An earlier article that expressed some users’ disappointment with Apple’s Mac mini’s soldered RAM and lack of quad-core CPU options has prompted us to write a brief open note to Apple:
You are missing something between the Mac mini and the Mac Pro. A Mac minitower — a really short “tower,” let’s call it the “Mac mini Pro” — with user-swappable RAM more processor options starting at $799 would go a looong way here (especially with the Mac’s rejuvenated growth). You are leaving money on the table.
Are we right or wrong? More specifically, is there a significant enough market out there to justify and support Apple’s investment (seems like a minimal bit of R&D to us – most of it is already there in the Mac mini) in a new “Mac mini Pro?”
So, is there a market for a ‘Mac mini Pro’ starting at $799?
Works for me!
How many that means, I have no idea.
Emphatically YES.
There’s also a market for unicorns and free beer, but that doesn’t mean you’re going to see either in your lifetime.
Don’t get me wrong, I would love to have the option of this type of Mac but Apple has steadfastly avoided this exact kind of MacPro mini you are talking about for over a decade! We thought the Mac mini would fill the gap but it…
1. Never used 3.5″ HDs–much cheaper, bigger and faster
2. Never used real video cards
3. Always had very limited memory slots.
And forget any kind of PCI card slots. That will NEVER happen again on any Mac.
I am thinking of a Mac Pro, with only one GPU, a lesser variety of the Xeon range and maybe SODIMM instead of the larger sticks. That could reduce the height by half maybe and still be powerful.
I’d vote for a range of more powerful MacMinis.
I’ve got a great Apple 27″ display that doesn’t need to be replaced. I could use the more powerful MacMini to replace my 21″ iMac from late 2009.
Wrong Question. The Mac mini goes from:
$500 with 1.4GHz 2 Core to
$1200 with 3.0GHz 2 Core
Question to Ask:
Does a new lineup with an $800 machine need to exist? No.
There is the place between the $1200 Mac mini and the $3000 Mac Pro.
You might, if you’re lucky, get a headless machine from $1500 to $2500.
Something that looks like a 1/2 a Mac Pro.
Call it a Mac Stubby. 😉
Sir Jonathan Paul “Jony” Ive would go crazy…
I hope you mean the old 2013 trash can Mac Pro.
There simply aren’t that many users who think that it’s a great feature to be forced to buy more cables & external boxes to do the upgrades & expansion that used to be simple and internal. And as we all know, Apple continues to completely miss the professional rack-mounted gear market, because mounting Apple’s round cans in a rectangular rack is just stupid packaging. It’s as though Apple is actively trying to push pro mobile users to Linux.
Wierd, first sentence got mangled in translation. Was supposed to say “old 2012 and earlier Mac Pro, not the new 2013 trash can Mac Pro”.
Agreed. I want a new Mac Pro with four drive bays, a video card slot, USB 3.0, the latest killer processors from Intel and a built-in Blu-ray drive.
Me too!!! I just grabbed the previous gen i7 2.6GHz quad AFTER they released the new mini because I thought it was a better machine than any of the new models. I understand the desire to have a low priced entry level Mac, but I want a mini that do some work and has a little room to grow.
Hopefully they do not do what IBM and other companies have done – cripple products to prevent competition between lines. You should be your own best competition!
The only problem with the previous generation i7 Mac mini was the crappy graphics card.
I vote yes. I would buy one in a second. It’s the gap that needs to be filled. Yes I say.
Ditto. I’d buy two or three.
O yea. I would love to have one.
Yes i7, ram slots upto 32gb, two HD/SSD bays, 4 usb and SDxc slot. Option for graphics card. Price $800-1200.
Get Macs on formerly windows desks.
Rp, with that config, we’d happily pay more than the new iMacs just to have a properly cooled and internally expandible Mac. Built with proper quality, there’s no reason to start off at $800.
Ability for USER to replace:
RAM
HD
CPU (low on my list honestly, but ability to order preconfigured with multiple CPU choices? yes)
And i’d buy one.
My problem, i have a 27″ iMac as my main.. so even with the Mac Pro, i have to add a $1000 to the price to get a great 27″ screen. (will not buy a smaller screen now.. i’m spoiled)
Don’t forget at least one PCI slot for an upgradable graphics card.
Basically you’re taking the guts of the 27″ iMac / Retina iMac and putting it into a minitower & upgradeable to 32GB RAM. That’s a great idea. For people who value desktops, this minitower in combination with a 5K TB Display would be a more popular option than an iMac, I think.
That way, when it comes time to upgrade, you only have to change the tower and not the entire display. Plus, you minimize overheating issues.
Ding! Ding! Ding!
I think that’s a winner!
Even better, if Apple frees itself from its self-imposed constraint of making new devices as thick as a sheet of paper, then a new mid-range desktop Mac could use standard durable well-cooled desktop-class components instead of the mobile components the iMac uses. A new mid-range Mac sans display could offer users better upgradeability and performance while giving Apple better margins. Manufacture and shipping of a new Mac tower could be way more efficient than an all-in-one computer for Apple.
What would be decent sales and money for some companies, would likely be a distraction for Apple. As a shareholder I want them to concentrate on Apple Watch and perhaps Apple TV update rather than a Mac mini pro.
Mac mini pro would take very little “concentration”
After all, apple used to sell it this way… just not as powerful as the iMac.
As noted above, i think Apple could price the iMac and a user-upgradeable midrange tower at about the same and the new Mac tower would still sell like hotcakes. Lashing mobile components to the back of a display is simply not what everyone wants. Those who need configurability — not to mention the many aftermarket PCI card makers that Apple has shat on for the last 5 years — would embrace having a machine that they can INTERNALLY tweak to meet their exact needs. No current Mac allows this anymore.
Heck yeah!
Definitely, build it like the Cube. I like the Cube’s design even though it was underpowered.
I was going to buy a Mac Mini when they released the update. They basically trashed the ability for me to upgrade it to a great Graphic Design work station that could be easily carried to & from work. If they left it like it was previously, where we could add RAM etc., then i’d be in the market for one…but as the sell them now, well they are at best a expensive weight.
I think Apple would be worried that it would cut into their iMac sales. But, I’d also buy one.
That’s the whole point. I don’t have any hard numbers but I’m sure many people who buy the iMac, especially the 27″ model, would prefer to upgrade only the CPU box as opposed to always having to upgrade the entire computer along with the monitor when they get a new machine.
That’s EXACTLY what I want!
ABSO-FREAKIN-LUTELY! Nobody likes to buy junk, your computer needs to be able to be “refreshed” after two years. The easiest way to do that is to max out your RAM. If you can’t do that, then you pretty much bought junk.
Nothing’s worse than updating your OS once and have your computer slow down to a brick.
Having all Mac mini’s with upgradable RAM–YES.
Having a Mac mini Pro for more voom–YES YES YES!
I vote no. Just make the current one decent for a decent price like it used to be. Keep the ultra-low end one for those that want it, but give back the upgradeability and quad processors. Boy did they ever screw up.
AMEN!!!!! I was hoping the refresh would be an improvement instead it was a step backward. The Pro is priced too high, I don’t want an iMac with the built in screen. I would totally buy one.
If it would have a dedicated, replacable GPU, I’d be allready sold on it !
Yes.
yes, apple needs to let this latest mini go. it was not a good idea. with all these possible hackintoshes, it doesn’t seem that it would require much research to do a much faster mac mini, not to mention the faster macs. ok, that’s not apple, how about, … the apple world is round these days …, so how about a mini that’s round, a disc. also how about dropping intel’s i5 all together. how about i7’s desktops versions up to 3.5 ghz and six cores and throw in pro-graphics chips. some people love the all-in-one design some don’t. apple is not dell, no need to sell every chip intel produces. i say they should keep being selective and sell those faster, more productive chips. yes the faster chips would cost more but it would make the mac mini worth buying, plus, it would help keep intel moving forward, AMD doesn’t seem to be able to add any pressure… yes, yes, by all means allow the user to add memory… why not?
Apple seems to only be interested in increasing profit margins, so if some Mac Mini Pro can’t provide those profit margins, you might as well forget about it. I’m glad I already purchased an i7 quad-core Mac Mini in 2013 and it should last me a long time to come. The only thing that taxes it is encoding DVDs or MKV files and I simply batch them for overnight.
There’s no way in hell Apple is going to build some low-profit margin Mac Mini Pro. With the money Apple has returned to me, I could simply buy a high-end Mac Pro and run everything in my house off of it. I’d really like to have a central computer and get basically gigabit ethernet terminals for the rest of the house instead of having multiple computers except for emergency backup.
I would like to see something between the Pro and mini. The small form factor is nice and practical. I just updated my mini to Fusion Drive, which is nice for booting apps and opening large files. I have it maxed out at 16GB RAM. Performance is improved, but a faster CPU and faster bus would be nice. Maybe multiple monitor support too. I’m actually thinking of getting an older Mac Pro, maybe a 2011 or 2012 model tweaked out with an SSD and GPU Card and 32GB RAM. You can get some good deals on older Mac Pro’s. The fact they’re so expandable is really nice. Not so crazy about Apple’s new Pro design.
Yes, it should be called simply Mac. Back in the day, this middle-tiered computer was the Macintosh II. Today’s version could be called Mac Plus. Apple, please bring back the Macintosh!
Along with 99% of other Mac users who do more than social networking, YES.
As others mentioned above, please allow user-upgradeability of GPU, RAM, and hard drive. Allow internal expansion with a couple PCI slots so the user can add additional ports for things like SD drives or special audio cards. And PLEASE offer room for dual internal drives. At the very least, that allows the home user the ability to dedicate one drive to Time Machine, or to move one’s media library off the startup volume. Apple needs to offer the user some real options for desktop computing, because not everyone can or wants to use a laptop or iMac for home use, and the Mac Pro doesn’t even come close to what the typical home user wants.
Apple. with the extra pocket change that you can’t seem to use, why don’t you also release a trio of 4K retina thunderbolt displays with it too: about 21″, 27″, and 30″ sizes would be great.
I can see a headless Mac fitting in-between the mini and the Pro, but believe it would probably be closer to some mid-point between the two – price and power wise.
I did see the Mac Pro in the Apple Store last week and it does generate a lot of lust. I would look to moving down from the base Mac Pro (not necessarily in the same form factor) rather than moving up from the mini.
Apple could call it the Dullahan Project
No one has mentioned it, but Apple needs a small business server and Pro Mini would do the trick. The Pro Mini could consist of:
– Current Mini box
– Fast processor, probably i7
– Upgradable RAM
– Fusion drive with a quality, fast HD
– A couple Thunderbolt ports
– Lots of USB 3 ports
You could then hook this baby up to a multi-bay RAID storage device, add Yosemite Server software, and presto, you have yourself a great server for a small business. Plus, you don’t have the licensing costs that come with a Windows server and you don’t need some Windows IT geek to manage it.
Yes. It’s called a Mac Mini Render Farm. Several people have made them, I am starting my own. 4 -cores is pivotal to make this efficient and easy. Getting rid of the 4-core just blows!
YES, my older Mac Mini is all decked out.
Here’s what Apple should do instead…
Make a basic mini that can operate as a stand alone or in parallel with other mini’s through a fast serial link.
A single Mini for $300
A single mini to compete against the cheapest.
Two mini’s linked together to compete as a base iMac.
A 4 mini (2X2 grid)(quad Core) to compete as a $1200 iMac
A 9 mini (3 X 3 grid)(9 Core) to put any PC to shame
Dare to go 16 mini’s…….or more! Just keep adding more year to year!
Absolutely! That’s exactly what I was hoping for with the Mac mini. Apple’s current Macintosh roadmap is making me consider going the Hackintosh.
I would love a MacMini Pro. Something with faster HDD option, more (and swappable) memory options (or eve a swappable HDD option). I would gladly pay $800 – $1,000 for a MacMini that that has all the horsepower and features of the iMac without the built in screen (although it would be nice for them to include a keyboard and trackpad).
I have a mid-2011 Mac mini that I’ve upgraded with more memory and a DIY FusionDrive set-up. Basically, all Apple should do is re-introduce a version of the existing box that allowed stacked 2.5 inch drives (and maybe came with the SATA connector so you didn’t have to buy one from OWC) and had at least two RAM slots. Also offer i7 quad-core and Iris graphics.
Absolutely- a great idea!
Stlill loving aftr all these years.
Rack-mounted please (for musicians and photo pros).
Unless someone wants to over spend and buy a Mac Pro, there really is no server option from Apple anymore. The Mac mini server tricked out with 80-16GB of RAM and a quad core i7 made a great server for small offices, or a server dedicated to some specific tasks. Now what do we have? There’s no supported way to upgrade the new Mac mini. Why doesn’t Apple just stop producing OS X Server now instead of delaying it? Their server product has been going down hill since they killed off the Xserve, and then consumerized their server technology. I have fond memories of Snow Leopard Server, back when Apple actually seemed to give a damn about customers who wanted an all Mac office including their servers.
I meant 8-16GB of RAM. It would be great to have a Mac mini with 80GB of RAM too 🙂
I definitely want one. I’m close to building it as a Hackintosh, but I’d much rather have it be a real Mac. Just a small tower with accessible HD, RAM, and GPU.
With the gutting of the i7 on the mini Apple left a gaping hole in the small server market, and the server hole still remains to be filled in general.
The new Pro is basically useless as a server – both the form factor and the graphics capabilities are wrong for a machine that sits there doing headless work in a business. A server also need a minimum of redundancy built in.
I think so & I would buy it in a heartbeat over an iMac.
But Apple doesn’t even need to build a separate Mini Pro. All they have to do is bring back the upgradability of the older Mini, bring back a Quad core CPU, a server model, & GPU options ( Keep it with integrated Iris Pro graphics with 4K support ). With such specs, I don’t believe it would eat away iMac or Mac Pro.
The only reason I bought my iMac in 2011 was because I still wasn’t satisfied with specs of the 2011 Mini at the time. But if it had the 2012 Mini specs, I probably would’ve bought it instead. I gave my parents a 2010 2.66Ghz mini I used before my iMac & it still works beautifully. And why? Because I installed 8GB of Ram & installed a 7200 RPM Hybrid drive after the 1st year which brought it new life. Now 4 years later and it still runs everything thrown at it. I might very well give it an SSD & Max its Ram to 16GB so it would serve for another 3-5 years. Try that on a disposable 2014 Mini!
Come on CLUSTER!
How about mini blades with A8, A9… we could chain together to create our own personal super computers.
a few weeks ago I put in a new 3 GB video card, extra 2 TB HD and more ram into my old Cheese Grater Mac Pro. The PC vid card only cost me a $100+ . The ability to upgrade extends the life and the flexibility of a machine. This is the second time I upgraded the video card , first time I was surprised the boost it gave the machine.
The New Mac Pro is wonderful but with the small flash HD it comes standard with (256 GB) to get more storage the price easily goes over $4000. Big gap between that an a mac mini.
The iMacs are great too but I already have big monitors . Also monitors tend to fade faster than CPUs and having a monitor stuck to the CPU is an issue for pro graphics as perfect monitor quality is important.
so yeah I want a mid tower between the current mini and the Pro.
I am going back and forth on either building a Hackintosh, or picking up a last gen Mac Pro.
For this very reason.
I have the old G5 PowerMac and I personally love the case, and do not care about it being bulky.
I feel a Quad version of the current mini – like before – with an option to put 32G of Ram would do it. I own 20 at 1500$ a pop of the last generation just to render and serve, they are great ! I was waiting for the upgrade to buy more, Now I don’t know what to do . . . They render slower with multi treads software then before. Just very disappointing .
I am running a Mac Pro 2.66 Quad Core as my desktop and there is no headless option for an upgrade other than the ridiculous, overpriced, black trash can. No way am I spending damn near 3 Grand on an iMac – nice computer, but a niche product.
Even when Apple was offering Quad core i7 minis, they crippled it with lowbrow graphics. The new Machine just screams cheap, cheap, cheap with soldered in memory and low spec integrated graphics. There is not as much money to be made selling minis as selling iPads, but there is money to be made.
The original concept at Apple was getting computers out to the masses- not being a high end trendy toy for rich kids. Woz and Jobs were not the cool kids at school and would not be today. The Mac mini is the heart of the market that Apple was founded to serve- not making foo foo watches for the hipster set.
As a shareholder and customer since before the Mac, please do not fuck over the Mac users as you chase new products. Without the Mac there would be no iOS and no Apple to make it.
Abso-friggin-LUTELY!
I have been in the market for this kind of mini tower for about 5 years, when I was forced to switch from a Mac Pro to an iMac due to the crazy expensive nature of the Mac Pro. I would far rather sure up a small tower with best-in-class parts (which would still run around $2,000 I’m sure), and then have a separate monitor that I could keep. This solution is much, much more amenable to a tiny, one person shop like me (part time work), than trying to justify around $3,000 every 2-3 years for a new computer.
Please, Apple, listen to this and make one! Pretty please!
Yes, there definitely is a market!!
In fact, I wrote Apple earlier last month and urged them to reconsider their practice of soldering the RAM, which prevents users from being able to upgrade their systems. Think of it like this — it’s like buying a superb car only to discover that there’s no way to “change” the tire in case a roadside issue arises. Seriously, who would want to buy a machine that requires you to throw it out if the hard drive gets damaged, the laptop battery dies, or if you just need to increase the RAM in the system? To me, they didn’t think this issue through too well when it comes to their consumers.
Si. Oui. Hai. Ni hau, and all that other mess – dagnabbit – YES! Apple takes all this minimalism mess too far. A huge gap between the iMac, mini, and Mac Pro now. I’d even settle for just upgrade able RAM and hard drives. Place for two internal drives would work.
Count me in for a headless mac with a quad core i7 + 32G of RAM + good GPU + 2 hard drives. Perhaps revive the old mac mini server with extra ram and good GPU.
Yes please on the Mini Pro and very big well done for listening to your readers.
Apple has needed a “hobbyist” Mac for a long, long time. Can’t they get the hint? There is a whole ecosystem that has evolved for adding ram, modifying various Apple products (AppleTV, etc.) and so forth. A Mac Mini Pro would be a fantastic machine for those who just want to “mess with” their Mac.
I know a lot of people who desperately wanted to buy the new Mac Mini but did not. Why? Income. Most students have limited income but they don’t want to settle for a clunker computer. Instead they buy a PC and slowly upgrade it over time.
Apple by not having a “hobbyist” or upgradeable Mac is missing out on a large market of not only customers but future developers.
As Mac’s have become less upgradeable, the percentage of Mac users logging onto the local college servers has been declining. In 2008, over 30% of the local college students were using Mac’s. Now it is around 10%. (SOURCE: summary stats available from local college servers.)
I used to regularly sell and recommend the server version of the Mac mini of the past. It had dual hard drives which could be mirrored and decent performance. More than enough for a small business, particularly those wanting to move away from a Microsoft SBS Server setup. The Mac mini server in combination with Kerio Mail server software was a complete replacement. Clearly these 2014 model are no longer suitable for this situation, so I would no longer be recommending them.
So yes, I higher powered product that sat in between a Mac mini and a Mac Pro that was configurable in terms of RAM and had decent hard drive options would be great.
What would be the angle for Apple? Apple already sells the Mac mini. Based on its relatively modest cost in comparison to other Macs, a reasonable expectation is that most buyers will pair the Mac mini with a less expensive, non-Apple monitor. But a “higher end” Mac mini Pro, as conjectured by MDN, would seem to compete too much with the existing iMac lineup. Apple might end up cannibalizing iMac sales for no apparent benefit to the company. And how many would buy a mid-range headless Mac positioned between the existing Mac mini and Mac Pro? I have no doubt that there is a market, but is is big enough and lucrative enough for Apple to expand its Mac lineup and divert resources away from other products?
I always try to keep in mind the Jobs mantra for innovation – say “no” to many good ideas so that you can say “yes” to a few great ideas (paraphrased, but the spirit of it is in there). I don’t think that I would buy this mid-range headless Mac. It would have none of the grace of the current iMac and would not be much, if any, less expensive if paired with an Apple display. You could save some money by pairing it with a good third party monitor, but then you get the old school wires and such. And I doubt that Apple would include the flexibility and expand ability that some are hoping.
My Dream, 2 3.5 internal drives, 4 core fast Processor, 2 Tbolt-3 ports, 32g RAM, 6 USB 3 ports, Good graphics card. YUM. The last 2 Minis I have purchased have been the server version to get the second internal drive. I think it would fit in an enclosure less than 2x height of the current mini. I will probably do a maxed out mini.
My Dream: A Mac with 3 PCIe slots, 8 DIMM slots, TB/USB ports.
No 3.5″ disk bays, use NVMe SSD card(s) or external TB RAID array. No DVD bay, use USB BluRay disk.
PCIe slots have power/cooling to support highest performance GPU cards (up to 250W).
I’ve been in bed with Apple since the Apple II days. I was one of the top Mac consultants in Dallas-Ft. Worth for years until I retired. I’ve got more invested in Apple than Doan’s has pills. But the latest rev of the Mac Mini sucks, hands down. I was waiting on the rev to buy a Haswell-generation quad i7 Mac Mini with ThunderBolt 2. Not to be. And I’m definitely not buying a $3,000 Mac Pro when Apple is the only source of a 1-TB SSD for it. Don’t even get me started on the new kext-signing requirement in OSX 10.10 so that aftermarket TRIM support is officially unsupported. All of that has made me decide to simply build a comparable PC (to the Mac Pro) and run Windows 10 on it. Since I can do that for 1/3 the price of a Mac Pro, that’s a heck of a lot of power-savings ratio. I have no allegiance to Apple any longer since they have absolutely no memory for loyalty to who got them this far and no respect for anything but dollars.
I bought a fully tricked out 4-core i7 minis prior to the latest update, thinking I’d get one of the new ones when they came out. No chance. I couldn’t care less about a super thin iMac and the Mac Pro is a ridiculous price, so for the first time in some 20+ years I found myself wishing that MS would get its act together.
Frankly if they took a serious look at Windows and rewrote it from the ground up to create a robust, secure, Unix style OS with a decent UI, they’d clean up.
My own feeling is that the problem at Apple is Jony Ive. The Mac was once a solid tool with a good design ethos, but under his regime it’s now mostly bling with increasingly less substance.
As a professional photographer looking to dip my toes into video, I need an upgrade path from my 13″ MBP + 27″ display. My display is already one of the best money can buy, and Apple’s displays, though good, lack integrated calibration and are not class-leading in terms of color accuracy, so I don’t want an iMac. I already have lots of external storage, so don’t need internal drive bays. I have no use for PCI cards, either. Expandability is not the issue. Horsepower is the issue. I was looking at a quad-core i7 mini, but now it’s gone. The only way left for me to get more CPU & GPU power is a faster MBP or a Mac Pro, neither of which fits my needs. What I’d like to see is a small headless mac with 500GB+ of SSD storage (a Fusion drive’s SSD cache is too small), 32GB RAM and iMac-level horsepower with a graphics card capable of light editing of 1080P/4K video in FCPX. Practically every pro photographer I know is in the same boat. So, yes, at least in the pro photography market, there is huge pent-up demand for a small mid-range headless Mac. Tube, cube, or mini form factor, I don’t care, as long as I can connect two large displays.
The New Mac Pro won the “Best of the Best” Red Dot award 2014! And just recently the Grand Award for Innovation 2014!
This is a “Masterpiece Machine”!!!
Go grab one if you really are a “Pro”!
Late to the party.
Just upgraded my 2011 Mac Mini Server to a new Quad Core 2012 Mac Mini AFTER the 2014 Mac Mini’s were introduced. Both of my Mac Mini’s cost more than $700. Would be one of the first to buy a semi-upgradable Mac Mini Tower.
Actually I am okay with the built in memory. Apple is charging only a hundred more for the memory. The lack of a quad core and the option for a second HD were the BIG disappointments for me.
I have a big problem with the new Mac Mini. The lack of user upgradeable ram cannot be forgiven. Rumor is that apple went to soldered on ram so they could hit the $499 price point. I think that they should have removed the Thundebolt connectivity instead. It is expensive to include and due to the high costs of thunderbolt peripherals, I doubt many Mac Mini owners are in the market for one. For the Mac Mini demographic, USB3 makes far more sense. Removing thunderbolt seems a much better option.
I just found this old thread. Count me in for a bridge product between the Mini and the Pro. Apple needs to offer a bit more product range for its code and content developers. The Pro is solid for video editing, and overkill for audio, photography and graphic design.
Another commenter describes an ideal machine, essentially half a Mac Pro with 1 GPU and up-to-date CPU, storage and I/O standards; and reasonable ability to upgrade, e.g. RAM. A single quad CPU like the 2012 is essential for this customer segment.