Paul Murphy writes for LinuxInsider, “What differentiates a Mac user from a PC user, assuming the usage decision is uncoerced by an employer? My wife, a reformed PC user (always the most merciless of evangelists), answered that question with a list straight from Jeff Foxworthy:
– You think virus protection is what you get a flu shot for.
– You actually make a conscious choice in selecting your Web browser and presentation software.
– You have suppressed a smile at the sound of another user rebooting their computer for the fifth time that day.
– You dress up in a black turtleneck and jeans to go out at Halloween.
– You’ve never sworn about a service pack.
– You have a Bush-Cheney sticker on your Volvo.
“OK, one of those is a ringer — but the question itself is interesting: what individual characteristics differentiate the two communities? Listen to the people who made the PC versus Macintosh decision for themselves and it’s pretty clear that the PC people get heavily vested in their knowledge of the machine and whatever Windows variant they have or aspire to, while the Mac people tend to assume the machine and talk about what they do with it,” Murphy writes. “That’s a very big difference, but what’s behind it?”
“One idea is that the Mac user’s focus on the applications is reasonable, and that the PC people whose focus is on the machine or the OS are really suffering Stockholm Syndrome — investing in the machine and emotionally bonding with the PC community rather than the professional one defined by the application as a survival strategy for the persona,” Murphy writes.
MacDailyNews Note: See SteveJack’s seminal article “Defending Windows over Mac a sign of mental illness” for more on how Windows users suffer from Stockholm Syndrome and the related Cognitive Dissonance.
Murphy continues, “Another idea comes from A. H. Maslow’s Theory of Human Motivation (Psychology Review, 1943). His idea was that people act to satisfy the highest unmet need in a hierarchy of needs with the basic physiological needs at the bottom and self-actualization at the top. Thus, his way of looking at the difference in behavior would be to say that the Mac user’s basic physiological needs have been met — after all they can assume that the thing works — and so their focus can move to meeting self-actualization and other higher level needs more closely tied to the person’s professional interests.”
Full article here.
MacDailyNews Take: Mac OS X stays out of your way, unobtrusively allowing users to get work done, while Windows XP is constantly in your face demanding things, impeding productivity. Users who use both know this is so. Mac-only users surmise it. Windows-only users will scream bloody hell, but that doesn’t alter the truth. And Windows-to-Mac switchers will swear to this as fact in a court of law.
Well said.
The primary difference is that Mac users spend their time using application software while PC users spend their time maintaining/cursing/repairing their OS. The OS is a tool and as such should stay out of the way.
This writing the secret code word at the bottom sucks.
And then when it does not work – often- one loses all the text one wrote.
Hey I love talking about hardware, but usually in the context of how much I can do with it and how it effect my work as compared to be just a # unto itself
Is there a genetic component perhaps? Tolerance for pain? An e-virus plague affecting millions? Or are Mac users slowly evolving into large-brained, martian-like waifs who will ultimately be able to iSync telepathically?
(huh?)
Stayed tuned…
The secret code has never failed for me.
It’s necessary because there’s no moderation here. We can post whatever we like.
This means that automatic spam posting could affect this forum. It add to the size of pages and add to the bandwidth requiremens of our generous hosts. This would increase their costs and maybe they’d end up shutting down the site if it got too expensive.
So on a free site like this, the secret word is a small price to pay in the war against spammers.
what else is new 😐
You have a Bush/Cheney sticker on your volvo? WTF is she talkin about I equate Mac users with liberals, open minded people thank you.
Get out there and evangalize, people!
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Congratulations, Dave Hunwick! The first poster to start the political debate. You get a swift kick in the arse.
I’m offended. I don’t drive a Volvo, I drive a Benz.
I only use Windows because I’m paid to. In my own time I use a Mac.
But those appreciate performance and build quality use a G5 and drive a BMW.
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Liberal & conservative labels do not seem relative Mac users. For instance, both Al Gore and rush Limbaugh are Mac users.
As a full time home/office Mac user – I spend my time looking for a good OSX alternative to Office!
iggyB relax it was kind of a fun jab I thought. Not to be taken too seriously.
Why do ECT publish Mac vs PC articles on LinuxInfiltrator, after all they publish the more appropriate titles MacNewsWorld and TechNewsWorld?
Hey Dave,
I’m pretty sure the Bush/Cheney/Volvo quip was a joke. A Volvo would typically be a car a liberal would drive. Having a Bush/Cheney sticker on the car would be strange, or odd and different from the norm. You know, they’d Think Different. That’s my take anyway, I could be wrong.
Regarding “Word Image Sucks” problem with the secret code image in the post area and the possibility of losing all your text if it doesn’t work… A trick I used back in the day when I would often lose my text in crappy forums that didn’t work right was to type my ramblings in TextEdit, then copy and paste it into the webpage. If the webpage forum eats and loses your post, then you can just copy and paste it again from TextEdit.
Or, after you’ve typed up your post in the webpage, select all then copy and paste your message into TextEdit right before you submit, that way you’ll have a backup in case the post doesn’t take.
I build my own computers. I only run XP Pro. Never a problem if you know what you are doing.
I built and drive a 1968 Camaro RS/SS 502 Crate 775HP street legal. Bring me that BMW dweeb…
Ah! fun jab! I guess it is I who deserves the swift kick in the arse.
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Muddy Mudskipper, you dirty boy. It’s obvious that you like tinkering with hardware while Mac users use their hardware to complete a task.
Example, while you’re busy building your XP Pro dream machine, I’m using my Mac to make money. Example #2, while you’re trying to fix the idle problem on your Camaro, I’m cruising down the expressway.
You have illustrated the points of the article perfectly. Thank you.
Never a problem if you know what you are doing
Unfortunately, most Windows users don’t know what they’re doing. I run into them almost everyday.
To be perfectly honest, I kind of miss not having to check Windows Update or run scans or do daily maintenance.
I value my time more and more. When I get a PC virus at 5:30pm when I’m trying to get home from work, I don’t leave until an hour or so later trying expunge the freaking virus from my machine. My employer loses productivity from me, and my family gets pissed because I’m not around.
When I use my Mac, I don’t have that problem. I get my work done faster, better, and without the unpredicatable delays of getting some peice of malware on my computer at the most inopportune times.
Don’t need to make money with my PC, other than checking my stocks, and I never have to “fix” the idle on my RS/SS, it’s perfect the first time. Everytime.
See you in my rear view mirror “me”.
“- You have a Bush-Cheney sticker on your Volvo.”
Rediculous.
a) You have an Apple sticker.
b) You certainly don’t drive anything as ugly as a Volvo.
Then there’s those of us old-timers who have the “I’d rather be driving a Macintosh” bumper sticker…
(Reference: Back in 1984, Apple had a “test drive a Macintosh” promotion where you could ‘rent’ a Mac for a month to try it out.)
Well, as a staunch Republican, I guess I should stop using the Mac since I’m apparently not “open-minded.” I guess I’ll go buy my PC later today… Windows here I come.
What I’ve found is that the difference between Mac users and PC users is simple and straightforward:
Software versus hardware.
Fun example, from a PC using friend: Years ago, when CD-ROM drives were a new thing, my friend spent a weekend installing a CD-ROM drive into his PC. He had to figure out all the PC things that you had to do, install the drivers, etc. etc. He had a good time doing it and by Sunday night, he had a working CD-ROM drive in his PC. On Monday, he told me all about his adventure installing the CD-ROM drive.
This guy also had a Mac that he played around with (the company he worked for had both, so he had snagged a Mac from work) and he decided to see what installing a CD-ROM drive was like. So, next weekend, he took the Apple SCSI CD-ROM drive home, plugged it into the Mac, and it worked. So he threw in a bunch of CDs and played around. On Monday, he old me about some of the cool CDs he’d checked out over the weekend.
This was actually his epiphany, “Because the hardware is so easy, Mac users like cool software. PC users like cool hardware, even if they never get a chance to do anything with it.”
I remember a statistic someplace–I wish I could find it–that Mac users buy more software than PC users. There was another old, but similar, statistic from years ago that Mac users use more software than PC users.
But, generally speaking, Mac users don’t care as much about hardware. Mac users want to do cool things and that means software.
Muddy, while I’m sure your Camaro is “street legal”, I’m sure it isn’t environmentally ethical, given all the combustion compromises necessary to burn that much fossil fuel to generate that much horsepower. Wow, I’m soooooo impressed.
Ronnie when you fall; remember we all said, “have a nice trip.”
I would love to see a Gore Limbaugh joint commercial. Mac: the obvious choice for the right or left. In fact you could have a whole series of “oposites” who use macs.
“b) You certainly don’t drive anything as ugly as a Volvo.”
I’d take a Volvo S70 over any BMW and most Mercedes models. Then again, I run Mac OS X and Windows XP without any problems.
I use both Mac and Windows – I dont consider myself to be split between the two. I am the same user on both machines. This article, whislt amusing, is nonsense. In terms of Maslows Heirarchy of Needs, users of both platforms are already at the top of the pile. Is MacOSX better designed, more stable, more advanced and more enjoyable to use: Yes. Is there some psychological difference amongst PC and Mac users: No. If you want to get into the innards of a Mac there is a lot more to play with than a PC. I am really enjoying learning Unix on my PowerBook lately. Can Windows allow me to get my work done, without hassle: yes sir. If there is something that genuinely differentiates Mac from PC users I would suggest it is that Mac users constantly obses about how good their machines are, wheras PC users just get on with it (viruses permitting …), they are just computers for Christs sake. Get over it.
Make that the Volvo C70.
Dave Hunwick wrote:
“… I equate Mac users with liberals, open minded people thank you.”
What a closed-minded thing to say. Perhaps you’re confusing “open-minded” with “opinionated,” but closed-mindedness prevents you from see that opinionated people inhabit all areas of the political spectrum. As do Mac users.
I have an Apple sticker on my WRX…. it makes it go even faster.
“- You have a Bush-Cheney sticker on your Volvo.”
Geez, can’t you guys read – he said ONE of those was a RINGER.
“I’d take a Volvo S70 over any BMW and most Mercedes models. […] Make that the Volvo C70.”
Eh. It’s pretty boring/conventional.
I’ll admit, I prefer roadsters to four-seaters. The C70 looks pretty standard. I’ll admit, I like it better than any of the BMWs or Mercedes four-seaters. But it isn’t a “Wow! Gotta have it!” design. But the Mercedes SLK-350 looks really good–again, though, it’s sort of unfair comparison.
Freeman Thomas, the guy who designed the Audi TT and is currently at DaimlerChrysler, is the Jonathan Ives of the automobile industry.
The Consumer Report’s 2005 New Car Buying Guide states that most 2005 models of BMW, Mercedes, Volvo, and Volkswagen are reliability nightmares. The best rated luxury cars were Lexus and Acura. I guess we need to change our car analogy.
Oh, and muddy mudskipper, enjoy your crappy Chevy and your crappy Windows box. Hopefully your Camaro is as fast as you say so you can get the hell out of here quicker.
‘Bush-Cheney sticker on a Volvo’
What an idiot.
Everyone knows those stickers only stick to pick-up tailgates.
Dave Hunwick
I equate Mac users with liberals, open minded people thank you.
As a non-liberal, I hate to tell you that many other non-liberals consider “liberals” to be anything but open minded. I find many professed liberals or “progressives” or whatever you want to call them speak about “tolerance” in one breath and refer to their political opposition as “neo cons” “religeous biggots” “hicks” “rednecks” and “gun totin’ country music listening hillbillies.”
I honestly have not found liberals to be very open minded when talking to a non-liberal. Maybe you’ve had different experiences than me, who knows, but I know my experiences are not unique. Hollywood, which admittedly may not be a very good barometer of what general liberals act or think like, tends to be very rude and disrespectful towards conservatives, republicans, and people of faith.
I know many of the crude comments go both ways, but when I see the statements from mainstream liberal politicians, actors, and other public figures, I see a lot more disrespect from the left than the right. Maybe because I’m bias, but I don’t think so.
I will agree that Mac users are not all republicans or majority, nor do they all drive volvos. So I grant you that. But there are many conservatives and republicans who enjoy computers that work. I don’t think it’s a political thing either way.
Uncle Rat
Ronnie when you fall; remember we all said, “have a nice trip.”
What an assinine statement from an ass. Proves my point perfectly. Thanks.
Bennn
they are just computers for Christs sake. Get over it.
There will always be people that obsess over one thing or another, whether it be sports teams, cars, kitchen knives, clothes, shoes, purses, you name it. Since a lot of people spend a lot of their lives in front of their computers, why should those be any different?
Al
Everyone knows those stickers only stick to pick-up tailgates.
Thanks Al, another ignorant comment proving my point. Maybe I was more right than I realised. Are there any truly open-minded liberals out there?
C’mon let’s hear from some of them.
I love my Macs…and my Bush/Cheney sticker on my XTerra SUV. Macs aren’t the tool of the left…it just seems that way.
My pickup doesn’t have a tailgate or a Bush-Cheney sticker. It does have two Apple stickers. I view it as the best analogy (car-wise) to my Mac. I once saw someone putting 2×4’s into their BMW trunk…now THAT was funny! My truck works, and works well. Occasionally it will get a little beat up, but it keeps working well. I’ve hauled trailers, cement block, and yes, it’s even served as a hearse when grandparents passed away far from home, saving the family thousands. It takes everything I throw at it in stride. My Mac does the same thing. I was approached, half way through reading these comments, by my boss who wanted me to check out the Symantec window that popped up on his screen. Yep, he had had a virus. He wanted to know if I’d seen that message. Uh, no.
treadlightly
I was approached, half way through reading these comments, by my boss who wanted me to check out the Symantec window that popped up on his screen.
You’re lucky he didn’t ask you what the hell you were doing posting on this message board on company time. lol
twilightmoon
What I dislike more than anything is having people stick a label on me, thus relegating me to a pre-conceived category so that they can either dismiss me as one of the enemy or accept me into their tribe of group think. What self-respecting person would surrender his integrity and individuality and more importantly, the independence of his own mind, to identify with a particular group?
The fact is I am conservative about some things and liberal about others and I suspect that is true of most people.
P.S. How ironic: My password is “respect”.
Let’s see, I drive a Dodge Ram truck with an Apple sticker on the back window. Sorry though, I don’t have a Bush/Cheney sticker (although I did actually vote for Bush) or even a gun rack anywhere in my truck. So I guess I’m not your stereotypical Mac user, but the last time I checked, part of being a “free thinker” was not to fall for or believe all of the typical stereotypes. It’s really funny that those who proclaim to be so open minded are usually the ones who in reality are usually the least so.
There is no difference between Mac users and PC users.. basically as a result of their pleasant experience with Macs, Mac users are more optimistic and curious about technology, whereas PC users.. having already put the money down for the PC, must defend his/her decision, while inwardly frustrated and irritated, only comforted by the assumption that ,’If Macs had a better marketshare, they’d be hacked daily too…’
With no Mac users around to dispute their inner thoughts, they feel good about their buying decision..
And even if something goes wrong.. you can always turn on CNN to hear about the latest MS Windows patch.. you don’t need a 1-800 help line..
Of course.. that says nothing of the technological and superiority of the Mac which you simply cannot fathom if you’ve never used one..
It just makes sense that the rich guys would have the better product right..?
Right..??
Muddy Mudskipper wrote:
“I build my own computers. I only run XP Pro. Never a problem if you know what you are doing.
I built and drive a 1968 Camaro RS/SS 502 Crate 775HP street legal. Bring me that BMW dweeb…”
1) the problem is that a GREAT DEAL of Windows users DON’T know what they’re doing. they just get a ‘puter and go with no idea on how to maintain it. that’s how and why so many viruses get spread.
2) while i have no doubt that your ’68 Camaro might edge ahead of the Bimmer “dweeb” on a straightaway it will most likely find itself embarking upon an “Agricultural Excursion” when it encounters its first curve whilst the BMW will deftly navigate the change in direction and accelerate away in much the same manner that Windows chokes on malware and Mac OS X remains undercontrol and unaffected.
treadlightly,
And what State would you be from that your State laws would allow you to transport human remains in your pick-up truck….. utter BS.
“while i have no doubt that your ’68 Camaro might edge ahead of the Bimmer “dweeb” on a straightaway it will most likely find itself embarking upon an “Agricultural Excursion” when it encounters its first curve whilst the BMW will deftly navigate the change in direction and accelerate away in much the same manner that Windows chokes on malware and Mac OS X remains undercontrol and unaffected.”
Yeah, thats if the Beemmer ever catches it before the turn. Much the same manner that Mac OS Has been playing catchup for years….
Fun example, from a PC using friend: Years ago, when CD-ROM drives were a new thing, my friend spent a weekend installing a CD-ROM drive into his PC. He had to figure out all the PC things that you had to do, install the drivers, etc. etc. He had a good time doing it and by Sunday night, he had a working CD-ROM drive in his PC. On Monday, he told me all about his adventure installing the CD-ROM drive.
Yeah, Id like to see you install a new cd rom in your G5…Have fun with that my friend..At least we dont have to send shit to the OEM just to get a friggin 50 dollar part replaced…
“The fact is I am conservative about some things and liberal about others and I suspect that is true of most people.”
While I agree, and would add myself to that group, I think it means that sometimes people are not realistic about the whole that they are looking for.
I’m reminded of a letter to the editor I read after George Bush Sr. was elected in 1988. The letter said, “Contrary to popular belief, the American people are not stupid. We elected a congress that said, ‘You can have all the social programs you want.’ and we elected a president that said, ‘…and you won’t have to pay for it!’ Sounds like a good deal to me.” Of course, in 1992, one of the biggest complaints against the Bush administration was “gridlock”–gee, we couldn’t understand why these people couldn’t give us something for nothing.
Some of my friends have this “liberal spending, conservative taxes” point-of-view and they still don’t understand why it doesn’t work…
i think once the Camaro runs off the road there should be no problem catching up to it… much like the current state of the Windows OS. don’t get me wrong… i think most people will use the tool that suits them best. i just don’t understand why they’ll continue to hit themselves on the thumb with a hammer… then blame the hammer.
and Mac OS caught up a long time ago… once it went *NIX/BSD.
NoMacForYou,
check out: http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=86812
NoMacForYou wrote:
“Yeah, Id like to see you install a new cd rom in your G5…Have fun with that my friend..At least we dont have to send shit to the OEM just to get a friggin 50 dollar part replaced…”
that didn’t make any sense… my “friend”. why would i want to install a cd-rom into a machine…. THAT ALREADY HAS A FUNCTIONING COMBO OR SUPERDRIVE?! besides, i could just get an external drive and FireWire it in… and it works. ta-daaa.
what is it with some folks need to take apart a perfectly fine machine and muck about with it… oh… wait… nevermind.
” Id like to see you install a new cd rom in your G5…Have fun with that my friend”
I don’t do hardware. Hell, I’m the only person I know who ever injured themselves adding memory! (I was adding memory to a Macintosh II and, somehow, managed to cut my fingers on the SIMMs. I figured I had the first Mac with copper interconnects…) :^)
Seriously, though, I wouldn’t be that concerned. I’d either buy a FireWire or USB 2.0 CD-ROM drive.
“At least we dont have to send shit to the OEM just to get a friggin 50 dollar part replaced…”
Neither do we.
My old PowerMac G3 had a problem with the ethernet adapter on the motherboard. Apple wanted $800 to replace the motherboard. Since I only needed it to talk to my cable modem, I went and got a $20 10Mbit ethernet card. Stuck it in my Mac and it worked perfectly. I didn’t even have to install funky drivers–plug and play.
nice link Sizewell.
People People,
We are get off the point here. All you have nice cars in a way. But some of you over pay for your car ( Acura and Lexus) and some wasted money on some car (Camaro and XTerra).Who cares!!! When that old lady runs right to your cars now they worth about the same as a Yugo.So who really cares what you drive as long you get to point A to B. Oh by the way the guy with the Camaro you build the wrong motor for that car and using a crate motor is a big no no. You should have use a 327 block if it is a 327 bore out good for you . Chevy runs better with a smaller motor and bigger horse for the weight and for me I use to eat rat motors for lunch and dinner. I own a Dodge Challenger 440 6 Pack RT/SE (only 750 HP) and drive daily in my 2003 Ecilpse it not much but get me were I need to go and I use my hard earn money on getting a better life for when I retired and far as the two nuts in office. We the people are in trouble !!!!!!
it seems NoMacForYou doesn’t really know or understand what he’s talking about and is looking for a flame war. easier just to agree with him and he’s happy.
(speaking slowly)
“Oh, gee, you’re right. We Mac users couldn’t possibly replace any parts in our Macs because it’s too expensive/difficult. You got us there!”
(now, everyone smile at him and nod….)
By the way, I was told that my 20 inch iMac G5 just arrived by fedex at my doorstep this morning. It’s too bad I won’t get to use it until I get back into the States on the 20th.
I have seen the internals and this machine and it is truly a work of art. Stop into an Apple store sometime.. you will be impressed. I someone can’t change out all the parts that Apple says are replaceable, then I think they would also have trouble turning on a lightswitch. (Even my girlfriend thought it was amazing, and she has absolutly NO interest in hardware or technology in general.)
IHATEHELL has a point. some people like to tweak, some people like to drive. it’s all good… do what ya wanna do.
personally… i like to drive.
Peter “Apple wanted $800 to replace the motherboard”
My Point exactly
Gravity – “THAT ALREADY HAS A FUNCTIONING COMBO OR SUPERDRIVE”
Not all machines are as perfect as yours MY FRIEND.(Take a grammer class)
Sizewell – Check out gsx.apple.com – Oh Wait, you dont have access.
if computers are a tool, isn’t the old saying “a good tradesman never blames his tools?”
why the heck is linuxinsider have an article about Mac and Windows? too many people are off tangent in america.
NoMacForYou wrote:
“Not all machines are as perfect as yours MY FRIEND.(Take a grammer class)”
do i really have to point this one out?
and no, not all machines are as perfect as mine… thank you for the compliment!
NoMacForYou
Yeah, thats if the Beemmer ever catches it before the turn. Much the same manner that Mac OS Has been playing catchup for years….
If by “playing catchup” you mean trying to catchup to the PC in terms of # of users, then yes, the Mac is far behind.
Much in the same way that the # of humans on the planet lags far behind the # of cockroaches.
I guess you like being one of the cockroaches.
if computers are a tool, isn’t the old saying “a good tradesman never blames his tools?”
true dat.
NoMacForYou wrote:
“(Take a grammer class)”
Misspelling ‘grammar’ while criticizing someone else’s command of it…
priceless…
NoMacForYou,
I guess I missed your point… why would I ever need or want to go to gsx.apple.com?
Do you want to clarify for me and the rest of us?
There is another old saying “If you cant take a shit, then get off the toilet”
trippah
if computers are a tool, isn’t the old saying “a good tradesman never blames his tools?”
And a corollary to that, a good tradesman has good tools.
Mac people use their computers.
PC people are used by their computers.
To “NoMacForYou”
I too would build my own XP Pro system. I too knew enough to keep it running clean. This meant playing the Windows equivalent of “Whack-a-Mole” on an almost weekly basis – because I *knew* what I was doing and could recognize a new and unwanted system process when it was introduced. I *knew* how to edit registry to customize my XP box. And I knew how to choose the best components to build my bleeding edge power box… and you know what? I sold it and bought a 1.8 iMac G5!
Sure, my XP box was a screamer – more power and speed than I probably could ever want – but it also sounded like a refridgerator sitting in my living room. The case had no less than 6 fans (if you include them all – including the one on the video card) and the CD drives would make their share of noise too as they spin up and wind down during use.
By contrast, my iMac G5 purrs on my desktop – barely audible. The DVD burner makes an almost silent whooshing sound while being used and I can honestly say I’ve never heard audible evidence that this computer even has a hard drive – no clicking, no ticking… nothing! No, I didn’t build my iMac – but I *did* have Apple build one with my configuration. I didn’t (have to) install the operating system from scratch – but it didn’t come with a ton of useless software like my sister-in-law’s Dell did. There’s no mistaking the quality of components in that 2″ thick wafer of a computer.
You wanna compare computers to cars? Well, while your hot rod of a Camaro is loudly rumbling through the streets and you’re feeling every bump in the road, my vehicle of choice has a pleasant “thump” when you close the doors, starts and runs like a quiet dream, and gives me a smooth ride that beats anything else on the market in its price range.
well, NoMacForYou has proven one thing…. he is able to use the word “shit” in more than one sentence. he’s a literary genius!
NoMac, it would be criminal, just criminal, for me to have a battle of wits with someone so ill prepared for the task such as yourself so i shall bid you adeiu.
but do take this heartfelt advice;
before you attempt critisism on a given subject it would be in your best interest to have some knowlege on the subject you are critizing. not having sufficient information can make you look like an ass.
and in case you didn’t understand, “adeiu” is fancy French talk for
GOODBYE.
twilightmoon: I second everything you’ve written in this thread! I too find that republicans are much more open-minded today about changing the way the government operates in this country. democrats may have been that way back in the 60’s. I was a democrat through 1991, and there are still issues where I identify more with the democrats but I have been severely turned off during these last 6 years as their public representatives and key speakers have become less and less open-minded and more and more intolerant and disrespectful towards those who differ in thought from them.
but back to macs, it’s clear that both conservatives and liberals use macs, so it’s a point of commonality. can we celebrate that instead?
Sizewell, don’t show your ignorance. Sheesh. Across state lines. The funeral home prepared the body, placed it in a body bag, included the necessary paperwork, placed it all on a gurney and loaded it in my truck. In the next state, I pulled up to the garage at the other funeral home and they unloaded it. It is the exact same process used when a funeral home delivers a body from one location to the next. It’s really not that big a deal, you just have to know something, which you apparently don’t.
Republicans are hypocrites if they uses Macs. How can you support governmental policies which would strengthen the Microsoft monopoly when it would make your computer useless? If I was a Republican, I would use PCs with the hope that my retarded economic ideas would become mainstream.
Microsoft is A REASON to vote Democrat. If you are against monopolies, then the Republican party is not for you. Apple is very liberal as a company, always have been. Steve is a Democrat, why do you think he put Al Gore on the board of directors?
I’m not saying that Macs are an exclusively liberal thing, but I’d feel safe making the assumption that the vast majority of Mac users are liberals. Macs mainly used for music, video, and graphic design. Artistic, or “differnt thinking” people tend to be liberal. Educated people tend to be liberal. Upper middle class people tend to be liberal. Apple users tend to be creative, educated, uppermiddle class people.
I’m an IT consultant who defends Windows networks from malware attacks. I can’t bad-mouth Windows in front of clients, so I keep silent and let folks come to their own conclusions when I connect a Mac to an infection-ravaged Windows network to bring it back under control.
“Peter ‘Apple wanted $800 to replace the motherboard’
My Point exactly”
I think I missed this. You’re saying that Dell/HP/Compaq/Gateway/Lenovo wouldn’t charge $800 to replace the motherboard of an out-of-warranty computer? I’ll admit that I don’t know what any of them would charge for a new motherboard. Are you saying that you could go get a brand new motherboard from Joe’s Vinyl Siding & Motherboards for less than $800? If that’s the case, I agree wholeheartedly. A quick and ignorant look at TigerDirect showed motherboards running from $39 to around $250.
But, again, I’m a bit lost. In my example, most of which you chopped (possibly because it made you look bad), I pointed out that I didn’t need to send my motherboard to Apple to get the ethernet adapter replaced. A PC user could probably do the same thing I did–go buy another ethernet adapter (and battle with Windows to get it to work). Or they could go out and buy a new motherboard for less than sending it to Apple. But the new motherboard will probably cost more than the $50 we were talking about, and the motherboard doesn’t come with a CPU (so you’ll have the move the CPU over yourself).
If your complaint is that Apple doesn’t let you build the computer yourself (which is likely, since you seem to like to build computers), I guess I missed your point. I agree with you that it’s kind of sad that Apple won’t sell the motherboards and let you build your own computer. But considering how many people buy computers rather than build them, this seems like a pretty smart business strategy.
By the way, if you want to build your own Mac, check out Hard Core Mac. Pick yourself up a motherboard ($495), an ATI Video Card ($266), a Tower ($85), and an ATA hard drive ($113), and a combo drive ($20) and go to town.
You can have a dual 1GHz G4 for $979.
“[…] why do you think he put Al Gore on the board of directors?”
Well, if he put Al Gore on the board of directors because he’s a democrat, I think Apple shareholders should be offended.
It’s more likely that he put Al Gore on the board of directors because one of his “accomplishments” (I put it in quotes only because I’m sure the Republicans would debate it) was to streamline and improve the way the government purchases items such as computers. Since he came up with the system, he would know how Apple should use it if they want to sell computers to the federal government.
A dieu means literally, “To God”.. so it’s likely something you say before you kill someone.. LOL
Mac users remind me of rich people who have really nice fast cars (V8, V12..etc) yet drive 10km/h under the speed limit. Firstly they don’t know what makes their own car go brrroooom, secondly they don’t even know how to utilise their car to its maximum potential. They might as well go drive a 4 cyl car.
I’ve asked many mac users if they know or use fbsd. Most of the response I hear is, “WHAT? I don’t like Windows.”
Don’t get me wrong, osx is an advanced os, but it sure does attract alot of rich foolish spoon fed users. I mean come on, some people even make their baby after Apple. God help them!
mke wrote:
“…it’s likely something you say before you kill someone.. LOL”
ah! someone who appreciates fancy French talk! i salute you!
C ya.
I’ve asked many mac users if they know or use fbsd. Most of the response I hear is, “WHAT? I don’t like Windows.”
Don’t get me wrong, osx is an advanced os, but it sure does attract alot of rich foolish spoon fed users.
—-
rich foolish spoon fed users? Perhaps you’ve forgotten who’s supposed to wear the pants in the technology-user relationship..
windows pushes its users around like hapless slaves.. is that a good thing? why users have to be geniuses in computing? why can they just go about their lives.. props to those who use a mac without knowing what fbsd is (an arrogant question to ask anyone, if not downright elitist, not to mention geeky)..
don’t get where the rich thing comes in.. my mac cost me a grand.. pfft im a student here..
Actually mine was just the W ’04 sticker on the back of my S60 R. Likewise for my friend’s XC 70.
Kmark
<i>twilightmoon: I second everything you’ve written in this thread! I too find that republicans are much more open-minded today about changing the way the government operates in this country. democrats may have been that way back in the 60’s. I was a democrat through 1991, and there are still issues where I identify more with the democrats but I have been severely turned off during these last 6 years as their public representatives and key speakers have become less and less open-minded and more and more intolerant and disrespectful towards those who differ in thought from them.
but back to macs, it’s clear that both conservatives and liberals use macs, so it’s a point of commonality. can we celebrate that instead?<i>
Wow.. words well spoken of wisdom, brought a tear to my eye… *sniff*
1. Democrats on a national level held far too much power for far too long, holding both houses of congress for over 30 years. That will corrupt any party. The republicans held the white house during most of that period, but the president can only hold office for 2 terms or 8 years, so there is far less of an opportunity for corruption in that amount of time than a 30 year congressman.
2. I appreciate some of what Democrats try to do, for example keeping privacy rights. Corporations are selling our medical, financial, and other personal histories behind our backs without our consent. Republicans are too tied to corporate interests to intervene here. Unfortunately there are a variety of reasons I cannot stand the Democratic party so I have to cede this issue, sadly. I’m not claiming the Republicans are perfect, but they don’t tend to upset or offend me as badly or as often.
3. Macs are owned by Republicans, Democrats, liberals, conservatives, libertarians, neo cons, whacko liberals, bible thumpers, athiests, right wing nutjobs, tree hugging hippie libs, and all manner of suit and tie wearing, and tshirt and jeans types of persons, both young and old, male and female. Macs are like a comfortable pair of shoes: when you have to be on your feet all day, you want them to fit right and support your feet. PCs are like a bargain pair you got for cheap but you pay more for them in the end. Anyone can appreciate good shoes.
Vince
I’m not saying that Macs are an exclusively liberal thing, but I’d feel safe making the assumption that the vast majority of Mac users are liberals. Macs mainly used for music, video, and graphic design. Artistic, or “differnt thinking” people tend to be liberal. Educated people tend to be liberal. Upper middle class people tend to be liberal. Apple users tend to be creative, educated, uppermiddle class people.
1. Assuming what you say is true, and I’m not certain that it is, you’re talking like maybe at most 45% to 55% skew, not quite what I’d call “vast” difference from conservative to liberal.
2. I also think it matters how you define “conservative” versus “liberal.” Are you talking about taxation? Economic policies? Policies towards gays, or animal rights or the environment? I think you’d find that few people are monolithically conservative or liberal. I don’t have a problem with those that are, as long as they respect the views of people who disagree with them.
3. Voting for a political party because of your views of Mac or PC is childish. First, Democrats are not monolithically in favor of Apple or opposed to MS, and Republicans don’t all love MS or hate Apple. As has been stated earlier you can find people on both sides. I go back to my shoes analogy.
Peter
Since he came up with the system, he would know how Apple should use it if they want to sell computers to the federal government.
I actually don’t have a problem with Apple putting Gore on their board. I think it was a smart move, even tho I’m not a big fan of him personally. I just don’t like how they use him (a liberal democrat) and not Rush Limbaugh (a conservative republican). I think Apple should use every tool at their disposal to sell more Macs. I think ideology cost them marketshare here.
The problem is Apple Computer hasn’t evangelized enough to get the message across to zillions of PC users that there is a much better computing environment.
Oh, how I wish Apple wouldn’t be too modest about it. Many PC users need to be rescued from Windoze grasps.
“I just don’t like how they use him (a liberal democrat) and not Rush Limbaugh (a conservative republican).”
Well, if Rush does more than pontificate (ie, rewrites government purchasing rules), I’m sure they would. I’m not trying to belittle Rush Limbaugh, but other than being a famous commentator, what has he done?
Tom Cruise is also a huge Mac fan, as are Nicole Kidman, Matthew Broderick, Sarah Jessica Parker, and Jennifer Jason-Leigh. Should Apple “use” them? Apple dropped AppleMasters (which I think was a shame–it made WWDC even better!) and I do think that they should have included Rush Limbaugh, though they did include Tom Clancy…
The other comment I’ve heard, regarding Rush Limbaugh and Apple, asked why they never did a Rush Limbaugh “Think Different” poster. But keep in mind that the people on the posters were chosen by Apple employees so if none of them chose Rush, he wouldn’t be there. Considering Apple’s location, I’m not surprised if no one voted for him.
How do they “use” Al Gore?
in response to trippah’s arrogance, elitist style, your comments are well said, mike.
these peecee users go about “brandishing” their knowledge of their computers because knowing the innards of their machines is just about the only thing they can do to keep them sane.
we mac users spend more time doing our own things without having to worry about spywares, viruses and name it all..those junks that afflict peecees everywhere.
God help the helpless.
What’s a virus?
Back to my original question treadlightly….. which state(s)?
I hate showing my ignorance, so I’d like to educate myself on the respective states statutes.
I use both Apple and PC hardware, Mac OS X, WinXP and Linux.
I think the sugestion that PC Users focus on hardware while Mac Users focus on working is totaly untrue !
What about always thinking “Is this think can work on a Mac ?”
The way you say Mac is better than PC is the same way to say Fashism is better than Democracy. I assum that democracy is harder to maintain that fashism, but you have one think called CHOICE !
So, you can work on Mac, or PC, whatever you like, but don’t try to say one is better than the other, it’s just different.
The way people think “A PC crash 5 times per day” is the same untrue that other people think “With a Mac you can’t do everythink you want”.
And for the end, I drive an Alfa Romeo, without any stickers, and I’m proud of this !
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PS: Sorry for my poor English gramar…
But… I like working on Mac !
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Peter
Well, if Rush does more than pontificate (ie, rewrites government purchasing rules), I’m sure they would. I’m not trying to belittle Rush Limbaugh, but other than being a famous commentator, what has he done?
I gather from your post that you are not a fan of Rush, which is fine, and maybe you’re a fan of Gore, which is also fine. But Apple lost an opportunity to gain marketshare and sales. That is my point, not whether you or I or anyone at Apple likes Rush or Gore.
As to your question what Rush has done, if you were objective on the subject, you’d have to acknowledge that single handedly transforming AM talk radio, gathering a loyal 15-20 million listener base to a “dead medium” being the number one listened to talk radio host in American history, and challenging and ultimately transforming the way that a lot of America looks at the media is a pretty big deal. AM talk radio is often used as a punching bag by liberal Democrats who used to have a lock on the media (and still do on TV and many newspapers and national magazines). Being the voice of the forgotten conservative right is a big deal to some people. Maybe not to you, which is fine. It really doesn’t matter. What matters is Rush has a big audience and he can help sell things, and Apple did not take advantage of it for ideological reasons.
I think that was a big mistake.
Tom Cruise is also a huge Mac fan, as are Nicole Kidman, Matthew Broderick, Sarah Jessica Parker, and Jennifer Jason-Leigh. Should Apple “use” them? Apple dropped AppleMasters (which I think was a shame–it made WWDC even better!) and I do think that they should have included Rush Limbaugh, though they did include Tom Clancy…
Yes, yes, yes, yes, and yes. Apple should happily use any and all comers. Apple should not shy away from anyone who can help get them more sales. I don’t know why they dropped Apple Masters, was that at the WWDC? If so that’s not exactly aimed at the mainstream, but I think they should have kept it if it helped get more developers to the platform or more people excited about developing Apps on the Mac, or going to the WWDC.
Apple can and should promote their wares any and every which way that they can. They have a very compelling product at a very fair price and the market is ripe for the picking. Many people are fed up with Windows PCs but are not properly educated as the the suitability of Mac OS X.
Celebrities are a fantastic way to get the message out.
The other comment I’ve heard, regarding Rush Limbaugh and Apple, asked why they never did a Rush Limbaugh “Think Different” poster. But keep in mind that the people on the posters were chosen by Apple employees so if none of them chose Rush, he wouldn’t be there. Considering Apple’s location, I’m not surprised if no one voted for him.
Personally, I don’t care if Rush was included in that campaign, although I seem to remember a lot of the people that were were either liberal or democrats, John Lennon (liberal), Martin Luther King Jr. (democrat), etc. I can’t help but think that the direction this was pushed was by liberal democrats who work for Apple or for their advertising company Chiat/Day. Honestly I don’t have a problem with this so much, it’s fine if Apple wants to target people who are more sympathetic to liberal or democratic figures, I just think that they should not shy away from people who are admired by republicans or conservatives.
Surely you don’t think that everyone working for Apple is a liberal democrat?
Even if they were, not all their customers are, and Apple should not be about itself, it should be about serving it’s customers’ needs and attracting more of them.
Totophe
PS: Sorry for my poor English gramar…
I always give a pass to those who learn English as a secondary language to their main language, Totophe. And thank you for your post.
Let me suggest, however, that you consider typing out your posts in TextEdit (to take advantage of it’s spelling checker)? Then you won’t misspell Fascism, assume, everything or grammar. It won’t help you with wrong word choices like “think” instead of “thing.” Copy and paste your results back into the window when you’re done. I do this myself most of the time.
Always feel free to contribute if you have something to say, and let the reader determine if what you’re saying is worth listening to, based on content rather than perfect English.
<i>my iMac G5 purrs on my desktop – barely audible.<i>
Nice. Unfortunately mine still has a whining overtone after replacing the midplane assembly and I’ll do that again or whatever it takes ’til it’s quieter. The display’s perfect, which is why I opted for replacing the midplane rather than doing a full DOA replacement. Even while I’m typing this now I can tell how it would sound without the whine and I’ll be quite satisfied with the system once that’s gone.
Btw, sizewell, replacing the midplane isn’t as trivial as turning on a lightswitch. I wouldn’t recommend it for someone who’s “rough/clumsy/careless with hardware, or naively intimidated by it, and we all know people like that. But the lightswitch is still safe with them.
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. . .
Dead right what you wrote about the MDN Magic Word, hywel. And the automatic spam postings had been noticeably increasing for the last month or two. For anyone who’s having too much trouble with the word maybe that’s a sign not to post here it?
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<i>my iMac G5 purrs on my desktop – barely audible<i>
Nice. Mine still has a whiny overtone even after replacing the midplane assembly (which btw, Sizewell, isn’t quite as trivial as turning on a lightswitch) and I’ll do that again or whatever it takes ’til it’s quieter. The display’s perfect, which is why I opted to replace the midplane instead of a full DOA system exchange. While I’m typing this I can tell how it’ll sound without the whine and I’ll be quite satisfied with the system then.
…
Dead right about the MDN Magic Word, hywel. The automatic spam here had been noticeably increasing for the past month or two.
“I gather from your post that you are not a fan of Rush, which is fine, and maybe you’re a fan of Gore, which is also fine.”
If I had a choice of who to go to dinner with, I’d probably choose Gore. I don’t know if that makes me a “fan” or not…
<objective on the subject, you’d have to acknowledge that single handedly transforming AM talk radio, gathering a loyal 15-20 million listener base to a “dead medium” being the number one listened to talk radio host in American history, and challenging and ultimately transforming the way that a lot of America looks at the media is a pretty big deal.”</I>
Okay. But I don’t see how that helps Apple. Yes, it makes Rush a “high-profile Mac user.” But, as I pointed out, there are other high-profile Mac users.
“Apple should happily use any and all comers. Apple should not shy away from anyone who can help get them more sales.”
Well, it does get tricky when celebrities are involved. First, celebrities make money off their celebrity, so for them to publicly endorse a product requires that they get paid. It’s sort of like the whole Carl Sagan mess years ago. While I do think Sagan overreacted, he makes money off of his name and needs to make sure that he, at least, gets some token payment. Like a copyright, if you don’t protect it, you lose it.
“I don’t know why they dropped Apple Masters, was that at the WWDC?
AppleMasters was part of marketing, as I understand it. They would give equipment and support to “an international group of visionaries from various fields: educators, artists, designers, writers, producers, architects, inventors, scientists, business leaders, musicians, athletes and other world-changers.” Yes, I suppose I’d count Rush in that group, though none of the other members were particularly “political.”
Some of the past people I remember include Sinbad, Herbie Hancock, James Woods, Gregory Hines, Bryan Adams, and Tom Clancy. Besides stars of the stage and screen, there was also Donald Glaser (physicist), Louis Herman (marine biologist), and Richard Dawkins (scientist).
The reason I bring up WWDC was that we’d usually get Sinbad, Gregory Hines, and a few others to show up at WWDC and put on a show. Bryan Adams showed up back in ’99. It was pretty cool. But AppleMasters was more than entertaining a bunch of developers.
Like I said, I was sorry to see Apple drop it. A brief article can be seen here.
“I do this myself most of the time.”
twilight, lurn to spel.
Totophe wrote:
“And for the end, I drive an Alfa Romeo, without any stickers, and I’m proud of this !
PS: Sorry for my poor English gramar…”
don’t worry, we understand you! good post!
my iMac G5 purrs on my desktop – barely audible
Nice. Mine still has a whiny overtone even after replacing the midplane assembly (which btw, Sizewell, isn’t quite as trivial as turning on a lightswitch) and I’ll do that again or whatever it takes ’til it’s quieter. The display’s perfect, which is why I opted to replace the midplane instead of a full DOA system exchange. While I’m typing this I can tell how it’ll sound without the whine and I’ll be quite satisfied with the system then.
…
Dead right about the MDN Magic Word, hywel. The automatic spam here had been noticeably increasing for the past month or two.
Re: my iMac G5 purrs on my desktop – barely audible
Nice. Mine still has a whiny overtone even after replacing the midplane assembly (which btw, Sizewell, isn’t quite as trivial as turning on a lightswitch) and I’ll do that again or whatever it takes ’til it’s quieter. The display’s perfect, which is why I opted to replace the midplane instead of a full DOA system exchange. While I’m typing this I can tell how it’ll sound without the whine and I’ll be quite satisfied with the system then.
…
Dead right about the MDN Magic Word, hywel. The automatic spam here had been noticeably increasing for the past month or two.
this is a test
option-esc is another alternative in cocoa apps, while in the middle of typing a word.
Liberal jackass wrote: “You have a Bush/Cheney sticker on your volvo? WTF is she talkin about I equate Mac users with liberals, open minded people thank you.”
**********
Liberals are open-minded to every single opinion, idea, and lifestyle…WITH WHICH THEY AGREE!