have an idea what to do if only government would see its way clear to help us, rather than mindlessly regulate us.

              National political parties are a pestilence. Their absurd ideologies make no sense in any community I’ve inhabited these last forty years except to fuel disageements at the dinner-table. And yes I favour brussels sprouts, which makes me a communist or worse since G.H.W. Bush announced his dislike of them. I wonder what Joe McCarthy liked to eat.

            4. He hated broccoli, but close enough.

              I admire your civic duty at the local level, in your community. Yes, that’s where the rubber meets the road everyday of our lives.

              A bit testy and terse, it’s OK, but I agree with your principles … ✌️

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