“At least five employees of Apple’s retail stores have been fired after downloading copies of Mac OS X 10.5 Leopard from the Internet that were distributed to developers at Apple’s Worldwide Developers Conference two weeks ago. ‘Dozens’ more also face termination,” Think Secret reports.
“The axed staffers had apparently been overheard discussing their acquisition of Mac OS X 10.5 Leopard with their co-workers, prompting Apple ‘corporate’ in Cupertino to investigate the matter and fire the employees,” Think Secret reports.
Full article here.
MacDailyNews Take: Not very smart for Apple retail employees to be doing such things.
Firing seems a bit harsh to me. My guess is that these weren’t store security guards, they were probably MacGenius types. These are people as anxious as everyone else to get an idea of what’s going on. Nothing in the preview was not discussed openly in front of the press. There were discussions and disclosures we attended that were clearly not for public consumption and Apple made it clear by posting signs everywhere.
If they didn’t want the 10.5 preview in the wild they should never have handed out thousands of copies. That’s just saying, “Pirate me.”
Normally I’m on Apple’s side with trying to control rumor sites, piracy, etc. This just seems harsh. I could see an official repremand or something, but people need their jobs.
Dumbasses!
As one who interviewed for an Apple Retail job, I must say that it was one of the most unusual experiences I have ever experienced. I don’t think my cousin got so scrutinized when he worked for Boeing when his security clearance was upgraded (as they are from time to time).
Over the years since my interview and “no thanks” from them, I’ve befriended several employees who had worked at my local retail store and or still work there.
Not one feels comfortable about their relationship with the company, they’re not disgruntle but just ULTRA worried that and all utterances of their employment are being scrutinized by Apple. One former employee likened it to 1984. He found it kind of funny that was one of their biggest campains and he says working for Apple is like working for Big Brother. YOU HAVE NO PERSONAL FREEDOM OR LIBERTIES with them.. They are the ghestpo-like overloards when they sign your check.
I thank God every time I walk into the store, while I enjoy shopping, I am glad I didn’t sell my soul to them and become one of them..
Flog them! Or not. Depends on the detail.
But talking about doing such things when you know you work for Jobs & Co shows intellectual capacity that makes a newt look smart.
“I thank God every time I walk into the store, while I enjoy shopping, I am glad I didn’t sell my soul to them and become one of them..”
Maybe the strict discipline is why people enjoy shopping at Apple Stores. Everyone here complains about the no-nothing slackers populating Best Buys and CompUSA. Apple holds their employees to a higher standard. Good for them. I wish more retail outlets did the same.
” . . . shows intellectual capacity that makes a newt look smart.”
Including Gingrich.
.I think the hype machine would be well fed if they DID release a special encoded copy to employees with NSA level code built in so it could be tracked. Issue the disk, let them use it so upon release they are quite familiar..
and weed out the bad guys easily by simply tracking any copies out in the wild back to the original source.
It would seem that Apple should be doing this with their devleoper copies. Why punish Apple employees for doing what everyone else, including developers, are doing? This doiesn’t make sense.
Critic said, “If this is the case, pretty stupid on Apple’s part. Why would you fire employees that were excited about a new product and wanted to try it out. It’s not like they downloaded it instead of buying it. I’m sure they would buy a copy of the official release when it comes out. (Unless Apple is too cheap to give a good employee discount, which wouldn’t surprise me either)”
Actually, Apple gives employees free upgrades of OS X when it’s released! Firing them for downloading Leopard is no different for firing them for stealing an iPod out of the stock room. It’s not available to anyone who is not a developer, and even developers pay for it.
As for being cheap with their employee discount, think again. They have an extremely generous discount, and they encourage their employees to share it with family and friends. My cousin works in the Manhattan store, and she got me several software titles at 50% off and great discounts on hardware too. I bought my dual 2.5 ghz G5, 23″ Cinema Screen, Final Cut Suite, and Logic, among other things, through her and saved nearly $2,000.
So much for your ignorant postulating.
What next? Fire anyone that looks at leaked photo of Leopard?
Apple Retail Reject, sounds like you might be bitter about not getting the job. I have two cousins who worked at two different Apple Stores, and they both loved working there. Neither had anything close to what you’re talking about. Or perhaps the folks at the store you go to work under a tough manager?
while we’re sorta on the subject . . . does anyone know how much the apple store employee discount actually is??
the nearest store to me is 3 hours away so i’m not going to get a job there anytime soon, but i was just wondering.
Gotta’ love the “I want it, so it’s mine” approach to living. These guys are no different than muggers, really– though a bit less violent and more pimply, perhaps.
“Why punish Apple employees for doing what everyone else, including developers, are doing?”
Developers paid for and signed NDA agreements. Everyone else is doing something illegal and there’s nothing Apple can do about it. However, if you WORK for Apple and brag about obtaining software illegally (ie, are not a developer that signed an NDA at WWDC) then you get to quickly become one of those people that Apple can’t do anything about.
How great is that? Free to download Leopard as much as you want and even distribute it and not have to worry about losing your job at Apple because you don’t have it anymore!
MDN Magic Word – last
Obviously, these guys were last in line for brains.
Think Secret sure has a hard on for Apple dirty laundry.
You’d think Apple had sued them or something.
I guess revenge is sweet.
To the ones defending the fired employees:
Would you feel the same if your housekeeper buys a watch from the street that was stolen from your dresser drawer, knowing *full well* that it was stolen from you? She then proceeds to yak about it to the gardener?
When some people take a job, they have to sign all sorts of agreements. With Apple, one of them is to follow their strict guidelines. If they signed it (and since they’re hired, they signed it), they are bound by it. You break the rules, you get fired. What’s so hard to understand? At least they don’t do daily anal probes like the diamond miners.
Just read the article, they ADMITTED to it???
This just gets better…
“All of us know that we violated our NDA and ethics policy. Therefore, because we had the character to tell the truth and to face the consequences of our actions, we were terminated”
LOLOL! They’re not even trying to say they didn’t know it was wrong, pretty indefensible to me.
“My only question is, if we all lied and denied it would we still be working at Apple today? Even more so, is that the kind of person that Apple wants working for them?”
Probably, and that’s what makes the difference between an “idiot” and an “employee”. It’s not about what Apple wants, it’s about money if your pocket. So, even though they’re fired, they’re still concerned about Apple? WAAAY too fanboy for me.
Are these the same folks that think that if they cheat on their significant other/spouse (if any) that if they admit to it, it’s ok?
“I knew sleeping with your sibling was wrong, but if I lied, would you want to be with a liar?”
LOL!
MDN Magic Word – done
OK, I’m done.
Piss on ’em
i worked for applecare for a brief period in austin, thru a temp agency. you sign nda, and agreements to not download, or upload apple proprietary software. in addition to not create any apps that directly compete with current apple products. you also agree not to post on 3rd party sites about the goings on at apple. when i worked there they had just released the g5 desktop, which we has to tech support but hadn’t scene yet until the day of the release. these contractural requirements aren’t just for temps they also apply to badged employees. these guys knew that their jobs were at risk.
apple does give away free upgrades to it’s employees, as well as runs contest continually to give away actual hardware. i have a friend who still works for apple who has almost every version of the imac that he won in various contests.
i don’t feel sorry for these guys at all. they should’ve never had talked about what they did.
Although clearly Apple was in their right to do this, it’s kind of like cutting off your nose to spite your face.
These employees should have been disciplined somehow, but my guess is that these types — the rebels, the troublemakers — are the best Mac geniuses. The most infectious about their passion for the Mac. Hell, they were about to become experts in Leopard before it came out. Think they’d be able to better answer questions about the OS upon its release? Hells yes.
With any intellectual property “crime”, you really have to look at the bigger picture. For all that is supposedly lost, what else is gained? I’m sure absolutely every person on this site has used stolen software. Have you learned any skills from that software, skills that made you more productive members of society? Skills that might have led to the line of work you’re in right now? A line of work that might pay you a salary in which you can afford to buy software?
ndelc: “Actually, Apple gives employees free upgrades of OS X when it’s released! Firing them for downloading Leopard is no different for firing them for stealing an iPod out of the stock room. It’s not available to anyone who is not a developer, and even developers pay for it.”
(and also “Someone Else”)
What they did was not stealing, so your examples aren’t applicable. I’m not defending the employees, just pointing out that your analogies are mere hyperbole.
” are the best Mac geniuses”
No, if they’re bragging about knowingly illegally obtaining software, violating their NDA, AND violating company ethics rules, then they were probably the competent asshats that know their job but constantly caused customer complaints. I would not be surprised if this was just the end of a trail for some of these folx and the manager and other GOOD geniuses were more than happy to be legally rid of them (“HR can’t fire ’em without enough customer complaints but if you find they’ve violated their contracts, then we can drop ’em like that!”)
I think that firing them is a little extreme…I’m not condoning what they’ve done.
Maybe they should be stuck with really dangerous, demeaning duty at the Apple Store, like having to handle all of the dell laptops that consumers are turning in to dispose of.
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I hope some of them were Apple store employees here in Portland, OR. I don’t know who hired that crew, but they are seriously scarey looking, as well as surly and unhelpful.
Get your talking points straight, Ampar. Gingrich is not “dumb”. Gingrich is “scary”. (Of course, one wonders about the intelligence of calling someone “dumb” when it’s obvious that — like him or not — the man is plenty smart.) But then, liberals are always saying that they’re so smart and everyone else is stupid, as if saying it over and over again made it true or proved it. Their desperation proves that they are not what they claim.
BTW, please excuse me for ending my previous post with a preposition. Honestly, I don’t know what I was thinking of!