“Several people have discovered that the new Intel kernel Apple has included with the Developer Kit DVD uses TCPA/TPM DRM. More specifically, it includes ‘a TCPA/Palladium implementation that uses a Infineon 1.1 chip which will prevent certain parts of the OS from working unless authorized,'” an anonymous reader writes at Slashdot.
Quite a discussion is taking place about this over on Slashdot here.
MacDailyNews Note: Back on June 14, 2005, we reported on a vunet article that explained, “Apple could use the Trusted Platform Module (TPM) chip to ensure that only Mac computers can run its OS X operating system, according to a news analysis from Gartner.”
Related MacDailyNews articles:
Apple could use Trusted Platform Module chip to keep Mac OS X off non-Macs – June 14, 2005
So!
Wasn’t this expected? It doesn’t bother me at all. I don’t plan on using OS X on a generic box.
MW: window… How appropriate!
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Tough luck for all those bozos who wanted to run OS X on a Dell POS.
And this is a surprise?
OS X only works on Apple Mac boxes now and this ensures the same will be true for the new intel machines. And that’s a problem how? Why would any self respecting mac user want to use a non-apple box anyway?
There will be Windows bozos that will want to build a generic Mactel box and use pirated OS X on it. This should make it harder.
All Apple needs is for 15% to 20% of Mac users to be like Windows users and steal the OS while not even buying their hardware.
I guess this means OS X will never be big in Asia.
The thing I care about is how easy it is to fix a Mac. If things just get too messed up for some reason, you can easily re-install the OS from any disk.
I also like the ability to build systems onto small hard disks. When a client purchases new machines, we pull out the standard configuration and install it with carbon copy cloner or disk copy.
If you have to start worrying about that stupid DRM crap, it won’t just make sure every copy of the system is paid for, it will add hours to maintenance procedures. This costs $$$. Consultants like me that install multiple systems in an hour now have to start keeping track of serial numbers, and the entire process is made slower.
I hope Apple tries to make this as convenient as possible.
Good! That’s a relief…
I hope all this does is verify that the hardware is Apple-certified and that is all. I appreciate how Apple products work together and I can move my OS from one system to another. If I can only compile on one machine, but can’t then boot another Mac with that pre-compiled system I’ll be hurting.
When you are fixing damaged systems you don’t always have the luxury of DVD drives and networking.
And tough luck to those who buy and authorized copy of OS X… This can be used to verify unauthorized copies of OS X don’t get installed on machines other than the one for which it was purchased. Check out M$’s Vista authorization scheme for a glipse of the future.
Meant to say:
And tough luck to those who don’t buy an authorized copy of OS X… This DRM feature can be used to verify unauthorized copies of OS X that get installed on machines other than the one for which it was purchased. Check out M$’s Vista authorization scheme for a glipse of the future.
I WILL NOT EVER buy a mac with trusted computing. Period.
I’ve been a mac user since 1996 and have finally accepted the Intel switch. However, I DO NOT WANT trusted computing in my computer. Apple, you can go eff yourself if you do this… I’ll go with AMD and Linux.
– Mark
Mark, chill.
The stuff in the OS right now is about making sure you can only run Mac OS X on an Apple Mac.
You can’t run the PowerPC version of Mac OS X because there’s code in the OS that makes sure you’re using an Apple Mac. It checks that Mac ROMs are there. This is the same deal – there’s no Mac ROMs in the new experimental Intel Macs, and there won’t be in the release version either, so they’re checking other chips instead.
This is not “Trusted Computing” as was put forward a while back.
Please, please, please, tell all of your PC geek friends that dream of running pirated OS X on their Intel-based crapboxes…
1. Apple is a COMPUTER HARDWARE company, more like Dell (if Dell spend ANY money on innovation), and nothing like Microsoft.
2. Apple makes THEIR OS to run on THEIR computers for THEIR customers and THEIR 3rd party vendors.
3. Apple’s switch to Intel processors for THEIR computers has absolutely NOTHING to do with the millions of existing Intel crapboxes made by other companies. Crapbox users have absolutely no sense of logic. If my crapbox has an Intel and Macs use Intel, then my crap box can be a Mac. NO!!! There is much more to a computer than the CPU chip. There is no doubt that Macs will NOT use an off-the-shelf generic mother board. Apple has NEVER used ANY generic hardware designs, and they are NOT going to do it now. Just as they have always done, Apple will have a customized mother board utilizing customized chips. Just because two cars utilize the same engine doesn’t mean that the doors, tires and seats are interchangeable. They could even use vastly different fuels.
4. If they want a smooth running Mac OS X with the industry’s best customer service and support, they can save themselves hundreds of hours of headaches downloading “trusted” pirated versions, seeking obscure “fixes” from 15 year old kids in India, and writing childish rants on lame web sites, by merely scraping up $499 ($479 w/ student discount), strolling down to their local Apple store and buying a Mac mini. If they do not think that their own wasted time and energy are worth $499, then neither will anyone else.
Yeah, good luck with that transition, Mark. You’ll be back with Apple faster than you can blink the first time you try to run a program you just downloaded and you don’t have all the dependencies.
Mike Buonarroti – Italy: Be careful calling Intel computers crapboxes. The new Apple Intlel computers will have:
an off the shelf CPU
an off the shelf video card
off the shelf USB2.0
off the shelf PCI slots
off the shelf PCI Express? – we hope so at least. the crappy AGP that current Apple G5s have is embarrassing
off the shelf ethernet
off the shelf SATA
etc., etc., etc…..
Need I go on? The motherboard will be designed by Apple and it will be so much better than those crapboxes even though they will be using all of the same off the shelf parts as the crapboxes? You need to read further down on MDN. Rumor is that Apple has already gone to one of those crapbox makers, Sony, to help them design the new Powerbooks because Apple has no expertise designing for Intel.
I don’t mind the DRM to require that OS X only works with Apple hardware.
I don’t want Apple to put DRM in the peripherals as well. I want to be able to replace/upgrade my memory, hard drive, etc without having to buy 100% Apple parts.
With DRM, then you can control piracy. No more using one disk on multiple computers. That will deter some or many Windows users. I hate to generalize, but there are people who stick to windows because they can get their software for free from work or a friend.
Don’t worry about me, I am just a troll.
the article title is wrong.
There is no use of TCPM in the Mac OS X Kernel. Go download the kernel at http://www.apple.com/developer and install it on any whitebox x86.
the TCPM is being used with Rosetta. Since not everything in the GUI is 100% ported yet, some GUI stuff is using Rosetta.
All that said, wait and see WHAT, beyond the OS for strapping to Apple machines only, is DRMd. I don’t see any reason to use it for anything else besides this.
Essentially, we’ll be using it as a hardware dongle – nothing more, nothing less. If its got an Apple key in it, it will work. If it doesn’t, it won’t. Other than that, there is no chance i’ll use it for anything else – not for files, or Quicktime, or anything. We have FairPlay for all that.
think about it – do you think that we’ll cut off 20+ million users at the knees with PPC computers? Of course not. The only purpose of this is a cheap replacement for the Mac ROMs that we used in previous systems – to prevent you from running Mac OS X on CHRP boxes, what few were out there.
diamond-“Rumor is that Apple has already gone to one of those crapbox makers, Sony, to help them design the new Powerbooks because Apple has no expertise designing for Intel.”
Sony designed the very first Powerbooks, too. It’s not necessarily due to any Intel expertise (assuming this rumor is true), it’s because Sony designs good laptops. In some cases, PCs aren’t crapboxes because they’re crapboxes, they’re crapboxes because they are running Windows.
someone: i completely agree with you that the PCs aren’t crapboxes because of the hardware but because of the software. The constant improvement of the motherboards and parts on the PC is so fast. There is no way that Apple will be able to sit for a year before upgrading their desktops like they did recently with the G5 computers and charge a premium. People will be able to compare Apple hardware specs with the rest of the industry. That is great news for us Mac users and one of the major reasons this move to Intel is the right move.
Diamond, be careful what you wish for. MS has a lot more experience optimizing for x86 performance than Apple, so any direct comparisons may not be as favorable as you think. Security and ease of use are the strengths that Apple – and you – should be counting on. More obviously measurable performance figures, such as how fast video is encoded or audio files are ripped (among others) may, in fact, turn out to be OSX’x Achilles Heel in this transistion.
As for DRM: I expected it to be used in the widely anticipated ‘VideoMac/Store/iPod’ we all figure is coming down the pike in some form or another. In fact, such a device would probably be impossible to bring to market without it, and is – I think – the real reason for the Macintel transition. However, I am NOT a fan of using it to lock in the OS to a specific machine. I can forsee so many hassles involved that it’s not even funny.
I used to work in IT for a university, and having the ability to quickly load the Mac OS on identical or even multiple platform configurations was a godsend. Losing that ability, or having to go through some Windows-like authentication scheme for upgrades, or just basic installations, would make DRM a lot more trouble than its worth, for the average and not-so-average consumer alike.
I have had the pleasure working with macs and “crapboxes” as many seem to call them here.
But the simple fact is, put a mac and a well balanced pc system next to each other. benchmark them, and surprise surprise, the mac is sloooooooow mate. Not for nothing Adobe states their products perform better on a Pc.
Furthermore, crapboxes are easily upgraded after two years. Try upgrading a mac.
Now if y’all are mac fans thats fine, but calling pc’s crapboxes, hmmmm…. for a n00b mayhaps.