COVID-19 closed tens of thousands of businesses – forever

Many U.S. states have been reopening their economies in the wake of extended COVID-19 shutdowns, but tens of thousands of businesses across America are still closed — many of them forever.

Nicole Lyn Pesce for MarketWatch:

COVID-19 closed tens of thousands of businesses - foreverAs of July 10, 132,580 businesses listed on the Yelp review site remain closed due to the coronavirus pandemic, according to its latest Economic Average report…

That’s a slight decrease from 140,000 closures last month, as phased re-openings in some places have allowed many businesses to operate again, even if in a limited capacity. But while temporary closures have dropped, the number of businesses that have permanently shuttered is rising. Of all the business closures since March 1, 55% (or 72,842 businesses) will never reopen again, which is up from the 41% that Yelp reported in its Local Economic Impact Report just last month.

In other words, another 15,742 businesses listed on Yelp permanently closed between June 15 and July 10.

Restaurants listed on Yelp have suffered 26,160 total closures as of July 10, and 60% (15,770) have permanently closed — which is up 23% from June 15. And it’s been last call for more than four in 10 bars and nightlife spots (44%) listed on Yelp, that will also never reopen.

Some 26,119 shopping and retail businesses are also still closed, of which roughly half (or 12,454) are permanent — which is up 29% from what Yelp reported last month.

MacDailyNews Take: Obviously, we remain in a catch-22. We must have an economy and we’re in the midst of a pandemic. Both conditions will exist simultaneously until we have effective treatments and a vaccine, so try to be as safe as you can be – wash your hands frequently, keep your hands away from your face, wear a mask in public, practice social distancing, etc.

The CDC guidelines for how to protect yourself and others — especially older adults and people who have severe underlying medical conditions like heart or lung disease or diabetes and are at higher risk for developing serious complications from COVID-19 — are here.


  1. We should have never closed for more than 2 weeks. That much is now painfully obvious to rational, thinking people. The elderly and the sick should have been and continue to be quarantined without destroying the economy – hurting and killing untold numbers of people.

    The rest of us should have been back to work months ago, socially distancing, washing hands, wearing masks, etc.

      1. To “flatten the curve” to not overload hospitals. If you can remember back that far, it was only supposed to be for two weeks, not killing the economy, millions of jobs, increasing drug use and suicides, etc. Democrat governors got drunk on power – that will be litigated and found unconstitutional – and continue to kill the economy and the resultant people today.

        1. You would have pushed everything back by two weeks, that’s it.
          Look where things are holding steady and where they are spiking, and look at levels of “openness”. Not holding my breathe for the truth.

        2. Taiwan only closed for school for two weeks last term with a population density 3 times that of NewYork City. But then again they enacted counter measures back in December. Taiwan knew from a group of brave doctors from wuhan that a deadly contiguous virus was spreading human to human. The same group of doctors that now dead or missing. Taiwan tried to warn The WHO but the WHO refused to listen to Taiwan because one really big country would be upstaged and have its feelings hurt.

          Fact One: WHO said no indication of human to human spread until Feb but Taiwan told WHO Human to Human evidence in December

          Fact Two: CDC said no face mask as late as March. Taiwan recommended face mask in December.

          then Taiwan

          By they point, common sense had made it to the front of the class, millions of potentially infected people had already made it to target countries.

          Trump made decisions off the info he was given from the WHO and the CDC. The people that pin Covid on Trump are willful dishonest and more concerned about the blue team beating the red team at any cost. Screw the facts. You guys are like little spoiled little children fighting on which bunk bed you’re gonna get on the titanic 30 min after a giant iceberg buckled the plates, popped the rivets and tore through the hull.

            1. That’s great but conservatives haven’t come up with any truths yet. Hate to break it to you but what you choose to believe isn’t truth, you just think it is.

        3. This is a Mac News site and First Then always seems to show up like a troll to turn any Mac Daily News post into a political discussion. This is not a Democrat problem! If Trump showed any sort of leadership back in January or even December (If you can remember back that far) maybe then we could have just shut down for two weeks and started nationally, socially distancing, washing hands, wearing masks, etc. But there has been no leadership at the top, only denial hoping it would just go away and not hurt the economy. I believe he and Fox News said it was a Hoax. If you voted for him First Then, it’s on your back. Funny how Trump is Now looking for a “strategy” to control the virus.

          1. Neither President Trump nor Fox News called COVID-19 a hoax.

            Despite what MSDNCNN tell you, here’s what President Trump actually did in December/January alone of this year:

            December 31: China reports the discovery of the coronavirus to the World Health Organization.

            January 3: CDC Director Robert Redfield sent an email to the director of the Chinese CDC, George Gao, formally offering to send U.S. experts to China to investigate the coronavirus.

            January 5: CDC Director Redfield sent another email to the Chinese CDC Director, George Gao, formally offering to send U.S. experts to China to investigate the coronavirus outbreak,

            January 6: The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) issued a level I travel notice for Wuhan, China due to the spreading coronavirus.

            January 7: The CDC established a coronavirus incident management system to better share and respond to information about the virus.

            January 11: The CDC updated a Level 1 travel health notice for Wuhan, China.

            January 17: The CDC began implementing public health entry screening at the 3 U.S. airports that received the most travelers from Wuhan – San Francisco, New York JFK, and Los Angeles.

            January 20: Dr. Fauci announces the National Institutes of Health is already working on the development of a vaccine for the coronavirus.

            January 21: The CDC activated its emergency operations center to provide ongoing support to the coronavirus response.

            January 23: The CDC sought a “special emergency authorization” from the FDA to allow states to use its newly developed coronavirus test.

            January 27: President Trump tweeted that he made an offer to President Xi Jinping to send experts to China to investigate the coronavirus outbreak.

            January 27: The CDC issued a level III travel health notice urging Americans to avoid all nonessential travel to China due to the coronavirus.

            January 27: The White House Coronavirus Task Force started meeting to help monitor and contain the spread of the virus and provide updates to the President.

            January 29: The White House announced the formation of the Coronavirus Task Force to help monitor and contain the spread of the virus and provide updates to the President.

            January 31: The Trump Administration:

            • Declared the coronavirus a public health emergency.
            • Announced Chinese travel restrictions.
            • Suspended entry into the United States for foreign nationals who pose a risk of transmitting the coronavirus.
            1. The fact that you started with “Neither President Trump nor Fox News called COVID-19 a hoax” brings all the rest of your statements and judgement into question and shouldn’t merit much of a response.

              Even if your list is accurate, after 145, 000 deaths, the trump Administration certainly did not implement any NATIONAL plan to combat the virus after January. This was and is a national emergency and communication and safety plans should have come from the top and not politized by leaving it to the states.

              Next time there is a war we should leave it to the states to decide whether they want to send their citizens into battle. Oh, that’s right, we have a national military to deal with serious threats to our nation’s safety.

              I’m hoping the county is able to move on from this destructive administration and their enablers in the Senate this November.

              Have a good weekend.

            2. Baroo77,

              Neither President Trump nor Fox News called COVID-19 a hoax.

              The U.S. is a confederacy of individual states, which have rights. If the feds tried to impose a 50-state solution, how much do you want to bet that a large portion of Democrat governors would have immediately sued the Trump administration for imposing mask, distance dictates, etc.?

              You are blaming Trump wrongly because you do not understand how the U.S. system of governance works which, if you’re a U.S. citizen, I blame on public schools controlled by teachers unions that reward and perpetuate failure and also the mainstream MSDNCNN media which reports biased, slanted disinformation even though they know that a “a national simultaneous shut down, testing and contact tracing” is an undoable fantasy.

              Because you do not understand how the U.S. system of governance works, you really shouldn’t be voting.

              Go learn some things before you try debating with someone who knows what they’re talking about and doesn’t get their “facts” from MSDNCNN.

            3. Having a thoughtful “Plan” in place on how best to combat the pandemic is not “imposing”. It was mostly Republican Governors who were not requiring masks or social distancing and look where that has got them. Sending federal troops to cities just to help your reelection bid is “Imposing”.

              Most Democratic Governors adhered to requiring wearing masks and social distancing so you can stop generalizing and only blame Democrats.

              I’m also very aware of how our U.S. system of governance works. By citing another nonsensical trump nickname (MSDNCNN) and assuming it is where I get all my information shows you are the only one on a steady diet of biased news.

              This is a technology information blog and the fact that your profile image is a Republican icon and you only seem to show up on political slanted posts, amplifies the fact that you are either a disgruntled white male or a Russian troll. Both of which offer nothing beneficial to America.

              Don’t expect a reply. You’re not worth the time.

      2. America is not divided by race color, gender or sexual orientation.
        America is divided by wise people and idiots.
        And idiots divide themselves by race color, gender and sexual orientation. Democrats are millions of times more racist than Republicans.

        Who owned slaves? Southern Democrats.
        Who fought to end slavery? Republican.
        Who freed the slaves? A Republican.

        Who created gun control to keep blacks from owning guns? Democrats.

        Democrats created and fuel Antifa. ANTIFA Profile:

        Violent, unstable personal background
        Clear pattern of sociopathic activity
        Hard left (Communist) political ethos
        Unkempt physical appearance, featuring filthy black clothing, skin piercings, tattoos, foul odor.
        Perpetually non-productive, non-contributing. They don’t work. They parasitically subsist on government “welfare” and thievery.
        Extensive arrest/incarceration record. Hordes of these ANTIFA clones, manufactured by our leftist public “education/indoctrination” system, are “in-action” in all major US metro areas, Western Europe, and the UK. They’re bussed-around by sleazy, leftist politicians who use them to terrorize political opponents.

        They enthusiastically share a vile hatred of “everything West,” and a nihilistic goal of destroying all trappings of Western Civilization, history religion, economy, infrastructure.

        Being absolutely amoral (like the leftist politicians who support them), they are extremely dangerous and have no compunction about committing vandalism, theft, mayhem, murder!

        This is just one of hundreds of ways that Democrats are destroying this country. Nothing is beneath those pieces of shit. Only an idiot would vote for democrats.

        Pelosi, AOC, Omar, Waters, Schumer, Wilson and soooo many others.
        These people are vile, despicable and pathetic will do anything and everything to destroy this country and try to blame Trump for it in order to win elections.

        Collusion was a lie and Democrats knew it.
        Impeachment was a farce and Democrats knew it.
        Testimony against Kavanaugh was all lies and Democrats knew it
        Nothing is beneath those pieces of shit. Only an idiot would vote for democrats.

        EVERY voting anomaly favors Democrats. Coincidence? They lie, cheat and steal. They are frauds. Nothing is beneath those pieces of shit. Only an idiot would vote for democrats.

        Every major city is a cesspool and they are all run by Democrats. Democrats are letting their cities burn and business are allowed to be destroyed. There are no arrests and criminals are being let out of prison, they then persecute cops and prosecute honest Americans trying to protect their families. They are despicable pieces of shit. Only an idiot would vote for democrats.

        Democrats did everything they could to slow and stop aid to Americans during Covid. They continue to do so to destroy the economy so they can blame Trump totry to stop his unstoppable re-election. They are despicable pieces of shit. Only an idiot would vote for democrats.

        American are disgusted by the left’s lies, threats and violence. Democrats are despicable pieces of shit. Only an idiot would vote for them.

            1. Today’s Demonrats are the complete opposite of everything the founding fathers stood for, but you would have to be able to think to know that.

            2. Then why do liberals ignore everything the Constitution says and stands for?

              Just when I think you are out of stupid things to say, you did your self deeper with every post.

              The depth of your stupidity is staggering.

          1. I downvoted the idiot and I am proud of it.

            I didn’t downvote him based on political affiliation of bias. I downvoted him because of his idiotic assertions. “Millions of time more racist…”……please!

            So now you know, Karne. What are you going to do about it?

          1. So some random site, with no documentation or support, just makes a declaration that they claim they “researched” – a declaration which flies in the face of recorded history, and I’ve read quite a few sources of it – and you fall for it.

            You’re even dumber than you appear to be.

        1. applecynic, the Constitution does NOT grant liberties, it enumerates and protects liberties and rights.

          Have you considered suing your school, because they really fucked up your education. Or, are you just too stupid to learn?

          1. Becky time for your Chlorox.

            When it says Congress shall make no law establishing a religion, it grants freedom of religion and so .any more.

            Were you taught the universe is 6000 years old in science class?

            1. Your stupidity is amazing. I does NOT grant freedom of religion, it protects freedom of religion.

              You really should go back to 3rd grade and start school again. Maybe they will teach you to think the second time around.

            2. @hailstorm
              Don’t be a douche. If it said Congress can establish a religion, you would not have parity with the established religion, which is…. repeat after me…. not freedom of religion.

        2. ‘Democrats are despicable pieces of shit. Only an idiot would vote for them.‘

          Guess that means most Americans will become idiots in November. All polls show that it’s over for Trump. Then maybe all you Trump-loving people can go spew your contempt of the build of US (fellow) citizens elsewhere.

          See you in November….lol

            1. Clinton did win the popular vote – a fact that continues to haunt Trump! Trump won the antiquated and outdated Electoral College with the help of Russia and a protest vote by American workers who felt that they were not being heard. Many of them now regret their protest votes that resulted in Trump’s election.

              The Republican Party must rebuild itself after a Trump. Hopefully, this rebuilding will be based on actual conservative fiscal principles and a return to the spirit of the rule of law including respect for all individual rights, not just the Second Amendment. Furthermore, I truly hope that the Republican Party stops whining like a victim. How many times have I heard the Trump is being treated horribly unfairly? Republicans like to call Democrats “snowflakes.” That makes Trump a blizzard.

              Hopefully this rebuilding respects science, open discourse, and opposing opinions rather than religious and rigid adherence to doctrine and a war mentality. How many times has Trump denigrated “radical” Democrats (meaning everyone who disagrees with him) as hating our country and trying to destroy it? And his followers do the same…

              You should be ashamed. But you, like Trump, appear to have no capacity for shame. You, like Trump, have a false sense of certainty, infallibility, and righteousness.

              So long, Fwhatever. I will never respond to your foolish drivel again. You just aren’t worth the time.

          1. Can’t wait to see you in November – I absolutely love Liberal tears!

            You’re in for another big surprise, Buster.

            62% of Americans Say the Political Climate Prevents Them from Sharing Political Views


            Not sure if you’re capable of drawing a rational conclusion in regard to the election and pre-election polling (or if you understand push polling, etc.), so you might want to look up “Silent Majority” and stop declaring “victory” lest you find yourself crying in the Javits Center once again on election night.


            1. You know First Then, recognizing that you are in the Denial phase is the first part of your recovery. Really, a ‘shocked’ Clinton supporter video? Cannot get much wearer than that.
              Go ahead, take the blue pill….you will feel better.
              Even if we ignoire ervery single national poll (all in favour of Biden), what I do is watch and wait to see when all the Republican senators will start to split from Trump and his toxic ways. I am already seeing the cracks forming. At some point the cracks will get wider and then everything will come crashing down all at once.

              I admit, this is getting fun to watch although sad that there is so much collateral damage to good folk down there.

            2. In 2016 the credible polls all showed that Trump did have a chance of winning. Not sure what polls you are thinking of from 2016 but the smart polls were all within the margin of error. That isn’t true this time. Trump is so far behind in those same polls that it is very unlikely he has any hope of winning in 2020. Trump is done. You can take that to the bank and cash it.

        3. The Republican Party of today is not the Republican Party of Abraham Lincoln. That was 155 years ago. The Republican Party of today is not even close to the same as the Republican Party of the 1960s, 1970s, or 1980s. Reagan would not have been successful in the 2016 primaries.

          Stop being a weakling and leaning on the legacy of Lincoln. Grow some balls and create a new, lasting, and worthy legacy based on separation of powers, the independence of the judiciary, and the value of all Americans – not just the wealthy Americans who “earned” it.

          You are sadly misguided. Please open your mind and entertain the fact that you may not be right about everything.

          1. You’ve made the claim that Reagan wouldn’t be accepted in the Republican Party before, and now say he wouldn’t be successful in the primaries. I asked you then to compare what he stands for and why that wouldn’t resonated now.

            You never replied.

            I said in all actuality it is the Democrat party that has changed and in reality Jack Kennedy would never be nominated, nor a born-again peanut farming governor from Georgia nor a left-of moderate philandering governor from Arkansas. They are just not extreme enough.

            You never replied.

            The fact is Republicans have the same basic ideals as they have had for 50 years. It has always been fiscally conservative. Does that mean defund everything because it is socialist? Of course not, only an idiot makes that argument. Does it mean Republican presidents always reduce the budget? Not possible anymore.
            Odd that it is the left who seeks to defund basic parts of our society, namely police and defense. That is more extreme than any calls Republicans have ever had to defund anything.

            Republicans still see Americans as just that, Americans. The left, in order to distinguish itself from reality, creates the idea that the party assembled to end slavery is now the party of racism, just because we don’t believe in bending over backwards to separate and buy different groups of peoples votes by telling each of them how they are beaten and downtrodden. Never mind most of this treatment comes from states, cities and municipalities run by the very party that claims to want end racism.

            The media really helps the left get out these and many many more mistruths for one and only one reason, power.

      1. The elderly and sick are quarantined, so carriers don’t matter. The rest will get COVID-19 and well over 99% will survive, most with very little issues, if any.

        1. Let us assume that only a third of Americans contract the virus and more than 99% survive. If you regard up to a million deaths as no big deal, it’s no wonder you’ve been isolating yourself since January. Just one medium sized county in Texas (Nueces) has had 85 infants test positive for the virus, suggesting that healthy young folks can get it. If they can get it, they can transmit it. Taking steps to slow community spread is just common sense.

    1. Rationale, thinking people would have controlled the pandemic more effectively than the United States did under Trump’s lack of leadership. For weeks Trump campaigned for two hours per day on television under the guise of coronavirus response. Most of the rest of the world managed to contain the pandemic, but not the United States or Russia or Brazil…countries run by autocrats or wannabe autocrats like Trump.

      Like Trump, the influence of your illogic and prevarication is nearing an end. Roughly 35 to 40% of the voting population appear to support Trump through thick and thin. Based on my experience, it is impossible to reason with you or people like you who have established a system of beliefs that defies reality. Fortunately, The majority of American voters (a larger majority than in 2016!) understand that Trump is a fatally flawed individual who is an embarrassment as a citizen, much less as a President. Trump’s cronies who facilitated and encouraged his illegal and corrupt activities will go down, too. History will not remember Trump or McConnell or Barr kindly. As Trump often says…that I can tell you.

      1. I respectfully disagree. The sick and elderly have not been culled. Nor should they. I strongly support isolating everyone over the age of 60 while the remainder return to a semblance of normality . I strongly suggest we start by isolating ALL politicians over the age of 60. Every single one of them.

      2. You lost me at “culled”.

        “The low hanging fruit, if you will, the sick and elderly, have already been culled.”

        Oxford Dictionary Definition
        culled – adjective –
        1. selectively slaughtered

        1. COVID-19 doesn’t care about your feelings.

          COVID-19 doesn’t care if a word triggers you.

          COVID-19 culls the diseased, sick, and elderly. This is the “science.”

          “The science” is the thing to which you atheistic libs so desperately cling, no matter how easily and continuously data are manipulated to control you in the name of “science.”

          Tell a Lib it’s “the science” based on “studies.” That’s all it takes for a Lib to believe anything.

          “Studies.” You know, like Al Gore, Apple Board Grifter for Life, whose “studies” claimed there would be no more snow on Kilimanjaro by 2016.

          Kilimanjaro, 2020

          “Studies.” Like the COVID-19 “studies” that predicted as many as 40 million people would die in the first year.

          Better hurry up and die, 39.45 million people, the year is running out (even using China’s lie of November 17th as the start date – just over 4 months to go to prove the “studies” correct).

          Dem/Lib/Progs are gullible saps who cannot think for themselves and believe whatever they’re told by other gullible saps reading the “news” off teleprompters – backed by “studies,” of course – on ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, MSNBC, etc. funded by globalist commies like George Soros, the CCP, etc.

          Back to the point: COVID-19 CULLS the the diseased, sick, and elderly. That’s what it’s designed to do, by God (or by the CCP “scientists”), and it does its CULLING fairly effectively, but it’s already running out of low-hanging fruit to CULL.

          1. Listen Dr. Mengele,

            The virus of course has no feelings, opinions.

            The failing of what you call science is that it doesn’t hurt or kill only the elderly and those with conditions. It kills the young as well.

            The failing of what you call humanity is your disregard for humanity. Your favoring business, wealth, over people. That’s sociopathy in any book.

            1. @applecynic by your logic, ANY communicable disease that leads to death demands the same solution…So we should stay in lockdown forever since the flu kills everyone too.

              And what of the MANY lives lost DIRECTLY because of the lockdowns and other measures?

              If you disagree, prove to us how lockdown and all the other current measures should NOT be used for the flu or other deadly diseases.

              And if you cannot, then you are guilty of the same accusation you just made, “…of favouring business, wealth, over people” (as if it this is a mutually exclusive issue).

            2. @applesynic “Any communicable disease with this level of virulence needs this solution and perhaps even more stringent.

              This is nothing like the flu!”

              Tell THAT to the families of the over 40,000 to 60,000 people that have died in the US of the flu this year alone, or the 60,000 to 90,000 that died of the flu in 2017…

              And you are avoiding the question I posed. I dare you to answer it honestly, if you can.

            3. That was too easy. What a non-answering avoidance tactic. You are showing the truth about your convictions.

              No, you won’t because you are not being honest…

              If you were, you would have to say that the same measures should be applicable to try to save the up to 90,000 that died. But you cannot justify that…can you?!

          2. I’m neither liberal nor atheist. It’s hard to be an atheist when you’re seeing people unnecessarily spend their last days alone on a vent in the ICU. While your ideology makes some points, you’re not changing any minds here because you don’t seem to have any heart. Remember, “As you sow, so will you reap”, and Karma sucks. So have a nice life, it may be shorter and lonelier than you think.

            1. The low hanging fruit, if you will, the sick and elderly, have already been culled.

              It’s SAD. That said, COVID-19 virus doesn’t care if anyone is sad or happy or ambivalent about what it does, it really only “cares” if you have diabetes, are obese, are elderly, have a lung condition, etc. That’s what COVID-19 really, really “likes.” Not the vast majority of the productive workforce to whom COVID-19 cannot do much more than cause a few days of coughing, if it can even manage that. Most people don’t even know they had COVID-19.

              These shutdowns are the greatest folly of modern times and history will eventually record them as such.

              OPEN UP! It’s too late for far too many, but OPEN UP, morons!

    1. In San Bernardino, CA the published stats show15.8% of infected are over 60, while 83.7% of deaths are over age 60. Death rate for Covid below age 60 is 0.38%. Below age 50 is 0.17%.

      Lock up the elderly. Start with the politicians.

  2. “We must have an economy and we’re in the midst of a pandemic. Both conditions will exist simultaneously until we have effective treatments and a vaccine, ”

    The only reason this may end up being true is NOT because a vaccine is necessary (because it is not) but strictly because of political choice. The IMPACT of this “pandemic” is completely artificial at this point in time. It is NOT a far gone conclusion that the two conditions need to continue as is, because the risk is simply not there to continue to warrant the current actions.

    (Let the flaming begin… 😉 )

  3. No MDN, Covid didn’t shut down tens of thousands of businesses forever, the leftist, control-freak lockdown did. Every suicide, untreated stroke, cancer, heart attack and millions of collective years of life lost to stress, anxiety, depression and despair is on their bloody, soulless hands.

    1. +++1

      BTW, very few even know how to use a mask properly…hence they are totally useless in the general public. They simply give a false sense of security and makes politicians appear as if something useful is being done when it is very well established that these serve no purpose in the general public, in spite of the rare studies suggesting the opposite.

      1. If you should ever need surgery, I hope you surgical team doesn’t share this point of view. As for people not knowing how to use a mask properly: I think you underestimate our ability to learn.

        1. Strawman argument…I excluded medical staff. Also, fact is that surgical masks are not designed to stop spread of viruses, just like chain-linked fences are not designed to keep out mosquitoes. When that is needed, they use different equipment, e.g. N95 masks AND they know how to use them.

          As for learning, just look around and tell me how many you see that know how to use one.

          BTW, it requires far more than masks to prevent spread.

          And at this point, it does not matter though, as it is far far too late.

          1. It really isn’t a fallacious argument. I was responding to your comment about being “totally useless in the general public”. Here are some examples: 1) Hong Kong and New York have similar population and density profiles, yet the infection rate is much lower in Hong Kong, where the population is more likely to wear masks; 2) In the early 1900’s the incidence of tuberculosis declined dramatically when caregivers and patients began wearing a single layered gauze (cloth) mask; 3)Since the 1940’s it has been widely accepted that washable gauze masks reduced the contamination of indoor surfaces and air because of their ability to reduce the number and size of droplets expelled from coughing and sneezing. You certainly can argue that shutting down the economy isn’t warranted, but nearly everyone working in modern healthcare recognizes the benefit of wearing masks to prevent the spread of disease (including viruses). The data absolutely supports my argument.

            1. I appreciate you trying to fact-based comparisions…to that I commend you, because most people here turn to ad hominem attacks or politicize everything…

              That said, you have to compare apples with apples for the arguments to be useful.

              1) One of the reasons NY had such a HUGE upsurge was in large part because sick elderly people known to have COVID-19 were forced to be placed in care homes with other elderly. The majority of the cases have been in long-term care facilities, skewing the numbers significantly. Of course, there is more to it, but masks vs not was not the main component.

              2) TB is a bacteria. Bacteria are significantly larger than viruses, so can be effective in that case. That is the main goal in surgeries…to prevent the spread of and keep the surgical field clean from bacteria. Viruses are much smaller and many studies of coronaviruses that cause the common flu and/or cold have shown that surgical masks have little effectiveness in blocking their spread.

              3) Many of your contexts are medical staff. The fact is that they are trained on how to use them properly. The population at large in a the great outdoors first do not know how to use them to prevent spread (they touch their masks hundreds of times an hour then touch everything else, do not know how to remove them without spread, rarely or never clean them between uses, do not dispose of them carefully, and so on). And their use in a medical setting is VERY different than out and about in the outside world, worn for hours at a time in an uncontrolled environment. But again, they serve a greater purpose and effectiveness in a controlled medical setting with trained staff than they can ever be effective with the general population, with or without training (and good luck with that idea, which was raised by someone else).

              So based on that context, the argument does not hold.

              And I mentioned before, the mandating of masks at this point, as many leaders are now choosing to do, even if everything else were even remotely possible (proper training and use), is FAR TOO LATE. This virus is EVERYWHERE.

              The best that can be hoped for is development of herd immunity sooner than later, or this virus fading into existence. A vaccine MAY help but is no guarantee and brings its own set of issues, so is not the end all and be all, as some have come to believe.

              In the meantime, those that are in vulnerable categories need to take precautions, as would ANY person that is vulnerable to ANY disease or bacteria (you do not tell the whole neighbourhood to wear masks and other protective gear because there is someone in the neighbourhood that is undergoing chemotherapy and their immune system is virtually non-existent..NO, the chemo-patient is the one that is instructed to take extra precautions).

  4. Fourteen days of quarantine does not make you invulnerable, and test results aren’t permanent, which is why I have placed myself in permanent quarantine until I can get vaccinated. A vaccine is a preventive measure, not a cure. You can’t be vaccinated against COVID-19 if you already have it, so it is important to stay negative.

    I don’t care about all this left-right, Democrat-Republican BS. You guys can argue all the way into your graves. I will enjoy the peace and quiet after you are gone.

    1. First, why would you need a vaccine when over 95% of all COVID cases recover on their own? True, those in higher risk categories are less successful.

      Second, a vaccine is NOT 100% protection. Without getting into a lot of details about vaccines, aside from safety issues to consider, many vaccines are not very effective and do not achieve their intended goal or are only effective in some case, but can introduce additional risks. It is like wearing a mask…gives a false sense of protection.

      Not saying one should not take one (I have taken many)…just saying people put too much uneducated faith in them as if they are the end all and be all of protection and think there is nothing else to consider about them or even alternative approaches.

      Like ANY medication, people need to be educated about the pros and cons about them.

        1. Yes, it CAN BUT so do MANY flu viruses… (as well as MANY other diseases) I hope you have taken EVERY vaccine for EVERY flu and infection that can cause long-term lung damage, and feel totally protected from catching another damaging and deadly disease…

          BTW, driving a car can lead to permanent disability and death…at a MUCH higher level of risk than COVID…have you stopped driving yet?

          And BTW it has been repeatedly shown that the dangers from COVID for those under 65 is FAR LESS likely than the dangers of the common flus.

          So much fear-mongering…

          1. So many lies. You and your fellow-travelers have recklessly killed tens of thousands of Americans by minimizing the risks and thereby encouraging both private citizens and a feckless government to refuse to take reasonable precautions.

            I hope you can sleep at night, because you will burn in hell.

            1. Is that all you can say? ‘Liar, liar, pants on fire?’ That’s quite clever for a prosecutor with 30 yrs experience. Will you prosecuting? It’s ok…I have fire insurance and a good defence attorney.

          2. Smayer97… I am sure your parents are so proud of you and your superior command of medical statistics……hopefully they do not fall in the 5%….but then again, having spawned you maybe they would prefer it

            1. It is amazing how fast people that have nothing else to argue resort to ad hominem attacks… as if that somehow diminishes the other person’s argument and/or improves theirs; how clever, original and mature…

              But I’ll take your first line as a compliment…thanks. 😉

      1. “First, why would you need a vaccine when over 95% of all COVID cases recover on their own?”

        To not get it….?

        Why wear a coat when summer is coming?
        You’re making it very difficult to not be mean.

        1. Anyone is free to get a vaccine…I have no issue with that… I have even taken some. But the narrative is that without one we cannot get out of this situation.

          BTW, do you wear a raincoat when there is less than a 5% chance of rain? Many summer and fall days are like that. So I guess you wear one every day, do you? If not, why not?

          Why do you drive is the risk of dying in a car accident is higher than dying from COVID (assuming you drive)? Have you stopped driving until this risk is reduced to 0%? If not, why not?

  5. One brave Women ! One Brave Country

    thank you tump

    the best wafer in the world, a Taiwanese company

    Trump isn’t perfect but at least he is trying to support Taiwan

  6. Our death rate, devastated economy, seriously ill, and those with long term effects of the virus could have been a fraction of the current and growing number. It was the complete failure to provide a national, coordinated plan that involved a national simultaneous shut down, testing and contact tracing, opening when the R0 rate fell under 1, and face masks with distance enforced would have produced the outcomes we see in Korea and the EU. We will likely have to go through it all over again because of this administration’s abject failure.

    1. The U.S. is a confederation of states. The federal government is limited. In the U.S., states have rights. If the feds tried to impose a 50-state solution, how much do you want to bet that a large portion of Democrat governors would have immediately sued the Trump administration for imposing mask, distance dictates, etc.?

      You are blaming Trump wrongly because you do not understand how the U.S. system works which, if you’re a U.S. citizen, I blame on public schools controlled by teachers unions that reward and perpetuate failure and also the mainstream MSDNCNN media which reports biased, slanted disinformation even though they know that a “a national simultaneous shut down, testing and contact tracing” is an undoable fantasy.

      South Korea is a country very much unlike the U.S. Different systems of government. SK is run by Samsung, actually.

      The EU, so far, has racked up 624,000 COVID-19 deaths and 15.3 million cases and counting, genius.

      1. I recognize that the EU health site is a bit confusing, but that is 624,000 for the entire world. There are 201,000 for all of Europe, including Russia, Sweden, and the other non-EU countries.

        Nobody ever said that the President needed to violate federalism by forcing the states into a one-size-fits all solution. They have asked that he exercise leadership by responding to the crisis by allocating appropriate resources and providing consistent science-based guidance rather than a cacophony of mixed messages and finger pointing. Besides, if he does not value our federalism when it comes to policing, why on public health?

        I know everyone is tired of me, but as long as people keep posting things that are factually incorrect, I will keep posting corrections.

        1. Thank you TXUser! It’s plainly obvious that many on this board, condoned by MDN itself, are nothing but paid political trolls. The lies in their incessant propaganda need to be called out.

          1. @Goeb The old adage that “If you keep repeating something often enough, people will start to believe it” may be true BUT making and/or repeating such baseless claims does not make them true, no matter how often they are said, even if gullible people fall for it.

            If you are going to make accusations, back them up with facts. “Just the facts ma’am, just the facts.”

        2. Yes, that’s right. Different number, but my points stand.

          As of 23 July 2020, 1 647 936 cases have been reported in the EU/EEA and the UK: United Kingdom (296 377), Spain (267 551), Italy (245 032), Germany (203 368), France (178 336), Sweden (78 504), Belgium (64 534), Netherlands (52 241), Portugal (49 150), Poland (41 162), Romania (40 163), Ireland (25 819), Austria (20 038), Czechia (14 570), Denmark (13 350), Bulgaria (9 584), Norway (9 053), Finland (7 362), Luxembourg (5 854), Croatia (4 530), Hungary (4 380), Greece (4 077), Slovakia (2 058), Estonia (2 025), Slovenia (2 015), Lithuania (1 960), Iceland (1 840), Latvia (1 197), Cyprus (1 040), Malta (679) and Liechtenstein (87).

          As of 23 July 2020, 181 079 deaths have been reported in the EU/EEA and the UK: United Kingdom (45 501), Italy (35 082), France (30 172), Spain (28 426), Belgium (9 808), Germany (9 101), Netherlands (6 139), Sweden (5 667), Romania (2 101), Ireland (1 754), Portugal (1 702), Poland (1 642), Austria (711), Denmark (611), Hungary (596), Czechia (364), Finland (328), Bulgaria (321), Norway (255), Greece (200), Croatia (125), Slovenia (115), Luxembourg (111), Lithuania (80), Estonia (69), Latvia (31), Slovakia (28), Cyprus (19), Iceland (10), Malta (9) and Liechtenstein (1).

          President Trump is not violating or devaluing federalism by using existing systems to protect federal buildings and personnel.

        3. @TxUser “…as long as people keep posting things that are factually incorrect, I will keep posting corrections.”

          Except for one small instances, haven’t seem much that counts for corrections….

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