Four more years of Obama gets chilly Wall Street reception: Stocks begin in the red; Apple down

“Stocks were choppy this morning, as investors digested what President Obama’s reelection would mean for portfolios and Wall Street,” Abram Brown reports for Forbes. “When exit polls seemed to suggest the president’s victory late last night, stock futures declined precipitously. Then, as it became evident that Obama won a clear victory against Republican challenger Mitt Romney, stocks ventured higher. Though, in pre-market trading, futures were decidedly still down. Dow Jones industrial average futures edged down 0.6%. Nasdaq composite futures lost 0.7%. And S&P 500 futures gave up 0.7%.”

Brown reports, “Yet, Washington, D.C.’s landscape remains unchanged. Democrats control the White House and the Senate, Republicans run the House. Immediate attention will shift toward solving the fiscal cliff. ‘The history of the relationship between Obama and the Congressional leadership is one of eventual compromise, though not in the absence of circumstances forcing both parties to the table,’ says Citi economist Tina Fordham, who correctly called the preservation of D.C.’s status quo. ‘Our expectation continues to be that the trail of last-minute, heart-attack compromises will continue, given the same actors retaining their positions, with appetite for comprehensive reform limited.’

“In early morning trading, Western Union gained 7.8%, as Apple [is down 1.57%, losing $9.16 to $573.69],” Brown reports. “Pioneer Natural Resources rose 1.7%. Meanwhile, among the morning’s losers, Express Scripts gave up 11%, and Occidental Petroleum dropped 1.9%.”

Read more in the full article here.

[Thanks to MacDailyNews readers too numerous to mention individually for the heads up.]

155 Comments

    1. Hey, Trump wants to start a revolution.. You know the rich white dude against everyone else…. Sort of like how it was when England ruled…

      Anyone want to move to England??

    2. Lets see who is celebrating right now…

      Chavez
      Castro
      Putin
      The Obama phone lady with another 40 million free loaders
      Islamic terrorists
      Communists
      Millions of utterly clueless adolescents who think they voted for the “cool” guy
      Millions of illegal aliens
      Anarchists
      Do I need no continue?

      Good luck with your criminal illegal president, elected with illegal foreign money.

      Your economy will tank for another 4 years and the US constitution will be buried under a steaming pile of Obama shit.

      1. In your list of people who are celebrating, you left off one important group: The majority of the American people.

        Now go and focus your energies on something productive for the next four years. You’ll feel better for it.

            1. When citizens can elect politicians who promise to raid the income of societies producers in exchange for votes then, no. Theft by decree is just as egregious as theft by violence.

            2. Yes, because those of us here in America who make more should not pay more in taxes – unlike every other developed nation.

              I can’t imagine what you guys would do if you lived in Belgium, France, Italy, Britain, Brazil or even India (I could go on and on). Yes, we have a lower effective tax rate than all of these countries.

              What I often find humorous is that the people who are complaining the most about ‘merica taxing the “rich” are not rich at all. They are usually lower middle class/middle class people who keep buying stupid crap they don’t need with home equity loans and credit cards and can’t figure out why they can’t build wealth (but they look rich with their suburban McMansion – that they could lose any minute).

              The economics of the “job producers” need their tax breaks spin is pure fantasy being foisted upon you. How did businesses do well previously when tax rates were MUCH higher than even what we are proposing returning to?

              Anyway, no matter how much you guys complain, the people have spoken.

            3. The people who benefit from taking income from other people have spoken. I want to steal what you have because you have more than what I have and that is not fair.

              The man who steals from Peter to pay Paul can always count on the support of Paul. The people have spoken, indeed.

              Democracy is not long for this earth, sadly. This is not a sustainable path to follow.

            4. When my income is taxed and I do not receive some commensurate social benefit, but rather know that the resources I worked to obtain are given to greedy and envious malcontents then I am angry. Politicians that promote theft by decree are not ensuring social good but encouraging dependence and sloth.

            5. Look, I do very well – and I wouldn’t have had the same opportunities to do so as quickly in almost any other country in the world. I’m sure of that. And I grew up in a decidedly lower middle class household.

              I’ve posted here before that I personally feel that the tax code needs an overhaul. I didn’t jump on the “Romney is evil because of his tax rate” bandwagon, because I too took advantage of every deduction and favorable parts of the code available to me – I’d be insane not too.

              BUT – I have no problem paying more in taxes. The fact that my effective tax rate can be so much lower than someone who is working really hard to make ends meet is not fair. It just isn’t.

              I am a “job creator” in that I have 3 salespeople who work for me. I pay a lower tax rate than them.

              Will tax changes affect me? Yes. Will it kill me? No. And I will just continue to work harder to get more business make even more money under the new, more equitable rules.

              I thought the Republicans were all about hard work and putting in the effort?

            6. You have the right and the freedom to pay the government more taxes than you currently owe. Be my guest, pay more if you want. Sacrifice more if you want. No one is preventing you to give more of your income away. Do it.

            7. I’m not sure you understand. I never said that I would pay more than I owe. I said the tax code needs reform, which would then raise the amount I *do* owe.

              And I do give away plenty of money to the charities of my choice. Thank you very much.

            8. So your taxes go for no discernible social benefit to you? Newsflash! The BULK of your taxes go for our bloated Department of Defense and our pointless wars. Over the last 12 years we’ve spent about $15T on those items. If you haven’t received a benefit from that I’d suggest you complain to those who decided to put all of this on your credit card. Grow up and start thinking for yourself instead of swallowing the crap dealt out by the hucksters selling you on the idea of your own righteousness and victimhood. You’re a victim alright. You’ve fallen for the biggest con that ever was perpetrated on the American people. Rush, Hannity, and Fox News are laughing all the way to the bank. It’s really sad that you don’t even realize who’s been screwing you.

            9. Producers? Just exactly what do investment bankers, traders, real estate speculators produce, and 7-11 owners produce? It’s time to bury that crap and stop catering the PARASITES who’ve created this mess. Taxes are 1/3rd what they were when Reagan took office and what have we gotten in return? City streets that look like Calcutta and gated communities so the rich don’t have to smell them. Social Darwinism has been rejected. Get over it.

            10. “don’t have to smell them”… funny, that is what Democrat Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid says of “you” the visitors to America’s Capitol in Washington when the air conditioned ‘Visitor’s Center’ was opened. By the way, opened over budget and past opening target date! Your tax dollars being wisely spent by one who lives at the Ritz hotel. Tell me again, how do Democrats help the little people again?

              Also, speaking of wars, ‘War on Poverty’… how many years that been going on and how much money was wasted on that. I say wasted, because guess what… WE STILL HAVE POVERTY!

              Again, blessed government at work!

              I’m going to enjoy the next four years when I get to point out ‘you got what you voted for!’

            11. @ Twinmoon1 and others

              “The people who benefit from taking income from other people have spoken.”

              I work and have paid taxes since my first job at age 16 working as a cashier. I paid my way through college- taking not one thin dime despite being qualified for help.

              I served 8 years in the US Army working for a mere fraction of the pay the civil servants and contractors working beside me made and longer hours to boot.

              I give time, money and service to charity and do not deduct it from my taxes as I think deducting it makes it a transaction- not charity.

              Last year I paid Federal taxes in an amount greater than the median family income in the US.

              I am a liberal, a progressive, and love my country as much as any flag wrapped, pickup driving Republican.

              I don’t want to be a prosperous person in a country of poor people. I AM my brother’s keeper and I try to be a good steward of all that has been entrusted me.

              Maybe you wish to live in a social darwinist society where people treat their neighbors like prey, but I do not and am not ashamed to say so.

          1. These are the people who elected Oblabla

            Women who want to kill their babies
            Illegal invaders that want to live off your money for free
            A clueless generation that thinks a closet Muslim is going to ensure their freedom

            You all will be in for a rude awakening!

            1. Here’s one who apparently didn’t vote for Obama.
              Paranoid beyond belief, clueless beyond help, ineffective as a bandaid is for a giunbswhot wound…

              And mostly wondering what to do with all that empty space in his cranium.

              Quit staring at your sex organ and contribute to society, Ubermensch!

            2. Ubermac is a person who voted for Romney.

              These are people who want to save “babies” then forget about them once they are born. They want to starve them and their poor mother to death.

              These are the people who secretly hire the illegal “invaders” to clean their homes and to pick our vegetables. They like to demonize and stereo type them but they also like cheap vegetables and maximizing profits through low wages.

              Clueless rubes who somehow think Mormonism is more respectable than islam. These same people would vote for christian warriors to legislate towards theocracy never drawing the parallel between their actions and the Taliban.

              You got your rude awaking last night and it is now setting in. America rejected your nominee, your ballot initiatives and your teabagger ideals.

              Welcome to your mandate, now STFU…

            3. HTML5 Gordon is delusional. I don’t work hard and put forth the effort to support government. I work for myself, family, and friends. The government works for me. Socialism is all about how much government can enslave its citizens.

            1. @twimoon1: Romney couldn’t balance budgets either. He increased taxes and spending when he was governor of Mass. When he left he had increased his state’s deficit to the highest per capita of any state in the country. Why do you think Obama won the popular vote in Mass by 23 percentage points? It’s because the people there know what Romney was like.

            2. Romney lives in Massachusetts, New Hampshire and California. He was born in Michigan. He was Governor of Massachusetts.

              After running for President for 6 years he lost all of these states.
              Enough said.

          2. I have a sneaking suspicion that in the states with strong education systems, where people can identify countries on a map, where there is a realization that the US is not the only country in the world and there are places where democratic elections don’t have 7 hour line ups and the need for lawyers at polling stations, Obama got the majority of the votes. Romney bragged about his awesome education system in Massachusetts. Who won that state?

          1. The fact that you bring up religious terms in so many of your comments is completely lost on me. I just want you to realize that.

            And I’m sure you already have proof of these voting improprieties, right?

            1. We know that in many states illegal aliens can vote because the dems made sure no ID is required and we know that several million are in the US and voting for The Obamination.

              So, if we deduct these you have no majority of American voters voting for the Obamination.

            2. Utter crap, Ubermac. And, for the record, the issue is not with ID, but the restrictive types of ID that repubs demand. Types of ID that many elderly and poor people don’t have. The issue is that special voter IDs for those people were only available from one office, which was only open one day per week – in the middle of the week – when people would have to take a day off work to get there because there was only one office for a hundred miles. The rate of in-person voter fraud is miniscule. Even the republican association of attorneys said so. The number of legal residents who would have been disenfranchise by those laws were in the hundreds of thousands. And, strangely, the vast majority of them were democrats.
              You got your ass handed to you despite the record number of dirty tricks the Repubs got up to. The people of this country just don’t want your vitriol, your policies that favor the rich and punish the poor, or your scams.

      2. I rarely wish ill on others but you are a rare breed and I sincerely hope Obama’s re-election drives you to killing yourself so the rest of us can have some peace from your crazy ass backwards bullshit!

            1. MacFreek and twimoon1 –
              No, just openly hostile of the complete disrespect and hatred shown towards our newly reelected President. I disagree with UberA — violence is never called for — but gotta tell you I’m tired of right-wing racism and obstructionism.

      3. Wow, Uberdick, you really have a pretty tenuous grip on reality, don’t you? I’ll bet you write ranting letters to all the newspapers, too; all written in green ink, in block capitals.
        Who makes your tinfoil hats, btw?

    1. It’s okay. It really is. Sometimes calamitous events is required before something new and better can be built. Think of these 96 months of Obama as a necessary prelude if the U.S. is to eventually survive and then thrive.

      1. I was going to say some things, F10T12T?, but I deleted them. Instead, I repeat my call to sanity:

        In the aftermath of the Presidential election, let’s agree on a commitment to lay off of the partisan political posts for at least two years.

        Please don’t start the 2016 Presidential election now. Let’s just talk about Apple on MDN… Apple strategies, Apple products, Apple management, Apple rumors, and Apple’s competitors.

        1. Kingmel, you’ve been around these boards long enough to know that F10T12 didn’t start the political bantering, it has always been a part of MDN boards, going back more than 10 years. This place has long been the “Wild West” of the Mac community.

          That said, I was very sad about the election last night, but I’m glad that F14T16 is around to offer some hope. 🙂

          Each their own, you are probably celebrating last nights win. As in Sports, Politics has winners and losers. Winners celebrate, losers lick their wounds and regroup and make a plan to do better next time around.

          1. Yes, political bantering has been here a long time. However, F10T12 (I’ll never refer to this d-bag as F14T16) doesn’t give a rat’s ass about Apple or its products; he is, rather, a political troll who only shows up to spread his agenda and (completely incorrect) predictions. Both you, T Mac, and some others have valid, thoughtful opinions about a variety of topics other than politics; F10T12 sorely lacks this quality.

      2. Still delusional, Still hyperbolic, Still trying to reconcile your defeated positions, Still bending reality to fit your misguided narrative.

        Romney asked for a mandate, Conservatives asked for a mandate.

        Guess what? Here is your mandate: stop the nonsense, stop the hate, stop meddling with Justices, Constitutions, Women’s bodies, gays, no more wars. Stop trying to invoke religious laws, this isn’t Taliban country.

        You asked for it, you got. Now respect it, live with it. Deal with it.

        Eat your crow, you talked big and now reality has set in. What a lovely morning in America..

        1. “Here is your mandate: stop the nonsense, stop the hate, stop meddling with Justices, Constitutions, Women’s bodies, gays, no more wars. Stop trying to invoke religious laws, this isn’t Taliban country.

          You asked for it, you got. Now respect it, live with it. Deal with it.

          Eat your crow, you talked big and now reality has set in. What a lovely morning in America…”

          It’s a lovely effin morning after a hilariously joyful night. America b-slapped Amurrika.

          Moral of this story:
          Love your neighbor as yourself and don’t screw with his/her private life or voting rights.

          As to Wall Street:
          The market does better under Democrats. Just ask Sheldon Adelson. If the Republican and Crossroads donor can stay out of jail.

      3. NOW crawl back into and stick your ugly face into your ass, ITOLD YOU YOU WOULD GET THE SHELACKING OF YOUR LIFE…

        You and all your ignorant, hateful and stupid rabid tea party scum can leave his forum to Apple and a civil dialog.

        Yes we did!

      4. “It’s okay. It really is.”
        To quote the former 1/2 term Governor of Alaska
        You betcha

        In 2014 the Republicans will lose the US House of Representatives as they continue to devolve into a regional party of insignificance.

        2010 was the Teabagger high water mark.
        iCal it.

      5. What an ass you are Ron. Why don’t you go back to England? What did we do to deserve you here?

        Like the Republican party last night – you are a loser.

        We have spoken.

        1. You are a dickhead, F2014T2016. You and your Repug cronies had better put a stop to your obstructionist policies immediately so the country can move forward, or there will BE NO 2014 onward gravy train for them to ride from their corporate sponsors, as we will kick their asses out of office.

    1. Yes, what a horrible man! Doesn’t drink, no fscking hookers, nice loving family, believes in God, made a fortune, saved the Olympics – everything the modern day soulless single Lib hates.

      He’s a RINO when a fiscal conservative was needed. But, the country is not yet ready for a real fiscal conservative. More pain is required first before the U.S. finally takes their medicine.

      If not, they will die.

            1. True, in the old days. We Christians (well 99% of us) have evolved and left that behind and reject that practice. A BIG chunk of Muslims have not, and are attempting to promote and expand this “believe or die” practice. That is the difference.

            1. I’m well aware of it, but old Moham is the one who left them the marching orders to kill anyone who doesn’t believe in these extreme views.

              And “school these days?” Sorry but my schooling was many years ago in a good Northeast school back in the day when they actually taught the truth.

      1. More pain is apparently required for everyone to accept the fiscal sacrifices needed to trim the deficit. I have not seen one high-level political player on either side of the political spectrum who is willing to stand behind the need to pay more taxes and accept less services until the budget is balanced and we can begin paying off the debt. Meanwhile, the size of our national debt service payments sap our ability to do much of anything. I don’t want to hear anything about tax cuts until we make substantial spending cuts, and that includes defense.

        1. The only pain Obama and his cronies believe needs felt is the loss of economic freedom of the producers from higher taxes and fees. Theft by decree will be their rallying cry as they continue to drain the resources of workers to payoff their greedy, malcontented “citizens”.

          1. If I hear the word “producers” one more time my head’s going to explode. Producers are people who actually work and make things. This would include farmers, assembly line workers, miners, fishermen. It would NOT include investment bankers, defense contractors, politicians, traders, talking heads, CEOs, accountants, lawyers, and the idle rich. These are more properly known as PARASITES! They make money by charging more for a worker’s labor than they pay for it. They sit at a desk and manipulate numbers. They produce NOTHING.

            1. “It would NOT include investment bankers, defense contractors, politicians, traders, talking heads, CEOs, accountants, lawyers, and the idle rich.”

              My friend Zeke. The above professions provide services that lead to profits.

              The workers you mention that produce physical products, also contribute to profits.

              It’s all good. 🙂

        2. Well, requiring the wealthiest Americans and corporations to pay a higher (and more fair) share of taxes also will be part of any successful plan to tackle that national debt.

          So, let’s get on with it. And while we’re at it, let’s get rid of the obstructionist politicians, ike Mitch McConnell (R-KY), who stand in the way of compromise — and progress. I’m almost 60, and even I recognize this guy’s time has passed. It’s time to hand the reins over to a new generation who will put America before a political party, Mr. McConnel. Get out of the way. McConnel is up for re-election in 2014. Let’s kick this guy to the curb: find a Kentucky voter and slap some sense into him/her.

      2. You apparently don’t realize or remember that Romney asked for, and got, $1.3 Billion from the US CONGRESS to bailout the Olympics.

        Romney didn’t “save'” the 2002 Olympics, US TAXPAYERS did.

      3. I would completely agree with you except for one small point…
        You haven’t a clue about what’s going on.

        Apparently most Americans don’t like a man who made all his money like some villain from a Charles Dickens novel.

        Let’s see- hostile takeover and layoff workers to sustain short term success. Check.

        Pocket huge sums of money by investing in off shore corporations who hide behind their tax status and contribute nothing to the economy. Check.

        Make public proclamations that say you have easy answers to very complex problems. Check.

        Encourage a fiscal policy that does nothing to stabilize currency here and throughout the world. Check.

        Be completely clueless regarding how foreign policy and diplomacy work. Check.

        Espouse the philosophy that Americans are superior to other nationalities and are thus entitled to a disproportionate amount of the world’s wealth and resources. Check.

        Disavow a health care model that showered great promise in his home states, but was the target to evisceration the moment he seized the national spotlight. Check.

        Yeah, outside of those small things, I completely agree with you.

    1. Dude, the Republicans own one half of one third of the government – the House. SCOTUS is split, and the Dems own the rest. That is a mandate FOR BOTH SIDES TO COMPROMISE!

      Voters are saying we’ve got to get together and actually run the country. They want gridlock for partisan political purposes to STOP. The Republicans need to listen and start compromising.

    2. Funny how the Repubs claim a mandate on a thin margin, but are the first to disclaim a mandate for Democrats.

      Age of Supremes over the next term.

      Scalia 76-80
      Kennedy 76-80
      Ginsburg 79-83
      Breyer 74-78

      Dems have the White House and Senate. The Republican SCOTUS is getting ready to blue up. And get MUCH younger.

      A Democratic House is coming in 2014. iCal it.

          1. Obama will continue to blame Bush (and anyone else) for whatever reason. Obama can find any excuse for himself and latch on to every success as an example of his “leadership”. The narcissist-in-chief cannot change.

            1. No he won’t, because the economy IS turning round. That’s why the GOP were so desperate to win this one. They wanted to make out that the mess that Obama inherited in 2009 was only sorted when President Romney took office.

              Shame that the electorate appear to have seen through that one. The growth that is coming will now go down as Obama’s doing. He’ll leave office in 2016 on a high, possibly high enough to propel another Democrat straight into the Oval Office.

              Must really eat a few people up that.

      1. Of course! Bush put it all on your credit card and Obama showed you the credit card statement that eventually came in. Of course, you weren’t paying attention because the Right-wing media kept telling you how righteous you were and how the Evil Left was victimizing you. Now you’re waking up with a hangover and blaming everyone but yourself.

  1. As a non-American observer (with no horse in the race), there is one thing I can say here:

    You cannot win presidential election without women and Latino votes. And you can not get women to vote for you with a platform like the Republican one of today. Things can only get worse in the future if the platform remains as hostile to women as it is today.

    1. The Republicans lost badly among not only women, but also minorities. Badly! Your statement is an indication of what the Republican party needs to do – self examine its own policies and what they support, because unless they dump the policies that are so harmful to women and minorities, they will marginalize themselves for the foreseeable future as a national party. The percentage of whit voters was down another two percent yesterday, continuing a trend that is decades old. Demographics are against their current policies.

      1. A polite, articulate, astute, eloquent and substantive post. Really nice…

        I’m sure very few Americans on this forum would agree with any part of it (based on the Americans I have met in my life who are all polite, tolerant, considerate…)

    2. +1 on each and every point

      And what scares the bejeezus out of the Pubtards the most is that due to immigration and declining white birthrates, hispanics are expected to be in the majority by 2041.

    3. Agree. The Republicans have to let go of this illogical anti-abortion stand or they will never win an election unless their Candidate is over the top amazing exceptional, which it has not been in a long time.

  2. If it hadn’t been for a massive smear campaign by a completely corrupt liberal press and the illegal contributions that Oblabla had collected from foreign countries Romney would have won this election.

    This president is a criminal by definition of US law, but because is black he is getting pass. 2 other presidents have been impeached for much lesser crimes.

          1. Übermac (properly spelt with an umlaut) seems to have a serious problem. He doesn’t quite know why he doesn’t like the sitting American President, but he doesn’t like him, so he re-uses the standard campaign talking points. He liked the other guy better and he is just very unhappy that the other guy lost (never mind the massive amounts of money poured into his campaign by the über-powerful super-PACs).

            There are many participants on this forum who provide articulate and well argumented points from their conservative angle. Then there are guys such as Übermac…

    1. I’m not sure what are you trying to argue. Obama didn’t take office in September; he has been in office for almost four years. In that time AAPL went up by almost 500%. If AAPL performance were the benchmark for Obama’s, if I were you, I would vote for a constitutional amendment to keep Obama president for life…

  3. Predrag, hostile to women? In what way? Because some of us don’t like it when they abort human beings because they don’t like the sex, have to finish school first, or because they’re not in the mood? Or is it because we expect women who choose to have sex to buy their own fkng contraception? My gawd, republicans r monsters for protecting life and promoting personal responsibility! Get a life and please don’t EVER come to the USA! Liberals r monsters!

    1. You seem to be extremely sensitive on this subject. I was rather careful not to state my personal opinion on this matter.

      The election numbers are extremely obvious: women voted in large numbers for Obama. Was it because of the choice / life issue? Was it the pay disparity? Maternity benefits? Some other issue? I won’t pretend I know; I’m just saying, Romney was apparently hostile to women, since they so overwhelmingly voted for the other guy.

    2. It’s obvious you’re not just hostile to women. You actually hate them. Women are best placed to make this decision for themselves when a pregnancy isn’t wanted. Some choose to keep the child, others choose to abort, all will be agonised over.

      This idea that women schedule in a weekly abortion between meetings in the office and going to the gym is utter fantasy from the Religious Right.

    3. What a disingenuous, callous, stupid post.

      You really think women run out and get abortions on a whim? You really think they enjoy it and never think about it again.?You ignorant fool.

      If Republicans care so much about the unborn, why do they hate them once they are born? Republicans oppose feeding them, providing them healthcare, want to eliminate funding to educate them.

      About the only thing the republicans want them for is cannon fodder. It is proven that Republicans have abortions, your party uses this wedge to gain support for other things against your own best interest.

      The GOP just cannot get off the religious right tit and until it does, I predict more loses.

      Leave women alone, leave gays alone, stop preaching to everyone. Believe what you want, stop trying to force it on me. You are no better than the Taliban when you do…

  4. I would like someone anyone left or right, repub or dem, liberal or conservative to explain to me how we are to going to pay for 6 trillion in new debt? And if we repeat the last 4 yrs how we will pay for 12 trillion in new debt on top of the 5 trillion Bush gave us. It was wrong when Bush did it as I agreed with Obama that it was irresponsible, but then Obama up’d the ante by spending more than Bush did in 8 yrs in just 4. And don’t tell me raising taxes or cutting military spending will pay for the tremendous debt we have. You could tax the rich at 100% and it would keep the government running for about a month n half, then when their money is gone, their businesses are gone then what? Where will the money come from? I completely serious here not wanting to get in tit for tat name calling against either side, I just want someone to logically explain how we can continue to pay for the enormous size that our government has become?

    1. Good question…. answer… there isn’t a way….

      There is not enough money to deal with the 16 trillion – soon to be 20-24 trillion….

      and let’s not even talk about the future *UNFUNDED* liabilities of an additional 100-200 trillion…

      turn out the lights – it’s over. It is mathematically impossible….

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