Reports spreading across the web that Intel Macs can’t boot Windows XP might be inaccurate, reports Dan Warne for APC Magazine.
“Tech journos far and wide have been quick to jump on the story that while Apple says it isn’t doing anything to specifically prevent people from installing Windows on an Intel-based Mac, the new Extensible Firmware Interface (EFI) that Apple is using on the new Macs won’t work with current generations of Windows,” Warne reports. “EFI is the next-generation replacement for the 20-year-old BIOS, the oldest part of modern PCs which is in desperate need of an overhaul. EFI allows devices in the PC to be initialised before the operating system boots, and has features like full network support before the PC has even booted, allowing drivers to be downloaded and updated before an operating system loads.”
“However, Intel Australia, while being careful not to comment on Apple’s hardware specifically, says motherboards based on the Intel 945 chipset already support EFI and can boot Windows with no problems,” Warne reports. “This cryptic statement can’t be taken as full reassurance though: it may be that 945 boards support EFI but do not come with it installed by default. Officially, Microsoft says it will support EFI natively with Windows Vista, so it’s almost certain that Intel-based MacBook Pros and iMacs will be able to boot Vista when it is released later this year. But a year is a long time in computing and there would be great utility for many users in a notebook that could run Windows XP during work time and OS X at home, or one that could easily be rebooted to Windows to play the latest games.”
“A Mac that can legally run Windows/Linux/OS X on the one box is the ‘ultimate PC’ in compatibility terms, which should further drive hardware sales. Considering Apple includes the operating system with every Mac purchase, its OS revenue isn’t endangered by allowing people to install Windows on a Mac post-sale,” Warne writes. “Of course, Apple can’t condone or encourage running Windows on Macs, because that would cause Mac developers to question whether they should continue investing in the OS X platform if Apple is not fully committed. It’s a ‘wink wink, nod nod’ situation, where Apple must know that allowing users to run Windows on a Mac can only help boost Apple’s bottom-line.”
Full article here.
MacDailyNews Note: APC is awaiting an official response from Microsoft USA on how Windows XP works with EFI. They promise to update their article when they get new information.
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A universal booting Mac will be the end of Mac OS X as the eventual progression of lazy developers insisting Mac users boot into Vista to run their software
Apple needs to protect themselves from the 95% market share of Windows to force developers to (easily) compile for Mac OS X at the same time as Vista.
According to my calculations, Windows should run like it does everywhere else – like shite!
Development costs and low market share is the reason many games and programs like AutoCad don’t spend the resources to compile for Mac OS X.
If Apple can reduce that cost substancially, making it almost effortless to compile Windows code for Mac OS X, then it would be a attractive option for them.
We get all the Windows software compiled for our OS without having to run Windows at all.
Why boot Windows when you don’t have too? Right?
It’s all the third party Windows software we want.
What are you smoking, MacDude? My understanding is it’s an extended, and expensive, process. Intel chips will probably allow recompiled programs to run better in OS X, but do you have any basis for thinking that this will result in major savings in developer time/money? Really, I’m curious to know if you have any facts to back this up. (And I hope you do!)
Jake
If Apple has not removed EFIs built-in compatibility with BIOS – and hence XP – it should be fine. What MacDailyNews didn’t quote:
“Some clues on legacy operating system compatibility with EFI might be found in Intel’s EFI mini-site, specifically the part about a new compatibility framework that it created recently. From page four. […] [Technical stuff] […] So, as long as Apple has included a Compatibility Support Module, Intel-based Macs should be able to boot XP. It seems unlikely that Apple would have left this out. It has already said it isn’t doing anything to prevent Windows from booting on a Mac.”
Why would I want to boot into XP/Vista for?
It’s all the third party Windows software we want.
sooooo.. what I’ve said lots since the intel announcement….
Whats the point of writing OSX programs if a single computer can run both OS’s?
If the problem is the Operating System, then why would you want to boot it on a Mac?
“EFI allows devices in the PC to be initialised before the operating system boots, and has features like full network support before the PC has even booted, allowing drivers to be downloaded and updated before an operating system loads.”
Does this worry anyone else? It seems like a potential way to bypass OS security.
I’ll stick with VPC & 2000 Pro for the one proprietary app that I have to be able to demo – even if it means waiting for VPC 8 before I get a Mactel.
For those that have to have access to Win the VPC route is, I’ve found’ the best way. You can isolate it from the internet – avoiding malware – and it actually runs better (not faster) than on a PC. No crashes in the time I have used it, but I use it very little.
All dual booting does is open you up to a lot of problems. VPC 8 is going to be significantly faster because it can directly go to the Intel hardware. That should be fast enough for most people who need to get into Win.
The really interesting thing about new Mac computers that no one has answered yet is, what have Apple done to stop OSX ending up on PCs?
Have Apple used a more secure technology tan they used with the dev kits to keep OSX away from the 95% market share?
If OSX is widely pirated how will Apple respond?
Personally I am looking forward to owning a 17″ Macbook Pro when it arrives. It will be my first Mac….first of many!
I don’t see developers abandoning mac development just because you can run windows. It’s like telling the customer to go out and buy a copy of Vista, hopefully it doesn’t require any extra workaround to get it running properly and is stable and then buy our software and install it on windows.
I don’t think so.
The company that develops native OS X software will get the business over the one that doesn’t.
“A Mac that can legally run Windows/Linux/OS X on the one box is the ‘ultimate PC’ in compatibility terms…”
I already have the ultimate PC, it’s called a POWERMAC G5 and it doesn’t need a cheap, faulty, imitation OS running side by side with the best.
I’d like to see a UNIX based OS integrated into a pair of Dingos that would measure and adjust for comfort in real-time. Why?
‘Cause those boots are made for walkin’! And that’s not all they’ll do. <rimshot>
(And re-booting could be quite awkward and embarassing. Wear clean socks.)
ROFLMAO at Ampar’s statement…
ampar and the macdaddyoh are spot on. i have a G5 iMac; why would i sully it by wanting to run ‘doze on it. doing so would be much like pouring fecal material on it. dull is for ‘doze; Macs are for lovin’!
Why doesn’t someone try to load Windows on the new iMac and see if it works? If it does, whatever, and if it doesn’t,whatever. OSX is why Macs are selling at record levels so who cares if it boots Windows.
The only ones that might use it are the developers themselves to test cross platform compatability.
I guess the Windoze side of a new Mac could in theory become infected with a virus… oops, I said that in the singular, with many viruses’ mal and spy-wares. I wonder whether there will be some cross-over potential to exploit the OS-X side of a Mac running both OSs.
Ferrari engine in a Ford or a Ford engine in a Ferrari…
Mac OS X on Dell and XP/Vista on an iMac, neither one will be supported by Apple because both configurations are fraught with potential problems. It is only when one company designs BOTH the OS and hardware as a unified tool that it has any hope of stability.
Anyone one that wants anything less will get what they seek.
It’s called brand dilution
Microsoft has the power to copy, and copying Mac OS X is exactly what they are doing.
Right now XP is insecure crapopla, but that can and will change, enough that the differences between Mac OS X and Vista will be little at all. Vista will look good and run good.
Now if we have a dual OS booting Mac, and if developers are lazy and dont’ bother compiling for Mac OS X, insisting Mac users boot into Vista.
What is that going to do for Mac market share?
That’s right, you can trot your MacBook Pro around and be fashionable, but 90% of the time it will be booted in Windows BECASUE THATS WERE ALL THE THIRD PARTY SOFTWARE IS
Eventually Mac users will just use Vista out of neccessity. Just like Apple has to use Intel chips now.
Unless Bill Gates allows Mac OS X to take over Vista market share, we are history with a dual booting Mactel.
“My understanding is it’s an extended, and expensive, process. Intel chips will probably allow recompiled programs to run better in OS X, but do you have any basis for thinking that this will result in major savings in developer time/money? Really, I’m curious to know if you have any facts to back this up. (And I hope you do!)”
My understanding is that SJ said at last year’s WWDC, that due to the switch to Intel Apple’s developer tools would allow developers to easily compile programs
It’s simple; buy a Mac computer that will run both operating systems, and you will eventually gravitate more and more to the OSX side due to it’s superiority to XP , and most probably Vista.
Those of us that have to run a proprietary Windows app can run it, and Apple is the good guy.
I think that will cause developers to write more OSX software, not less.
It may already be happening if you pay attention to press releases, Garmin for GPS apps, for example.
It could also be that VPC on Mac with Intel may run very well. No problem.
Apple will never allow Vista to run on Mactels, Phil was playing with Microsoft when he made that comment.
Phil and Steve full well know the consequences of a 800 lb Gorrilla M$ with 95% in market share sitting on a apple 4%.
M$ would take over in a heartbeat, it’s the internal hardware in PPC Mac’s that’s keeping M$ at bay now, making them produce VPC, but if Mac’s and PC’s were identical inside, nothing would stop M$ from moving in for good.
Intelligent developers are going to want to have their applications run on the most stable platform. Therefore, all else being equal, MAC OS X wins hands down.
Therefore, the notion that developers will not bother developing and compiling for OS X is ludicrous.
Get ready for AAPL to double again.
Even if BIOS compatibility is NOT included on Apple’s EFI … (After all, why would they need it?) you can still boot XP or any version of Windows or Linux by using GRUB which supports EFI and can directly load Windows and Linux. Beyond that it’s a driver issue.