Apple, other tech firms to support 17-year-old transgender student’s bathroom choice case

“A number of leading tech firms plan to file a brief in favor of transgender rights in a case due to be heard next month in the Supreme Court, ” Ina Fried reports for Axios.

“Apple has been among those leading the charge on the effort, along with the LGBT group Human Rights Campaign,” Fried reports. “Among the other companies that have signed on are Affirm, Box, Ebay, GitHub, IBM, Microsoft, PayPal, Salesforce, Slack, Tumblr, Yelp, Salesforce, sources said.”

Fried reports, “Facebook and Google are two big ones that have yet to sign on, but names are still being gathered and others may yet join.”

Read more in the full article here.

“In a two-page letter to public schools -on Wednesday], the Trump administration said the Obama-era directive did not provide ‘extensive legal analysis’ of how its position was consistent with Title IX,” CNN Wire reports. “The letter cited ‘significant litigation’ caused by the guidance, showing the need for “due regard” of the role of states and local school districts in shaping education policy.”

CNN Wire reports, “‘As President Trump has clearly stated, he believes policy regarding transgender bathrooms should be decided at the state level,’ the White House said in a statement. ‘The joint decision made today by the Department of Justice and the Department of Education… paves the way for an open and inclusive process to take place at the local level with input from parents, students, teachers and administrators.'”

Read more in the full article here.

“In a separate letter, the deputy solicitor general informed the Supreme Court that the guidance had been withdrawn,” CNN Wire reports. “The court is poised to consider the case of Gavin Grimm.”

“While President Trump’s administration’s new guidance may not stop the case, it could give the justices an off-ramp to send the matter back to the lower court to consider the new guidance,” CNN Wire reports. “The court could also decide to send the case back before arguments.”

Read more in the full article here.

MacDailyNews Take: Imagine how many units of a theoretical “mini tower” Mac Pro Apple could move, if they deigned to make one?

SEE ALSO:
Why Apple won’t be hurt by denouncing President Trump’s decision to rescind federal transgender bathroom guidelines – February 23, 2017
Apple condemns President Trump’s decision to rescind federal transgender bathroom guidelines – February 23, 2017
Tim Cook’s Apple: More socially responsible, less visionary – August 24, 2016
Apple’s politics may be hurting its brand – June 29, 2016
Apple objects to North Carolina law company says discriminates against LGBTs – March 28, 2016
Apple backs U.S. bill banning lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender discrimination – July 23, 2015

101 Comments

      1. Wow, for these wack jobs spewing their hate is a full time job. What’s deviant is your sordid vitriol. What don’t you all find different products to buy and go on that website??
        Meanwhile, in other news, aapl marches toward a MV of $800,000,000,000 under Steve Jobs’ personnel choice to lead the company. So, really , why don’t you f-off?

        1. It’s the TRUMP ECONOMY, stupid.
          It’s going to be so good that even some incompetent CEO’s will benefit.
          Tim Cook= Fake CEO
          Like Botnovik says, Fire Pipeline Tim and lets MAKE APPLE GREAT AGAIN!!

            1. Gee, great retort. Did that come with spittle? And are you bashful about expressing your true feelings – s for u? I don’t think mdn is that modest. I know it’s probably hard to keep your posting rules straight as I’m sure your slather your crap all over the web.
              aapl continues it’s march to $800billion under your buddy’s wing.

            1. Lots of morons as a majority doesn’t make them smart!
              You’ll pay Biff Trump his megalomaniac paranoia later on… and the bill won’t be cheap!

      2. As i said to botvinnik—and it goes for anyone who feels that Tim Cook is ruining Apple (AAPL)—sell your stock in it. Markets go up and down, but AAPL has made me a very nice profit despite what Tim Cook says or doesn’t say. Ultimately it’s a company’s fundamentals—and, to some extne its technicals—that decide where a company is going to go. So, again, if you feel that Tim is ruining Apple, then shed yourself of the stock, because the market really doesn’t give a crap what you think of Tim’s opinions.

    1. This is not an Apple issue or a Tim Cook obsession. If you had read the story, you would see that it is a concern shared throughout the Hi Tech community.

      Where do you think that Apple’s products come from? I think it is their employees. Where do you think they come from? I think it is primarily places like Palo Alto, Austin, and Cambridge where failing to take a firm line against LGBT discrimination would make recruiting impossible even in the straight community. Apple workers do not come primarily come from Hazard County KY, where the locals are waiting for coal to come back, or Lancaster County PA, where they still manufacture buggies.

      Once employees are hired because they were the best applicants for the position, these companies need to be able to deploy their workers as is best for the company, not for the outside moral crusaders who think they are perverts. They need to be able to send a transgender woman to North Carolina confident that she can safely use the bathroom. They need the reassurance that employees’ children will not be bullied in school while the administration turns a blind eye.

      This IS a major business issue for these firms, and not a distraction, whatever you may think about the morality involved. The “history of capitalism” is driven by businesses making decisions because those decisions are in their economic best interest.

      1. Fine. Then agitate for such regulations in those localities. But the Federal government has no business promulgating regulations which force everyone to unreasonably accommodate the effects of a mental illness (gender dysphoria), nor is there authority at the Federal level to do so. This is not a “civil rights” issue, no matter what its backers may say; this is a public health (mental illness) issue, and should be addressed at the State and local level.

    2. Seems to me, in this case, what Apple whats to do is their business. This is fine, it’s the way it should be. If the board of directors disagree, they can take it up with Tim. If the State decides what to do, that’s fine also. Trump is right. This is a state’s rights issue. I don’t have any problem with it being left in the hands of the people this way.

  1. If Pipeline Timmy, Social Justice Warrior extraordinaire, spent 1/10th of the time he wastes virtue signalling on actual Apple products, we’d have had new iMacs, iPads, and a saleable Apple TV on the shelves last Christmas instead of nothing today.

  2. In civilized countries bathrooms are generally unisex, a pretty easy solution. In Islamic countries and the USA, we need to have companies like Apple to fight for basic accomodations to such pseudo-ethical problems.

    Perhaps the problem with the US is that too many people are obsessed with “mini towers”?

  3. In the name of diversity, Apple CEO Tim Cook should ask his Muslim employees what they really think of him.

    Sharia teaches that homosexuality is a vile form of fornication, punishable by death. According to the Arabic grammar, homosexuality is called the worst sin. Since the resurrection of the caliphate in 2014 (the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria) dozens of homosexuals like Apple CEO Tim Cook have been thrown from rooftops to their deaths. Others have been stoned to death.

    1. I think you’re confusing Muslims with Sharia. That’s nuts. That’s like conflating the Christian people with those few Christian extremist domestic terrorists who blow up the churches and temples of other faiths.

      The Muslim engineers, designers, and marketing folks I met while working at Apple were among the gentlest, most tolerant people I have known. Your veneer of hatred belies your ignorance. Maybe travel a little. Get out of your cave and get to know some people who aren’t just like you.

      1. Not correct in your assumption Sum, Actually, Islam teaches Sharia and it’s a cornerstone of that religion. You can’t say the same about Christianity because that religion has absolutely no violent underpinnings at all. Not anywhere in Christian scripture does it condone violence. So to make your comparison is ignorant. If a Muslim says they don’t believe in Sharia Law they are not practicing their religion, if a Christian acts in violence they are not practicing their religion. Big difference.

        1. Violence found in Christian scripture:

          It is called “herem”, and it means total annihilation. Consider the Book of Samuel, when God instructs King Saul to attack the Amalekites: “And utterly destroy all that they have, and do not spare them,” God says through the prophet Samuel. “But kill both man and woman, infant and nursing child, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.”

          Not too violent?

          1. May be he is just smart enough to READ… Have you ever heard about books? There are lots of informations in there… Ho! But, perhaps you think that whatever is not in your liking is FAKE?
            Uh! That reminds me someone…

      2. BigZ,

        You don’t need a seminary degree (which I have, by the way) to know that your reply to Sum Jung Gai is totally ridiculous.

        Sure, there are passages in the Quran and Hadith that justify behavior that modern people would abhor. That’s why modern Muslims ignore those passages in favor of the general thrust of Islamic teaching.

        Same thing for Christians. I am assuming that you recognize the Old Testament as a part of Christian scripture. There are passages all over those books that condone violence. Just a few examples:

        Numbers 15:35 “And the Lord said to Moses, This man must be put to death; take him away from the tents and have all the people kill him with stones.”

        Numbers 25:5 “And Moses said to the judges of Israel, Each man slay his neighbors that made sacrifice to Baalpeor”

        Numbers 31:17 “And therefore slay all the men, whatever is of male kind, and the little children; and strangle the women who have known men fleshly [18] but you can keep for yourself the young girls and all the women who still be virgins.”

        Joshua 6:21 “And they killed all things that were in Jericho, from man unto woman, from a young child unto an old man.”

        2 Kings 2:23 “When Elisha went up thence into Bethel, little children went out of the city and scorned him, saying ‘Go up, thou bald one.” [24] And when he beheld, he cursed them in the name of the Lord and two bears went out of the forest and tore forty-two of those children to death.”

        As for the New Testament, there is a major thread that demands obedience to oppressive governments:

        Romans 13:2 “He who standeth against the powers that be standeth against God and they that stand against get to themselves damnation.”

        Titus 3:1 “Be subject to princes and to powers, to obey that which is said.”

        Christians, like Jews and Muslims, ignore those passages in favor of the general thrust of Judeo-Christian teaching (love thy neighbor, etc.). To repeat, ISIS represents 1 in 64,000 Muslims. Even throwing in a wide variety of other fundamentalists (who are fighting one another as often as not), the proportion of Muslim extremists does not greatly exceed the proportion of Christian extremists like the followers of Jim Jones and David Koresh.

        1. You’ve quoted the Old Testament, that’s before Christ fulfilled the law of Moses and brought a new beginning as the Mesiah. Christianity starts in the New Testament.

          1. Even Christ resorted to violence. Remember the temple incident.

            And don’t bother explaining the reason why He did it. I know. Isn’t relevant to the discussion and it just proves the point anyway.

        2. As long as people still will consider some scriptures as “holy”, the big mess with believes will go on and engender hate an chaos.
          In the name of some gods “love”, the worse still happens on a ridiculously small planet amongst billions.

    2. … Yet, everyone knows that religions are FAKE!
      Bunch of lies just perfect for bigots and extremists… like some narrow minded around here.
      Some stupid folks really deserve the actual paranoid pseudo-president!

  4. If they insist on being so political, it would be great if they paid any attention whatsoever to people starving in their cities, or getting kicked out of their homes because the cost of living has inflated many times over, or paid the women in their companies fairly, etc., etc., etc. They are all a bunch of maniacal hypocrites, as far as I’m concerned.

    Oh, and in Apple’s case, it sure would be nice if they’d start making good products again.

  5. ‘As President Trump has clearly stated, he believes policy regarding transgender bathrooms should be decided at the state level,’

    That’s the real issue – Democrats will settle for nothing less than complete federal control. It has nothing to do with caring about this young person, and it is shameless.

    1. There are some cases where States’ Rights are in conflict with Citizens’ Rights. In 1948, Strom Thurmond won 39 Electoral College votes. Almost his sole issue was States’ Rights—specifically, the decision of the Truman Administration to support federal legislation to prohibit lynching.

      Under the states, 30 folks had been lynched since 1940 (and as many as 4000 since 1870). Despite the doubling of U.S. population, here have only been about 15 lynchings in the 64 years since the federal law was adopted.

  6. The brutal truth is that you are a particularly vicious bigot.

    There are roughly 25,000 ISIS fighters. There are 1.6 billion Muslims, 23% of the world’s population. That is one ISIS member for every 64,000 Muslims in the world. That is almost exactly equal to the ratio of American KKK members to the U.S. population (319MM/5000). For America to discriminate against the Islamic World generally because of ISIS is like the rest of the world barring entry to Americans because they might be Klansmen.

    There are 50 Muslim-majority countries in the world. On average, they don’t treat gay folks any worse than Christian-majority developing countries. In 2006, there were 92 countries that prohibited homosexual relations, although the number was falling fast.

    Christians should not be throwing stones on this issue. In 1779, Thomas Jefferson wrote a law prescribing castration as the punishment for sodomy. That represented a liberalization of the existing Virginia laws that demanded hanging. The Virginia legislature kept the death penalty. A hundred years ago, almost 100% of the world had anti-gay laws. That world was dominated by European Christians and their colonists. Some have grown out of those attitudes. You have not.

    I would guess that most Muslim Apple employees are just fine with Tim Cook. He is just as supportive of them as of their LGBT coworkers. They aren’t about to stone him or throw him off a roof. You, on the other hand, are something else.

    1. You are using numbers! Don’t you know where they came from? Those are ARABIC numbers! MUSLIM numbers! Real, God-fearing Americans don’t use numbers and we don’t need no facts either. We got faith! And our beliefs from God, who whispers them in our ears while we are praying.

      1. I’d be interested in hearing your factual basis for alleging that 320 million people actively support a movement that aggressively recruits throughout Islam (and press-gangs men in its occupied areas) but still only has 25,000 members.

  7. Tim Cook should spend more time on fixing the problems with his products and less time worrying where someone can go to the bathroom. There have been no new ideas in years, yes that includes the watch.

    I find it interesting that all of these companies are not open to public access and therefore do not have the same issues as a public school or business where the presence of a man in a ladies bathroom causes concern.

    1. You may not have noticed that this is the United States of America, which has a written Constitution that guarantees due process and equal protection to all persons under its jurisdiction. Those individual rights trump (if you will excuse the expression) the will of the majority to suppress them. I am increasingly disgusted at all the so-called conservatives who are willing to make the classic “libtard” argument that individual rights should yield to the whims of whatever faction happens to have gained a plurality in the most recent election.

      Because I am a conservative, I support the rights of the individual. I fully support the right of people like you to express your opinions, however loathsome I may find them. I supported the right of American Nazis to hold a public march through a Jewish neighborhood, because that is what I believe the Constitution requires. I support your right of expression, but not your right to translate those opinions into policy.

      My conservatism demands that I fight back efforts by Big Government to force individuals into situations that those individuals regard not just as demeaning, but dangerous. Do you really believe that a transgender woman wearing a dress and high heels is in less danger in a men’s locker room than the other occupants of a woman’s locker room would be if she were in there instead? Do you really want your high school daughter getting dressed in front of a transgender man with a beard, deep voice, toned muscles, and a sexual interest in women? Where in the Constitution does it say that you and your faction can impose your will on even “a few wackjobs?”

      1. I hate labels. You call yourself Conservative, and I refuse to call myself one, for fear of being thought a Republican, or worse. Yet you argue the same points, from the same standpoint that I would, although much more eloquently. We need new baskets, because Red v Blue is not serving us well.

    2. Let’s not forget about the MacBook Pro. We need a MacBook Pro with useful ports and upgradable RAM. The RAM needs to be upgradable so the MacBook Pro doesn’t become useless as soon as it needs more RAM, especially since most folks don’t know how much RAM they need. I’d also like a hard drive bay (in addition to a SSD) so I don’t have to deal with the inconvenience of an external hard drive.

    1. You really don’t get it, do you? Tim doesn’t make the computers. Apple’s employees, a fair number of whom are LGBT, Muslim, or foreign-born, do that. If they (and their friends who also work at the company) are distracted by public policies that make them less effective at doing their jobs, that impacts Apple’s bottom line… which Mr. Cook has a duty to protect. How come all the folks who historically believed in free-market capitalism suddenly think that a capitalist who stands up for his company against government policies that directly harm his industry is engaging in social engineering?

      Were you complaining when Rex Tillerson, as CEO of Exxon-Mobil, stood up against environmental policies he believed were harming his industry? Of course not. The only difference is that you agree with the substance of Exxon’s corporate concerns about public policy but not the substance of Apple’s.

      1. Go explain to your 6 year old why she is sharing the bathrooms with a woman who has a dick.

        The rights of the many outweigh the rights of the few. If trannies don’t like it, they can go to the bathroom at their house.

          1. How self righteous you are. Just because babies are born all dressed up in clothes doesn’t mean that there isn’t a place for nudity.

            Quick arm your and your war mongering nation and invade invade invade until you find those WMD (Women, Men Displayed), destroy them and annihilate the population.

            Here’s proof.

            1. Actually it’s a funny sarcastic comment but I guess that went over your head.

              Interesting how you put it “BTW this statue comes from a civilization where homosexualité was pretty common!”. Maybe you could contrast this by presenting a civilization where homosexuality is totally missing. I can certainly point out a culture where a sense of humor is pretty well non-existent.

            1. D–
              I’m at least bright enough to stay away from public toilets where people are displaying their genitals to children.

              Road Warrior–
              I see your point, but in most of this country nudity is restricted to areas designated for the use of naturists. Toilets in public buildings are not one of those areas. I don’t know that I have ever seen a penis in an American rest room. I don’t look. Apparently D and his six-year old daughter do.

            2. Hey TxUser, I’m glad you got the point. From what I’ve seen of the public toilets in your country they are quite private with individual urinals but this is not the case in some places where a single trough urinal can be used by several people at one. I’ll include a sample below.

              I think it says a lot about how one approaches nudity. You point out that for your country, nudity is restricted to areas designated for the use of naturists but again this is not the case for other nations, like Germany where “there are no explicit legal regulations on clothing in Germany. Nudity on private grounds is considered as legal even if visible from outside.” (wikipedia- Clothing laws by country).

              Some cultures consider nudity not to be such a big deal, that’s their business and how you treat that situation is yours but just because someone does something one way is not a justification to determine that others should do it that way. There is a lot of diversity when it comes to this topic and a lot of options available. I hope your nation finds a viable one.

        1. “The rights of the many outweigh the rights of the few.”

          The Constitution begs to differ. “Majority rules” was never the way it worked.

          Do you also believe that “might makes right”? Because that’s exactly what the statement I quoted means.

    2. Yep. I have used Apple/Mac exclusively since 2001. I’ve probably spent 10-12k on Apple products during that time, but in done. Lecture someone else Timmy. Done with your products and lectures. Phone contract is up in June and no more iPhones for me after 4 in a row. Also on my 3 year cycle to upgrade computers. Not going to be Apple/Mac.. deleting all Apple/Mac bookmarks after this post since I won’t need any Apple/Mac news. Bye.

  8. If apple wants to build transgendered bathrooms that’s great. For the rest of the world if you’re a man use the mens restroom. If you’re a woman use the woman’s restroom.

    1. More and more restaurants and theaters, in civilized countries, have neutral toilets. Doesn’t mean men and women watch each other while pissing!
      It is clean, respectful and there’s room enough to avoid parasites.

    1. Glenn–
      The headline is a LIE. The statement was from the American College of Pediatricians, not the American College of Pediatics.

      For context, the College of Pediatricians (ACPeds) split from the College of Pediatrics (ACP) in 2002 over the issue of adoptions by gay couples. The original Pediatrics group has over 60,000 members. The Pediatrician group claims 500 members. Since a doctor could chose either group, the ACP is clearly about 120 times more credible among practicing physicians.

      The National Association of Social Workers (NASW) described ACPeds as a “small and marginal group” which was “out of step with the research-based position of the AAP and other medical and child welfare authorities.” The American College of Pediatricians has been described by the Southern Poverty Law Center as a “hate group”, with “a history of propagating damaging falsehoods about LGBT people.”

      To repeat, you are entitled to your own opinions, but not to your own facts. The ACP has not done what you claim.

    2. Pure sectarisme and bigotry.
      Do you know that almost one of 10’000 children is born with TWO sexes?
      In narrow minded countries, the doctor (sometimes without telling the parents!) makes a transgender right away after she or he noticed the “anomaly”.

      1. No bigotry at all; just science.

        In standard medical and psychological practice, a child who has a persistent, mistaken belief that is inconsistent with reality is not encouraged in his or her belief. For instance, an anorexic child is not encouraged to lose weight. She is not treated with liposuction; instead, she is encouraged to align her belief with reality – i.e., to see herself as she really is. Indeed, this approach is not just a good guide to sound medical practice. It is common sense.

        Until recently this was precisely how gender dysphoric children were treated. Dr. Kenneth Zucker, long acknowledged as one of the foremost authorities on gender dysphoria in children, spent years helping his patients align their subjective gender identity with their objective biological sex. He used psychosocial treatments (talk therapy, organized play dates, and family counseling) to treat gender dysphoria and had much success.

        Johns Hopkins had the first sex change clinic in the US. It was closed a few years ago after they saw the results of this practice. A lot of their patients returned wanting to be changed back to the original sex. They saw lots of psychological problems including suicides.

        They closed the clinic a few years ago.

        1. Somebody (maybe you?) posted the Fake News about Johns Hopkins on another thread. It wasn’t true then and still isn’t.

          Johns Hopkins stopped doing reassignment surgeries in 1979 (not exactly “a few years ago”). They announced last October that they would be resuming them because the overwhelming majority of their faculty supported the position on this issue of the American College of Pediatrics (60,000 members) and not that of the American College of Pediatricians (500 members).

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