Reports spreading across the web that Intel Macs can’t boot Windows XP might be inaccurate, reports Dan Warne for APC Magazine.
“Tech journos far and wide have been quick to jump on the story that while Apple says it isn’t doing anything to specifically prevent people from installing Windows on an Intel-based Mac, the new Extensible Firmware Interface (EFI) that Apple is using on the new Macs won’t work with current generations of Windows,” Warne reports. “EFI is the next-generation replacement for the 20-year-old BIOS, the oldest part of modern PCs which is in desperate need of an overhaul. EFI allows devices in the PC to be initialised before the operating system boots, and has features like full network support before the PC has even booted, allowing drivers to be downloaded and updated before an operating system loads.”
“However, Intel Australia, while being careful not to comment on Apple’s hardware specifically, says motherboards based on the Intel 945 chipset already support EFI and can boot Windows with no problems,” Warne reports. “This cryptic statement can’t be taken as full reassurance though: it may be that 945 boards support EFI but do not come with it installed by default. Officially, Microsoft says it will support EFI natively with Windows Vista, so it’s almost certain that Intel-based MacBook Pros and iMacs will be able to boot Vista when it is released later this year. But a year is a long time in computing and there would be great utility for many users in a notebook that could run Windows XP during work time and OS X at home, or one that could easily be rebooted to Windows to play the latest games.”
“A Mac that can legally run Windows/Linux/OS X on the one box is the ‘ultimate PC’ in compatibility terms, which should further drive hardware sales. Considering Apple includes the operating system with every Mac purchase, its OS revenue isn’t endangered by allowing people to install Windows on a Mac post-sale,” Warne writes. “Of course, Apple can’t condone or encourage running Windows on Macs, because that would cause Mac developers to question whether they should continue investing in the OS X platform if Apple is not fully committed. It’s a ‘wink wink, nod nod’ situation, where Apple must know that allowing users to run Windows on a Mac can only help boost Apple’s bottom-line.”
Full article here.
MacDailyNews Note: APC is awaiting an official response from Microsoft USA on how Windows XP works with EFI. They promise to update their article when they get new information.
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Those commenters who are saying that Windows apps should now be a simple re-compile to run on OS X are confused.
PowerPC OS X apps are a “simple recompile” (as long as they don’t have byte-order issues) for Intel OS X. That’s because the OS, frameworks and APIs remain the same – the code just needs to be turned into a different set of machine language instructions.
Porting apps Windows -> Mac OS X is still a very complex process, because all the OS services are different, the kernel is different, filesytstem is different etc.
The only hurdles that have been eliminated by the Intel switch are the same tiny ones that Mac developers had to jump to get from PPC to Intel. The big ones are all still there.
Here’s an article that I actually emailed its author about:
http://overclockers.com/tips00899
I told him about EFI and advised him to do his homework before flinging poop.
Even if it can’t boot Windows, EFI only or whatever, could an Intel-Mac boot into Linux?
There is no way to beat Microsoft in the desktop market without making OS X available to all x86 architecture.
“There is no way to beat Microsoft in the desktop market without making OS X available to all x86 architecture.”
Steve has said over and over that Apple isn’t trying to beat Microsoft in the OS market.Apple just wants to increase its market share a few points. It would be a big mistake for Apple to try and go for more than that in the forseeable future.
The infrastructure in place in the business world for Windows is formidable. Apple has the best OS, but the best isn’t always the most popular. Being the best comes at a price.
Apple maintains its tight integration of hardware and software by NOT allowing other hardware to run OS X.
1) I’m sure you can’t insert a Windows XP disk into a Mac and let it install. The OS would eject the disk.
2) I’m sure you couldn’t boot to the CD because the EFI would tell you it is not properly formatted for Apple bootup.
3) If you can’t install the disk when you are logged in or do it from bootup, how can you install a new OS?
4) You can’t format the Windows XP disk into a Mac friendly format (because it’s illegal). You can’t change the filesystem to one that is Windows friendly at bootup. You also can’t change the EFI to accept a different type of OS!
5) So how in the world could you ever install another OS in parallel with Mac OS X that isn’t something like Linux. And Linux sucks!
before EFI, apple computers used Open Firmware. Not BIOS, as it seems like this writer implies. PC computers use BIOS
MacDude: get over yourself. Your FUD and extensive doom and gloom don’t play well here. You are just another Windoze Fanboy… how sad that you hide behind a Mac Minded moniker. Vista will no more close the gap between OS X and it’s predecessors than any previous version of Windows did (with maybe the exception of ’95 and that is only because prior iterations were so severely unusable). Only winfans/Mac-haters see it that way. And for the record I have never personally met a Windoze switcher i.e. someone who went from the Mac to ‘Doze because after trying it they just preferred ‘Doze. Not once. I’m sure they exist. But the greater majority of people who try the Mac for more than 15 minutes love it. You’re entitled to your opinion but don’t confuse opinion with reality.
Games you say (well, actually others have said it)? So what… most people don’t go to work to play games. If they do then I would suggest that they do their paper route not on their bikes but as a passengers in their Mommy’s car so they can play their PSP in between delivery throws.
Third party software? I hope you’re not talking about sh!tty little programs like another weather/stock watcher or something else you can easily do with a widget (as an aside I’ve never had a widget bring my system down like any of the hundred or so tray utilities I’ve used on ‘Doze). If you’re talking about WordPerfect or other variants (read altnernatives) to major productivity tools/apps well there’s enough of that on the Mac to get just about any job done that puts food on your table. And if not, well, VPC seems to handle most of that stuff pretty well. And if VPC doesn’t work then use ‘Doze at your own risk and only where necessary (that list is tiny indeed from my experience and we’re talking about everything from retail to research to broadcasting to medicine).
The only way a dual booting Mac hurts the future of the Mac is if viruses frequently wipe out a Mac’s drives while running in Vista. Then the unknowing will most likely blame Apple for not protecting them from ‘Doze vulnerabilities and their credibility will be hurt. That’s something I’ve been saying since the first Intel announcement.
And Billy boy doesn’t need to “ALLOW” anything. Some things are beyond even his control (though I’m sure most WinFans can’t see that). Last I checked he’s been trying like hell to unseat the iTMS/iPod experience with his own brand of entertainment experience. Not many people are buying it. And maybe they won’t ever. I’m the last person to underestimate the tenacity and perserverance of MS. But I am also the last person to discount Steve’s. He’s grown up. Now it’s time for the rest of the computing world. (and it’s already started : }
MacDude wrote:
“BECASUE THATS WERE ALL THE THIRD PARTY SOFTWARE IS”
How many relevant third-party apps are PC only? iLife and Mac Office (for better or worse) are very strong selling points.
“Eventually Mac users will just use Vista out of neccessity.”
My sister just switched TO Mac FROM Windows out of necessity. She couldn’t handle all of Windows’ problems anymore. I bet it’d be a safe to say she isn’t alone.
“we are history with a dual booting Mactel.”
Dual-booting is too much of a hassle to become mainstream. If I were a switcher, I’d just keep my old PC for the Windows stuff I still had to do.
“How many relevant third-party apps are PC only?”
Sigh. Sometimes I wonder why I even try to educate some people. Item: sometime last year I was speaking with an IT tech from a rather large german company and asked him about their migration from Windows 2000 to Windows XP, especially regarding their application testing and certification process for the new OS. Would any of you like to take a guess at how many individual applications they had to test and certify? Come on, be brave. The answer: 11,000 individual apps. And all of them Windows-only. Try recompiling all of that to work on OS X.
Please. Get a clue.
lets look at this from a windows users point of view…now they can have a mac that runs the os that they are used to and keep their software investment. it must feeel good
Super Tim – I was well aware that PPC Macs use Open Firmware (I’m a long time Mac user), but discussing Open Firmware in relation to booting Windows on an Intel Mac would be irrelevant, because Open Firmware has never been used on the Intel platform and never will be. Now Macs are essentially standard PCs, the comparison is with other standard PCs – not PPC Macs!
The ultimate strategy to beat Windows:
1. Mactel.
2. Mac OS X on Dell and HP.
3. Mac OS X on any PC out there.
4. Fully open Mac OS X. As Linux is.
5. Free Mac OS X. As Linux is.
Consequences: Windows and Linux are history!
“Come on, be brave. The answer: 11,000 individual apps.”
The question stands: How many of them are relevant?
Sure, those apps may be critical FOR ONE CUSTOMER. They’re probably custom-built in-house apps. And that company likely buys mass volumes of the lowest-cost PC hardware they can find. For now they’re well outside of Apple’s market.
I’m talking about the consumer market. How many relevant PC-only apps are there that have no non-PC equivalent? Sure there are many thousands of titles, hell even home-improvement stores sell PC apps now. But so what. Better to have the top titles than thousands of also-rans.