“When Apple announced its new notebooks on Tuesday, it said the new machines would be in the company’s retail stores the next day,” Peter Glaskowsky reports for CNET. “So I went to the Apple store at the Westfield Valley Fair mall in Santa Clara, California… It looked as good in real life as it does in the pictures. The tapered edges make it look thinner than it really is, considerably more svelte than the older MacBook Pros like mine.”
“The trackpad was very nice, easily the best I’ve ever used. It also doesn’t look or feel like glass. I can confirm that Apple thought of the same thing that I did in my previous post–a click with one finger generates a left-click, and a tap with two fingers generates a right-click. Awesome,” Glaskowsky reports. “So now Apple has the world’s only two-button mouse that doesn’t have any buttons at all, and it isn’t even a mouse!”
“As for the new glass-face display: I’m sure it’ll be great for watching movies in a dark room. I’m sure it’ll be fine for most purposes, if you’re in a dark room. And wearing dark clothing, and nothing shiny. But wow, I really don’t like to see windows or lights or my clothing reflected in glossy displays, and the only way this new machine’s display could be any more glare-prone is if it were mirrored like a highway cop’s sunglasses,” Glaskowsky reports.
MacDailyNews Note: You can easily make a glossy screen matte, but you simply cannot make a matte screen glossy. Apple MacBook, iMac screens too glossy? Apply inexpensive non-glare film – November 05, 2007
More in the full article here.
Glossy is the killer. Doesn’t matter how wonderful the notebook is the visual interface still sucks.
Glossy creates eye strain because of the glare. Eye strain takes a toll on your eyes over time as well as promoting headaches for many people.
This is purely a cost saving move by Apple. Give everyone want Apple wants to give them and they’ll be happy about it if we tell them this is what they want.
Greg M,
What part of the following statement did you not understand, exactly?
MacDailyNews Note: You can easily make a glossy screen matte, but you simply cannot make a matte screen glossy. Apple MacBook, iMac screens too glossy? Apply inexpensive non-glare film – November 05, 2007
How much will it cost to add a matte filter? $10? $15? I know it’s annoying not to have the matte option to begin with, but when the fix is so easy and inexpensive, the level of uproar seems out of place. Granted, I haven’t seen any of the filters at work, so I stand corrected if they don’t work.
He’s amazed at the two-finger right-mouse-click trick, but that has been a part of Apple’s laptops for at least 4 years now… possibly longer.
But its sister notebook doesn’t have FW!!! Can’t you be objective and get us all riled up about something?
@Greg,
Thank you. For helping rile up the masses. It doesn’t matter if one can purchase a matte film for cheap to get rid of the glossy–what matters is having something to bitch and moan about.
Now, that’s what we’re all about!
Greg M
Spoken from someone that hasn’t laid his hands on one of the new displays, obviously.
The led backlight is strong enough to wash out most of the glare. Similar to iPhone’s screen.
glor
You really do get used to a glossy screen – I hated it at first on my Macbook, especially with a sunny window right behind my desk, but after a couple years using one, I don’t notice it any more.
“What part of the following statement did you not understand, exactly?”
How about the fact that any “filter” placed on a screen does effect the quality of the display. Only an idiot minion would believe that there is some magical application that will transform the screen into something that it isn’t.
Glossy with a filter on it is not the same as a true matt screen. When spending $2000 I shouldn’t have to put a $10 filter on the screen.
Now boys…
New actor’s name….Matt Screen.
Not a bad review in terms of what the guy thinks about the product, but a bit shocking in that he doesn’t seem to know much about computers or Apple computers in particular.
He did not know about the 2 finger clicking? (It almost seemed as if he was taking credit for inventing the idea as well.)
He did not know what the “slot” was beside the battery indicator lights? (the ExpressCard slot).
This is kind of like if your grandpa reviewed a computer.
I agree with you. I bought my Pro with the glossy screen and you see right through the glare. In fact I can see this screen way better than any matte screen mac laptop I had before. People just like to bitch without using. Just like people complaining about the iPhone keyboard without ever using one.
I checked out the new 13″ MacBooks at a local Apple Store.
Very nice fit & function. The new trackpad works so simply for clicking, beautiful screen and it’s remarkably thin. It’s a winner.
if the screen is so glossy how could he even review?
As far as the 2 finger click previously it actually took 3 fingers, 2 for the pad and one for the button. Now you can just click with the 2.
@Greg M
I’m “forty something” and I’ve sat in front of a glossy screen in a well lit office 40+ hours per week for nearly 20 years.
I have ZERO complaints with glossy displays, ranging from the NEC’s in the 80’s to the 17″ MacPro I’m typing on, so consider this…
Your OPINION on glossy screens is just that (an opinion), and it’s not borne out in my experience.
Oh yeah;
@ Greg M,
If you’ve never used a glossy screen for any decent period of time, WTF do you know about them?
How much are you paid to rag on Apple products?
Where the hell is the Firewire 400 in the new MacBooks? Not in the new Nvidia chipset, that’s for sure.
I wonder if Matt Screen is a screen actor?
I can see my kid getting in trouble with the eyes in the back of my head, but, for some reason, I have never had a problem with the glossy screen in my Macbook. Do people live in glass, curtainless houses now? I missed the boat. The iPhone has a glossy screen…now let’s be O’fair and spread the iComplaints to all products rather than let them “trickle down”.
@whatever
My white MacBook (late 2007) only needs a two-finger tap (and no mouse button) for right-click. Hey, life’s better if you tweak the settings.
Glossy’s a dealbreaker for me. I don’t want to have to resort to some fucking matte screen cover to do my work.
Face it, Apple blew it with this glossy-only non-option.
🙁
I have both Glossy and Matte and I think there are benefits to both. I curse the Glossy sometimes and I curse the Matte others. It isn’t a deal killer for me and lets face it, how much do you REALLY use your laptop outside or at the beach. I “like” the idea of working outside but in reality it doesn’t ha ha…work! I also find that the times I used to want or need to work outside the iPhone is PERFECT. I was worried about finger prints or the glossy screen on the iPhone but neither have been an issue AT ALL…ok that is a lie, when my 7 year old gets done playing with the iPhone I need to clean it.
Oh, hang it up, MDN!
You CANNOT easily make a shiny screen matted. And you know it. It looks like SHIT when you do, and it doesn’t really work. Quite defending Apple all the time. Be credible!! Let people form their own opinions & assessments.
@Macintosher
I agree that you can do that but try to make the tap select work when you use graphics apps like photoshop and illustrator – it just doesn’t work. One thing nice about the new trackpad is that it actually acts just like the current ones you can still click at front edge just like a button – pretty cool. I wish they would make a separate input device like this for the desktop machines like te iMac and MacPro. I love the trackpads.
Glossy is a BIG mistake from Apple. Yup – buy a laser-blasted, cutting edge, super-powered, ahead of its time, laptop form Apple… and stick a bit of $10 sticky-back plastic over the screen before you can use it!!
What the fuck is Jobs thinking of??
Apple computers… See Different! (all the bloody lights in your ceiling).
I know Jobs wanted to put ‘WIndows’ on the Mac… but this is taking things far too literally.
etc etc
“And wearing dark clothing, and nothing shiny.”
Deal breaker.
What is really nice about the new screens is the durability. At the Apple store on of the Apple people took a key out of his pocket and started scratching the screen and it left no marks – this also means that the screen will be much easier to clean. (Thank God) once a matte screen get a little finger oil or keyboard marks on it good luck removing them. I never see the lights reflecting on my glossy screen unless I look for them – you pretty much see right through them
@DRM sucks “And wearing dark clothing, and nothing shiny.”
Maybe we’re all supposed to dress like Steve Jobs before we can use it?
Jony Ive must struggle a bit – his shaved head was almost a shiny as the bloody screens in his keynote slot!!!
Is there ANYTHING Apple can do that MDN won’t put a positive spin on?
I like glossy and matte, Obama and McCain, Bidin and Palin, ac and dc, etc.
@’Bill with a Matte MacBook Pro’
Yes, MDN can and certainly does. Like letting you whiners (and there are quite a few professional whiners in the mix as well) whine on a daily basis here. MDN didn’t advocate Apple, merely offered a solution to the ‘problem.’ What was your offering other than adding to the wide world of whiners?
This is for the most part a Mac fan site, get over it. Go read CNET (which owns ZDNet and a few others) for all their ‘unbiased’ everyday all-things-anti-Apple-hateboi FUDs and rejoice!
I once looked askance at “glossy”. But a few months ago, my old LCD/TV monitor went on me. The only screens that caught my eye were the glossies. After initially going with an LG 22″, I ended up with an HP 20″ for my Shuttle.
A few weeks later, I ordered the base 20″ iMac, which is also glossy. The washed out color shifting off-access might be a problem if I had to use the display with a group, but I work on-access. So it’s never been a problem.
P.S. Still lovin’ my iMac. And a former colleague of mine, long an Apple skeptic, bought a 24″ iMac after Windows on his HP laptop crapped out. He loves his too.
@Big Al
Funny how people make assumptions about something they know nothing about.
I had to sell my matt MBP due to financial reasons and was forced to settle for a macbook. I can only use it for a limited amount of time before I start to get a headache. Most of the time I have to use it with an external display (matt screen of coarse). I was looking forward to when things turned around and I’d be able to go back to a MBP with a matt screen. Now that can’t happen.
@sixvodkas
That’s great that it doesn’t bother you. Curious, do you wear glasses?
I guess if I was downing 6 vodkas a day I wouldn’t notice that the glare was bothering me either! Just joking there.
Fact is that glare does bother a lot of people. Why do you think that there were so many anti-glare screens hanging in front of those CRT displays?
It just sucks that we spend such a high price for Apple hardware and are forced to deal with a glossy screen. At least Apple gave us a choice before.
Yes we are forced to pay the high price because that’s the only way to be able to use OSX.
@Hot Carl and Twenty Benson,
Of course you don’t want a matte film to deal with the issue of a glossy screen–that would mean having to find something else to bitch and moan about.
Plus you’d have to deal with the fact that a film also protects the monitor/screen, something that would obviously drive you to distraction and cause you to bitch and moan about that as well.
I have a matte film on my iPhone, not because I had any problems with glossy but because I like the coefficient of friction (feel) of it and the protection from scratches. Have had the film on now for a few months, and it is almost pristine.
Goobers.
Glossy is the killer. Doesn’t matter how wonderful the notebook is the visual interface still sucks.
@Greg M (and curious PC users)
If it wasn’t glossy screens, it would be buttons, or ports, or card-readers, batteries, choice, floppies, games, clothes, lipstick, on and on, ad nauseam! PC whiners will find something to bitch about.
No one here is compelled by your admissions or your feigned concern for the health of the “many”. Say whatever you want about your perceived limits of the Mac but don’t insult us with your effeminate arguments about glare, eye strain, headaches or lifestyle choices.
In the world of PC you have more choices of gloss than anyone could imagine. So what the fuck are you doing here, mmm?
NOWHERE has the issue of the glossy screens become more critical than in the Mac forums and what’s really telling is, PC apologists like Greg M, HC, and 20 B are the only ones talking about it. Why?
Because cnet requires commenters to log-in and MDN (the original hit whore) doesn’t, that’s why!
@G4Duallie,
You nailed it!
@Arnold Ziffel,
All you do is bitch and moan about Mac fans. If it wasn’t for us complaining about the poor design of glossy screens you’d have to find something else to bitch and moan about Mac fans over.
Jeez, Arnold… lay down and take it from a PC supplier without a wimper. Are you sure you wouldn’t be more at home on Windows?
Me? I’m in the same ballpark are Mr Jobs – that’s why it’s no problem for me to let him ‘listen buddy YOU’RE WRONG!’.
I used to like matte screens, but I insist on glossy now. Everything is sharper and crisper on a glossy screen. With high resolution screens, glossy is a must. If I think about it, I can sometime see reflections in the screen, but my mind has been trained ignore them. I experience no eye fatigue or ill effects from working all day with glossy screens. I suspect that most people who object to them have never really given them a try. Once you do, you’ll never go back.
@G4Duallie,
idiot who can’t read
BTW, I can’t stand microsoft and I love OSX.
I have gotten most of my relatives to switch to Macs. I like everything about the new notebooks except for the lack of a matt screen option.
The only reason Apple dropped the matt screen was for profit. I can understand that on a sub $1000 item but not on a $2000+ notebook. Truth is that the matt out sells the glossy when there is a choice.
I think there is a choice… for my business I’ve replaced all 50 iMacs with mini’s and samsung non glass screens. Saved a bundle. From my experience, the screens will serve at least two generations of cpu.
As for the portable, although I’ve waited for the new ones I won’t go back to glass. I’m in Florida and the window light is VERY bright compared to inside. But I have a choice to buy the old macbook pro for $600 less than the new hi glare version, and performance reports are indicating no loss of performance for non-gaming application.
So my net investment in apple product has been reduced by about $25,000, my business flexibility has improved, and I have no glare screens.
@G4Dualie
Yep.
My Windows-suffering friend dissed the new MBP because “The screen / lid doesn’t open far enough.”
Anything to rationalise their investments of time, money, energy, and frustration in Microsoft.
@Greg M
“Truth is that the matt out sells the glossy when there is a choice.”
That may be true, I don’t know. (linky-dink?)
If it is true that matte out-sells glossy, wouldn’t Apple be further ahead to offer matte screens for a premium price – if they’re selling glossy-only for profit reasons?
MDN notes:
> You can easily make a glossy screen matte, but you simply cannot make a matte screen glossy.
While I think Apple made the right decision by going glass (glossy) only for the displays, those matte filters that apply over the LCD will not work well for iMacs and MacBooks.
They work fine when applied directly onto a glossy LCD because there is minimal space between the image and the filter. It basically replicates a matte LCD. On the iMac (and probably to a lesser extent on the two new MacBooks) the glass sheet over the actual LCD creates a gap between the image and the matte filter. It would be like looking through a fog. Putting the matte filter under the glass sheet (directly on the LCD) would not help, since the glass is still reflective.
With the bright LED backlighting, the “glass” displays work fine AS IS. Back when displays were huge CRTs, the best ones were large, flat, and glass (glossy). There was no outcry for a matte option, because CRTs are bright; you may see reflections but you do not notice them unless you consciously look for them. It’s the same with these Apple LED backlit displays.
@Twenty Benson,
Touché about moaning about the moaners.
Help me! I’m meeeeelllllting.
Regarding Missy Pants’ discussion about her Windows friend complaining about the MBP screen not opening as far:
My PB screen opened up a lot further than either (I’ve had 2, a Core Duo and a Core2 Duo) MBP’s screen. I still find myself needing to push the display back further than it will go, especially if I have the laptop on my lap. I end up having to raise the front of the laptop so I can tilt the screen far enough back to see properly.
I’m pretty sure Apple got rid of the Matte screens because they are now using glass. Glass is highly reflective whether it has a Matte or Glossy screen behind it so Apple thought: “It’s going to be reflective anyway so will just put a nice glossy behind it and use bright L.E.D.s to overcome the glare.” I personally can’t see a problem with that.
@Arnold Ziffel
It’s zombie fucktards like you who give Apple users a bad name…
Apple shit the bed with this awful decision to go glossy-only. They’ve screwed over 20+ year users like me who have come to rely on matte screens to do their work.
Dickless retards like yourself can defend them all you want, but they’re dead wrong on this one.
Regarding Screens:
I have a 23″ cinema display (matte) and a new iMac (glossy) – the glossy display provides me with a perfect view out of the window behind me while the matte display lets me do my work.
I’ll be buying shares in companies that produce non-glare film if Apple keeps on down this path.
@Hot Carl,
You nailed me! I am indeed a fscktard. So?
Why is it so “out there” to just buy a matte film and take care of your issue? I don’t get it.
As I stated earlier, I didn’t want my iPhone screen to get scratched, so I bought a matte film screen protector. Problem solved. I suppose I could have just ranted and raved about Apple putting a screen on my iPhone that would get scratched when it rubbed against the Swiss Army knife in my pocket, now couldn’t I? Instead, I accepted reality, spent $15 getting two Crystal films, and iPhone’s screen is protected. Pretty simple.
If you don’t like the glossy-only screen, I suggest you make your thoughts known to Apple. I’ve found them to be reasonably responsive to feedback.
Or you can call people like me names and do your best to rile the masses.
Puh.
as a freelance graphics pro, I gotta say glossy is better. you get a much closer comparison on screen to what it’ll be on print.
Greg,
I few tips to get along in here…
1) Don’t present your argument with well thought out points; It throws them off.
2) NEVER use facts- that’s even worse.
3) If a new Apple product comes out and doesn’t have something you want; then you don’t need it.
4) If a new Apple product comes out and is missing something you already had in a prior product- then you NEVER really needed it.
5) Embrace the following statement: “Cuz Steve said.”
6) The MDN website isn’t really slow- even with all the Obama adds that will be showing up again about a week before the election.
Hope this helps.
@iLuvMyMacs,
Huh?
I love our Macs and have never spent one red ¢ on Windows’ machines.
Still, none of our Macs have been perfect. And we’ve had more than a couple: MacSE, Bondi Blue iMac, 500 MHz DP G4, 800 MHz G3 iBook, 2.5 DP G5 PowerMac, Quad-Core 3GHz MacPro, MacBook Pro, and new 8-core 3 GHz MacPro.
None of these computers have been perfect…
…but they’ve been much better than the Windows machines I’ve had to use at work over the years.
Are the new MacBook and MBPs perfect? Of course not.
But they all run the best OS out there, and they are generally better than what one finds in the Windows world.
If perfection is what you seek, you might try some alternate reality.
“When spending $2000 I shouldn’t have to put a $10 filter on the screen.”
Dude, have you ever read `Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance` ? You really oughta……
@@GregM,
Well, I read “Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance” more than once in my late teen years. Great book, one of a kind.
Perhaps we ought to suggest the haters of glossy screens pay $100 for an ‘official’ matte film. Maybe that would soothe their minds.
No Doubt ! The part where Pirsig`s friend balked at the thought of using a piece of lowly aluminum can as a bushing on his BMW`s handle bars is SOOO fiting for this topic !
@Scott in Japan,
That’s exactly what I was thinking when I read @GregM’s post. Glad to know there are others out there who remember Pirsig’s work.
I was required to read by a prof in college. I was in Ad Photo class and the prof was trying to make point about photography. My conclusion (which I had to write in a `quiz`) was that photography couldn’t just be about art. And it couldn’t be just about science (technical details). To reach ‘Zen’ your photography must rise from from the combinations of the two thoughts.
Ooooooww, getting too deep here !
@Scott in Japan,
Definitely deep. It has been more than 30 years since I last read the book, yet I remember parts of it like it was yesterday.
I don’t see the big deal…I’ve had both…if you like it buy it, if you don’t then don’t