Apple’s management doesn’t seem to want Nvidia support in macOS, a bad sign for the next-gen Mac Pro

“In October 2018, Nvidia issued as public a statement as it ever does,” William Gallagher and Mike Wuerthele report for AppleInsider. “In a FAQ on Nvidia’s developer site, the company said that Apple was to blame for the lack of drivers for Mojave.”

Developers using Macs with NVIDIA graphics cards are reporting that after upgrading from 10.13 to 10.14 (Mojave) they are experiencing rendering regressions and slow performance. Apple fully controls drivers for Mac OS. Unfortunately, NVIDIA currently cannot release a driver unless it is approved by Apple. Our hardware works on OS 10.13 which supports up to (and including) Pascal. — NVIDIA

“We saw this note in October, and started asking questions,” Gallagher and Wuerthele report. “What we found was support inside the Spaceship for the idea, but a lack of will to allow Nvidia GPUs. We’ve spoken with several dozen developers inside Apple, obviously not authorized to speak on behalf of the company, who feel that support for Nvidia’s higher-end cards would be welcome, but disallowed quietly at higher levels of the company.”

“‘It’s not like we have any real work to do on it, Nvidia has great engineers,’ said one developer in a sentiment echoed by nearly all of the Apple staff we spoke with. ‘It’s not like Metal 2 can’t be moved to Nvidia with great performance. Somebody just doesn’t want it there,'” Gallagher and Wuerthele report. “One developer went so far as to call it ‘quiet hostility’ between long-time Apple managers and Nvidia. For sure, somebody at Apple in the upper echelons doesn’t want Nvidia support going forward right now.”

Read more in the full article here.

MacDailyNews Take: Sounds like some bad blood. Still, if it could benefit Mac users, perhaps Apple could figure out a way to get past whatever the issues are/were and start anew?

31 Comments

  1. A deal breaker for a new 2019 Mac Pro. Apple doesn’t get to make these kinds of decisions for us without paying the price of many non-sales and migrations to the Dark Side. Fuck them and their “our way or the highway” attitude.

      1. Not doing themselves any favours and customers seem to be an ever decreasing consideration. That doesn’t bode well good will needs to work both ways. If they have good reasons then at least tell us.

    1. Yup.. like the rest of their pro initiatives in the last 7 years.
      Zero doubt Apple has f-ed up grandiously on the pro end.. but i thought their acknowledgement of the issue a couple years ago would address the key issues.. and to some extent it has and hopefully the modular Mac oro will take it a step further.

      But this revelation in the article, if true, is absolutely mindless and shortsighted and throws a wrench in their pro initiatives, in a big way. ….As reasoned by some posts here !
      Just plain stupid !

      But in the meanwhile thank god for Amds Redoen VII announcement at ces …..riveling nvidea 2080 RTX

        1. Do you even F-ing read a post before you make a stupid comment about it ?
          Hello youself !!! Jobe Whine Canube …
          I have been criticizeing the Apples pro situation plus a lot more u are cluless about, for years and years now. You were not even around these forums then…. At least not under you present ID..

          Dont hello people when u are the one in desperate need of being “hello-ed “ and a cup of coffee!
          Man you are ………… well i rather leave it at that …🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

          1. I meant to direct my “Hello” comment at Apple, not YOU Jimbo. Totally agree with you. Neglected to write Hello Apple (barley water excuse 🙃). Sorry for the confusion.

            “Jobe Whine Canube” Except for the does not apply “Whine” part, very creative. Applaud the effort… 👍🏻

  2. Normally I support Apples right to pick and choose the hardware they support but I think that Fasarius is right on this one. I remember the days of NuBus and wishing that we could use the cool EISA and PCI cards that other computers could use. When Apple adopted PCI in 1995 I was as excited as anybody at the prospect of only needing the right driver to enjoy the use of any card I wanted.

    Apple, please do not hold us hostage to your own hubris. NVIDIA support should be just as easy for end users as everything else on the Mac. The company needs to remember Steve’s own words “Simple can be harder than complex: You have to work hard to get your thinking clean to make it simple. But it’s worth it in the end because once you get there, you can move mountains.” He obsessed about working harder so that the end user had products the “just worked.” Please Apple, let out pro systems just work.

  3. ” ‘quiet hostility’ between long-time Apple managers and Nvidia”??

    Apple managers, get the hell over yourselves!! You’re still dealing with SAMSUNG for iPhone and iPad components but you want to screw over your high-performance Mac customers because of some infantile ego trip??

    Yes, Steve Jobs could hold a grudge. He is also able to get over them for the good of the customer. Customer focus is therefore obviously sorely lacking in a post-SJ Apple.

    1. “Apple managers, get the hell over yourselves!! You’re still dealing with SAMSUNG for iPhone and iPad components but you want to screw over your high-performance Mac customers because of some infantile ego trip??”

      AMEN! AMEN! AMEN!

  4. Just another F U from Apple to loyal pro users.

    You’d think after the 30th or 40th F U to pro users there wouldn’t be any left.

    Maybe it’s sadism on Apple’s part. How many strokes of the whip will Apple users endure before they buy current hardware and load it with Linux or Windows.

  5. What is this Mac thing of which you speak?

    response:
    Mac user since 1988, created one company based upon the fact that the work could not be done as well on a Mac, destroyed local competition because we could produce beautiful art work at far less cost and better quality than on Windows. Sold that company in 2002 to some Windows users who soon found they had to convert to Mac to be competive, they are still doing fine to this day.

    Free lance web developer from then to present and also contracted to a school system in an unrelated non-graphic position, but still do better and faster routine work on a Mac.

    I am sure none of this makes any sense to Timmy and Jony.

  6. typing this on a Cheese Grater with a Nvidia Card.
    I have two other upgraded Cheese Graters.
    Haven’t upgraded to Mojave due to fears earlier that Apple might pull such a stunt. (Having used Apple products for decades even before OSX I am paranoid) .

    Others here have done a good job talking about their valid concerns about Apple’s behaviour so I’ll not cover those issues.

    All I want to say that with Qualcomm exploding in their face, haven’t they learnt that more suppliers is better than Fewer (like they are using Intel modems now instead of Qualcomm) ?

    I understand the issues of Qualcomm are somewhat different with essential patents etc but still imagine if some day AMD Radeon tries a Qualcomm and raise prices for Apple way higher than it does for other clients, or they decide to stop innovating like IBM with Power PC. Without a alternate to bargain Apple is going to get screwed again and we might have generations of slower performing machines.

    The only thing that makes any kind of logic is that Apple is eventually going to make their own GPUs (whether this financially viable I have no idea).

    If you study what’s written about Apple’s FRUIT GARDEN, you will see Apple needed multiple suppliers of trees to solve their needs… (I’m adding this because Apple SVPs seem only to perk up with things like their fruit garden… )

    1. “whether this financially viable I have no idea“
      They’re already producing their own graphics chips. I think they are on their second generation and this years’ systems will have their third.

      Until VERY recently, Qualcomm was IT if you wanted quality. There were other vendors making cell networking hardware but, as we saw, they were behind Qualcomm. So you can’t have multiple vendors when there’s only one vendor supplying the needed quality. Now that Intel has capitalized on Qualcomm’s shortsightedness, there’s now actual competition.

      1. “they are already producing their own graphics chip”

        you’re going to pick on semantics? everyone here knows i’m talking high end Desktop and Laptop GPUs. if Apple have them why are they selling eGPUs or putting Radeons in their Macs?

        what i’m saying (which seems obvious) is whether it’s financially viable to produce the relative smaller number of high end GPUS, some giant with cooling fans etc., i’m not talking GPUs for phones etc. (although the mobile GPUs Apple has are excellent)

        1. They’re already making their own CPU, they’re already making their own GPU. It’s their own IP which has been rumored they will scale into laptops and desktops. Which means, as they’re not paying for IP, it’s the raw cost of materials plus however much they figure their R&D costs per chips, and they’ll just add hefty premium on top for any low sale, high performance chip. They’re not like AMD or Nvidia where they have to hope that someone’s going to buy the chip, they are the ONLY producer and the only buyer, so they use what they make… with some allowances made for CTO.

          As a result, just like the GPU’s in the phone are completely financially viable, the ones in any laptop or desktop will be completely financially viable because they’ll just pass the costs along, the same as they’re doing on the phone. If they run the numbers and determine that, to make a profit producing all the ones they expect to make, they have to charge $800 apiece, then they’ll just add $800 on the price of the system you buy.

          If they end up selling more than expected, well, that’s just more profit (because they aren’t going to drop the price once they break even on R&D.)

          1. lol

            Now because I factually pointed out GPUs Apple is producing now are for mobile you are saying high end GPUs which will go into a relatively small number of high end Macs (like Mac Pros) are viable while you’ve argued for years the high end Macs THEMSELVES are not viable…

            so which is it?

            (for myself I’m neutral . I even said ” The only thing that makes any kind of logic is that Apple is eventually going to make their own GPUs” while having the caveat “if it’s financially viable”. Note I’m talking Mac Pro type GPUs like the big beast in my Cheese Grater which has two fans and is bigger than the whole logic board of a laptop. Nvidia AMD etc make cards like those for hundreds of thousands of PCs a year. Apple’s can be viable or not, I don’t know .. . and neither do you ).

  7. Massive, massive, idiotic, stupid, retarded, idiosyncratic, out to lunch, stubborn, arrogant decision/position/attitude on whom ever’s side at Apple… mind boggling that sh-t like this can fly !
    Wow.

    But thank god for AMDS Readon VII announcement at ces, riveling nvidea RTX 2080.

      1. It’s Apple’s decision to write the drivers or not, and they haven’t. Professionals can write their own drivers and use the Nvidia card they want, no one is stopping them.

          1. Ohhhhhhhhhh, just did some more reading… I will amend that to say it’s Apple‘s decision to write the drivers or not, and they haven’t. Professionals and other owners have a decision on whether or not to use Maci’s or not.

            Pretty screwed up how they let you update, though. Looking to see if there was a disclaimer anywhere.

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