“Every July, 400 of the most powerful media and tech industry chieftains meet at investment banker Herb Allen’s conference in Sun Valley, Idaho, for what are usually convivial discussions of megatrends and megamergers. But this year, Microsoft Chairman Bill Gates III laid into Sony Chief Executive Howard Stringer, according to two sources, including one who witnessed the exchange in a private room,” Cliff Edwards, Peter Burrows, and Ronald Grover report for BusinessWeek.
“Gates argued that Sony’s new high-definition DVD standard, called Blu-ray, needed to be changed so it would work smoothly with personal computers running on Microsoft’s Windows operating system. Stringer and two lieutenants defended the technology, insisting Blu-ray would work fine in PCs,” Edwards, Burrows, and Grover report. “Yet Gates’s ire only grew. ‘There must be something much deeper going on,’ Stringer said later, according to another person who heard the comment.”
“Despite the backing of the PC industry’s two biggest titans [Microsoft and Intel], it looks as if HD DVD’s days are numbered,” Edwards, Burrows, and Grover report… Sony appears to have a critical mass of support for its [Blu-ray] standard… A major factor swaying these companies is Blu-ray’s massive capacity. Its disks will hold at least 50 gigabytes and perhaps 100 gigs or more. HD DVD will start at 15 gigs, and top out at 45. ‘We want a standard that’s going to be around for 10 or 15 years,’ says one studio exec… Why is so much vitriol spilling from behind closed doors over one tech standard? The shiny little disk that Gates and Stringer tangled over has the potential to alter the landscape of the entertainment and technology industries.”
Excellent full article that explains the whole Blu-ray vs. HD DVD “war” here.
Related articles:
China to develop own as-yet-unnamed DVD format; Blu-ray vs. HD DVD vs ? – October 07, 2005
Paramount’s decision gives Blu-ray slight lead over HD DVD in next gen DVD format war – October 04, 2005
Record set straight on Blu-ray Disc Association’s superior high definition format – September 29, 2005
Microsoft backs cheaper, less sophisticated, lower capacity HD DVD over Apple-backed Blu-ray format – September 27, 2005
Twentieth Century Fox joins Apple, Dell, HP, others to support Blu-ray Disc format – July 29, 2005
Poll shows Apple-backed Blu-ray preferred by consumers over HD DVD for next-gen DVD standard – July 14, 2005
Microsoft allies with Toshiba on HD-DVD vs. Blu-ray Disc backers Apple and Sony – June 27, 2005
Apple joins Blu-ray Disc Association Board of Directors – March 10, 2005
They’re both going to DIE!!! The trend is for video on demand. Just like the cd will die soon. Neither will take off.
LordRobin, I, for one, am not bothered by PC Apologist. Why do you let him/her bother you.
I could even see myself saying “Rah Rah; Apple’s winning, Microsoft’s losing. Can we get past the cheerleading and look at the actual implications of these technologies?”
I would prefer Blu-Ray to win… if only because of its capacity and nothing else.
HD-DVD doesn’t offer enough capacity above existing discs to really be considered a serious contender for the next 10-15 years, especially for computing needs.
I was caught thinking about the leap from floppies to CD, and then from CD to DVD. Do we really want to make an incremental leap now when we can make a larger leap instead?
Floppy (is it really work mentioning at all???) 1.4Mb
CD – 700Mb = ~450 floppies
DVD – 4.7/8.5Gb = ~7-12 CDs
New contenders:
HD-DVD 15/30Gb = ~4-7 DVDs
or
Blu-Ray 50-100Gb = ~10-20 DVDs
(I hope I’m right on the numbers… I was kinda averaging it out, but it’ll be roughly correct.)
This is a classic management vs engineers situation.
Here we have some obviously brilliant engineers on both camps designing and building the next generation of optical storage, both with differing points of view (one is compatibility/low-cost, one is higher storage). Clearly, both sides have succeeded in accomplishing their goals.
However, now it’s down to a management decision as to which will end up being used in the marketplace.
To the losers:
“I see only B and C players here… “
(note that whilst Sony lost out with Betamax, my understanding is that the technology wasn’t totally wasted – I heard the Video8 format was based upon it, albeit shrunk down)
Hey PCApologista, Not to bash MS too badly, but please, give me a break. BlueRay intends to reduce fair use rights? HA HA! MS has all but promised the major studios that their DRM will put the wraps on any fair use. MS wants the same thing the studios do, a rental model for EVERYTHING, insuring a constant revenue/profit stream that will continue forever without ever having to do another once of work.
The technology itself on either side doesn’t seek to limit anybodies fair use. That comes from the twinAAs, RIAA and MIAA, with a healthy dose from BSA (Business Software Alliance, not boy scouts) and of course MS.
Everyone, this is why MS is supporting HD-DVD. Microsoft had to use a HD-DVD drive in there Xbox360 because it would otherwise mean licensing Sonys Blue-Ray. Either Sony is asking too much, or MS just doesn’t want to use Blue-Ray. So they are stuck with HD-DVD on their Xboxes, and they want the technology they use there to go into PCs. Reason being is so that people buying Xboxes can use them to play DVD movies in the future. But if Blue-Ray wins, all the people have are gaming machines, not home entertainment systems like MS wants. This will force them out of the living room an the ability to get mass amount of people onto their platform, giving Sony the win in the living room.
Odessey,
The original specs for BluRay is for 25 gigs per layer which will be doubled in a second generation. Therefore dual layered discs can reach 100 gigs when the higher density format is employed.
I bet most people here don’t care what media is used for movies, it’s the ability to write to a disc to store data that is at issue for PC users. I’d rather have a single layered 25 gig disc to write to than a 15 gig one. Makes it easier to back up data.
As for the cost issue – I think we all expect to be gouged severely for HD DVDs whatever format. That’s the nature of the entertainment industry. They’re losing sales now because a lot of people are ripping DVD’s they rent instead of buying them.
This may be a naive question, but can someone explain to me why we should embrace a new DVD technology? Does this mean all of my DVDs will be outdated in a couple of years and I have to buy new movies all over again? If so, I don’t know what the advantage is here. Can you help me out?
All nextgen DVD format players will be backward compatible.
You will not need to buy new DVDs…
Unless you want the re-released higher quality DVDs when they come out…the new Blu-Ray (HD) DVD’s will have greater storage and the movies will carry higher quality image, more extras, etc…
But no, your DVDs won’t become worthless coasters, if thats what you are asking. You should have no problem playing them in the NEW DVD players that are coming.
You will, however, need to get a new DVD player in order to read this new format…
TechnoGeek,
The advantage is that your home theater will now rival that of a regular movie theater.
If you usually take your family to the movie theater, now you can get the same experience at home (some would say better depending on your set-up), and save a ton of cash through the course of a year.
I also expect the bonus features on hi-def DVDs to be quite impressive since the studios are anxious to have us buy our movie collections over again.
Micro$oftopoly has mapped out a future that attaches DRM to EVERYTHING from a text document to a movie clip to music to a picture off of your own camera. The DRM employed would be a Microsoft Proprietary technology, of course. Just like the endless FUD directed toward iTunes & the iPod, the getting HD-DVD to market is all about M$ and money. Lots of money.
Have you seen Hi-Def? Makes your standard DVD look lame. In simpler terms, it’s like comparing a 2 Megapixel digicam to a 350k one. Six times the pixels per image.
Gates blew it when he didn’t select Sony (must have been because Apple did . . .).
—
Um… they’re not really ‘down’ with Sony… Playstation?
HD DVD is important to Microsoft because of that XBOX 360. If it cannot secure the standard, then their game console becomes the odd man out.
Toshiba has a working prototype of HD-DVD, while Sony’s is still vaporware. What’s happening here?
http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2005/10/03/toshiba_notebook_hd-dvd-drive/
http://www.infoworld.com/article/05/10/04/HNprototypessquareoff_1.html?source=rss&url=http://www.infoworld.com/article/05/10/04/HNprototypessquareoff_1.html
"note that whilst Sony lost out with Betamax, my understanding is that the technology wasn’t totally wasted – I heard the Video8 format was based upon it, albeit shrunk down"
Yes, the innards of a Hi-8 machine look familiar if you’ve seen the inside of a Beta deck. The Beta was really a shrunken Sony U-Matic transport itself.
It was about 1981 when the Broadcasters started noticing small, field portable video recorders based on consumer tape transports. The fact that Beta’s image quality looked much better than VHS was completely lost on consumers but was the most important aspect of the tape format battle for broadcasters – the Beta transport won the contest and the broadcast VHS formats evaporated within two years.
The Panasonic camp, not one to shy away from defeat, made several valiant attempts through the years to unseat Sony from the top spot on the broadcast radar screen, and not just in the Beta format. None of the efforts have resulted in much traction for Panasonic.
Since that time, Beta tape has been with us in the post production and broadcast world big time. Everyone through the 80’s and 90’s shot everything in the field on a Beta tape of some sort. Until the introduction of DV in 1997, if you were serious, you shot on Beta. With DV came a good alternative for lower end production, but still not up to par with Beta (Digital Beta, by that time actually).
There were lots of support peripherals. The Betacart system was a rack of Betacam decks with a robotic tape library attached which played TV spots and news inserts for almost every TV station on the planet for many years. Every piece of peripheral equipment from any manufacturer or competitive VTR system had a Betacam emulation mode. Beta was, and still is, king. Funny, though, I can still grab a tape intended for a Digital Beta deck and use it in my home Betamax.
The progression is sort of like this for Beta format machines:
1976 – Consumer Betamax
1981 – Betacam (oxide tape, component analog)
1986 – Betacam SP (metal tape, higher quality analog recording)
1993 – Digital Betacam (DCT coding, 88 Mbps digital component)
1996 – Betacam SX (MPEG-2, 18Mbps for news with a hard drive inside)
1997 – HDCAM (DCT coding, 144Mbps, 9:1 compression for HDTV)
2002 – IMX (MPEG-2, 50 Mbps, a better Betacam SX)
2004 – HDCAM-SR (MPEG-4, 600Mbps, 2.7:1 compression for HDTV, 16 audio tracks)
I would also like to add.. (not to fight) but to add that China is coming out with something too…..
Perhaps this could mean someting? But i feel it is hollywood and the movie industry that will make this product.. because there the tv, entertainment system et al is used more frequently than a computer..
Steve catered to the music industry he flooded the market with ipods and then swayed the music industry to a sour deal… (that will change when newer contracts are signed).
To win there needs to be a steve-jobs like play.. and i feel that its going to be bluray since it has the backing of movie studios and also apple.. which is HD Happy.. i believe it was SJ who said this is the year of the HD?
I would also like to say hi to my two bestest best friends who i see in these posts
Odessey67 and Road Warrior.
Greetings!
I am waiting for Hollywood to make a good movie.
After Hollywood gets around to making a good movie, then I might consider buying it.
Music Label Executive -ANON: I stopped waiting for the music industry to release a good record. Nothing worth buying since the late 60’s. I am cheering for your industry’s rapid demise.
Maybe you can get a job at Walmart?