Microsoft program manager Stephen Toulouse, in a series of entries on his personal blog, has challenged Apple to hire a security czar and revamp the way information is disseminated when Mac OS X security updates are released.
“Look, the only way you can tackle security issues is by getting out ahead of them and clearly communicating to your users the threat, and the clear guidance on how to be safe,” Toulouse said. “Here’s the reality, for the next couple of years the Mac OS will experience increasing security threats and mark my words, the company will have to seek outside expertise in the form of a head of security communications in the next 12 months,” Toulouse added. The program manager said Apple needs a person “steeped in security issues, true technical analysis, [someone who] can lead a good security team to get good guidance out there,” according to a report from eWeek.com.
Full article here.
MacDailyNews Take: What’s next, Donald Trump advising Patrick Dempsey on hair styling? Rob Glaser lecturing Jack LaLanne on physical fitness? William Hung as Pavarotti’s voice coach? The size of Microsoft’s cojones sometimes defy description.
[Thanks to MacDailyNews Reader “Jim” for the heads up.]
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Related articles:
BusinessWeek: Apple should hire security czar to combat uninformed media FUD – March 09, 2006
Spate of recent Mac security stories signal that Microsoft, others getting nervous – March 06, 2006
Wired News: ‘Mac attack a load of crap’ – February 22, 2006
Ars Technica: Fears over new Mac OS X ‘Leap-A’ trojan pointless – February 20, 2006
Mafiasoft: Microsoft to charge $50 per year for security service to protect Windows – February 07, 2006
Hey, cut him some slack. He is just hoping for a new job opportunity at Apple. Afterall, Microshit aint doing too good right now.
I think the dude is fishing for a job…
Sorry you don’t get into Apple by critizing them publically. You go pitch yourself to human resources.
Apple has had some problems with security, if the increase of market share does come with more malware and exploits, perhaps it would be good for Apple to take some advice.
Roughly translated, “Please hire me, if there’s anything I know as a Microsoft employee its viruses. . .”
“cajones?” ah, no …. “cojones!!!” (bollocks!!!)
Look who is Oinking???
Those who teach, look at them self. As if they have a better security system. Cough cough bfshit bfshit….
Q-Bert, what problems with security?
I keep hearing this but I haven’t seen anything that wasn’t quickly addressed or completely blown out of proportion.
One so-called virus was simply a program that you had to give administrative permission to twice before it did anything and I couldn’t believe the press that thing got.
I am definitely not a apple-can-do-no-wrong kind of guy, but I have friends whose Windows systems were simply inoperable because of all the virus that somehow snuck through their defenses.
I would honestly like to know what security issues Mac OS X has encountered because I don’t know of any that could be called serious or even “problems”.
Look at them self before they preach….
As if they have a better security system
Cough cough bfshit bfshit…..n..bfshit bfshit. Excuse me, where is my cough syrup?
Let’s see if I got this straight.. Apple is at fault because it doesn’t advise people of problems that don’t exist. Microsoft advises people of problems it creates and of solutions to the problems it creates which create further problems that they… etc etc etc. And thereby Microsoft sets the industry standard for doing the right thing and being good guys?
Do these turkeys have to go to stupid school or were they just born that way.
Why would anyone listen to a person in charge of the most insecure OS on earth?
Is like a coach from a loosing team advsing a winner how to win
Weird that MDN even bothers to print it
Sounds like Stephen is looking for a job.
Looks like MDN is fishing for hits again…
for the love of God!! it’s losing, not loosing. Loosing is “to set free, or let loose” losing is ” to fail, to be beaten etc.
Looks like MDN is fishing for hits again…
—
HOW DARE THEY POST NEWS STORIES!
fuzzmanmatt, Scarbro,
I’d agree. And who’d blame him eh.
I am afraid that when you are dominant you rewrite history to suit yourself and disillusioned enough to even believe it. From that arrogance comes the capacity to lecture others. As in politics, from there on do self obsessed dictators emerge, and unquestioning yes men follow in their wake.
where´s the problem
takes one to know one, i say:
If anyone at all has a fair share of expertise in what damage bad security ( and bad communcation of said security holes) can do, it is Microsoft.
Just because it is MS giving advice, I wouldn´t outright ignore it.
macaholic
Thank you for your concern.
I have a loose keyboard
If he’s after the job… then he has just made quite sure he’ll never get it.
More evidence of Microsoft the Arrogant, who can’t see further than their own bank account…
He must live in a glass house lined with stones on the outside.
Spyinthesky, that is the most intelligent comment I ever read on MDN.
Q-Bert, what problems with security?
I keep hearing this but I haven’t seen anything that wasn’t quickly addressed or completely blown out of proportion.
That’s the problem this guy is talking about, Apple doesn’t communicate the level of the threat to consumers, what they need to do etc., etc. before a patch is ready.
Apple’s policy is to say nothing until a patch is ready, not even updating people”s computers to turn off “safe files” and isolating Ternimal.
Folks are left to scrounging websites and posts by people for sometimes innacurrate information or just plain propoganda for all these exploits.
Apple has not have the level of security problems or the experience like Microsoft has had. That’s why this guy wants to bring his experience in these things to Apple and probably get paid well for it.
Apple has had a bad track record of exploits with Mac OS X, perhaps shoddy programming, perhaps just dumb behavior, or perhaps it’s true that with increased market share comes more attacks.
Mac OS X is no longer a 100% solid OS and we were living in a dream world that it was. We can’t be fooling ourselves anymore.
One or two mistakes is fine, but there has been a rash of exploits with Mac OS X.
The trust in the competance of Apple to produce a secure OS has been shattered completely.
http://secunia.com/product/96/
We are all feeling for the underdog, our favorite platform, our quirky little company. But they have failed miserably and now experienced people at Microsoft see a opportunity to bring what knowledge they know to a company who has no experience dealing with these things.
Here, read this article, it’s dead on.
http://www.it-observer.com/articles/1084/mac_viruses_hens_tooth_malware/
Picture of the Playstation 3!!
Those who can’t do it, write about it.
hes got to be kidding, right?
a microworm flunkie lecturing apple on security and “getting out ahead of them”?
when was the last time ms got out ahead of anything?
he (the asshole) should be taking care of his own house before criticizing someone elses.
If providing “advice” means offering some specific, meaningful, useful, and practical guidance for developing more secure code, fine and thank you. Toulouse apparently thinks that openly manifesting an illusion of caring by acknowledging design errors in security is equivalent to security itself. What a maroon.
Toulouse considers handling security issues to be more public relations instead of cultivating an environment for active development of more secure code. I don’t want an ineffectual company that makes apologies, I want a responsible and proactive company that designs better software.
ROFL!!!
I think Microsoft should concentrate on trying to repair the fcuk ups in the security in their own OS before preaching to other companies that have a far better security record about security.
This guy is AN ASSHOLE THAT KNOWS FCUK ALL ABOUT ANYTHING.
Would Luxus hire a Ford engineer? Didn’t think so.
“Look, the only way you can tackle security issues is by getting out ahead of them and clearly communicating to your users the threat, and the clear guidance on how to be safe”
MS, practice what you preach.
Q-Bert wrote: “The trust in the competance of Apple to produce a secure OS has been shattered completely.”
We all know there is nothing like 100% security but this statement is complete and utter b*ll*cks!! I and every other Mac user is no more threatened today than yesterday or any day before that.
Any evidence to show that a genuine user has been compromised? …NO…I thought not.
Back into your win-swamp Q-Bert, you’re clearly no Mac user.
Has this dickhead EVER used a mac?
Obviously not.
Ive been using OS X since version 10.0 and not once have I had ANY security issue or compromise.
btw – I have my own business running 50 macs.
Q-Bert, that article is more dead than on. FUD. The Leap A ‘exploit’ has been out since Febuary 16, and since then how machines have been infected? That’s correct, none. Will Leap B, C or D do better? Perhaps, but for 5 years plus OSX is unblemished. There are VISTA virii in the wild and it’s been out how long? Yes, minus 10 months. Do we need to be alert? Sure. But there has been NO rash of exploits, that’s a plain lie. a ” a bad track record of exploits “? Again, a lie. “No longer a 100% solid OS” Zero exploits on how many running machines? That’s 100% until it’s not. “The trust in the competance of Apple to produce a secure OS has been shattered completely.” FUD, plain and simple. “Apple’s policy is to say nothing until a patch is ready, not even updating people”s computers to turn off “safe files” and isolating Ternimal.” Apple’s policy is to have a Security Update ready within a week or two. Compare and contrast with the ahem, ‘experienced’ M$’s approach of doing patches on a “as they’re ready and a little later” approach.
So far our best defense against malware is just knowing not to type our password unless we’re installing software by choice. That may change someday, but the sky is not falling today.
Yeah, I’d hire the security chief from MS… so he could FAIL miserably once again!! NOT….
They need to make Toulouse take a drug test.
Q-bert, the article you linked to is more of a scathing retort to Mac users than pointing out anything concrete about compromised Mac security. There is a difference between a vulnerability and an exploit. Yes, the Mac OS has had many vulnerabilities revealed and patched over the last few years. But none of those have been successfully exploited. That’s the key word here, “Successfully”. Yes, there have been “proof-of-concepts” discussed and more than a couple “Sky-is-falling” press releases from Anti-virus companies (which leads one to doubt the urgency of the reports, seeing who is the source) but even with Leap.A, there have been NO verifiable exploited Macs. Period. I haven’t seen in any reports on any news site anywhere of a single Mac that was affected. That’s a HUGE positive on the side of the Mac.
As for trust in Apple’s security, I have little worry in that regard. I am certain from the array of released updates and security fixes that Apple is very concerned with maintaining the Mac OS’s track record of security. They know it’s not invulnerable and it *IS* likely that someday someone will come up with an exploit for an undiscovered vulnerability, but until that day happens, I won’t worry too much about it. I have enough things in my life to keep me occupied and worried without adding a “might be, could be” to the list. It’s just not worth the stress.
Whilst it’s true that Apples response to security issues could possibly be better, faster, whatever. To have Microsoft, or at least 1 Microsoft employee say that Apple should be more like them is a joke.
Admittedly Microsoft, due to their larger customer base are going to have to devote more resources to security issues – even security issues of comparable importance to those Apple have had, and yes Apple will have to ramp up their responses as they grow in size but Microsoft have to respond like they do, in such a public way because their massive security issues cause millions/billions of dollars of problems.
So far, all the Apple “problems” have caused me to do is stop running my day to day account as admin – something I really should have done anyway, but even though I hadn’t it didn’t cause me any problems.
Guys, you don’t get the obvioius between the lines message. This guy is telling Apple “Make me an offer.”
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Why wouldn’t he want the job at Apple, Since there
have been no virus’s or worm’s sucessfully
launched , and I’m not counting that feeding frenzy over some suposedly dangerous worms that were out last month.
Why don’t I count them? Did anyone report serious meltdowns from them? Were there worldwide problems in our small market of mac users? No.
Isolated incidents and proof of concepts. Mac is still very secure, but that frenzy in the media was blown out of proportion.
Yea, security at Apple would be a cake walk for Stephen Toulouse
¡Qué huevotes de este tipo!
http://huevocartoon.com/home_contry.asp
Those are cojones!
Real explanation for Vista/Longhorn delay: MS is busy entering these Mac security contests. hard at work trying to make a virus their next Mac application. Its been said before they should have a point person for security, but its funny hearing it from MS.
PS: MDN, “cojones”= slang for testicles. “cajones”= drawer or cabinet type thing.
This wonderful guy is doing everything he can to discourage people from buying a Mac b/c he knows MS is going to get its ass handed to them this year.
As for the communication issue on security threats, I like the way Apple does it. They don’t go making the whole world panic by stating there is a security issue. They fix it (and a few others) and send it out. Also, they don’t make me have to run 37 updates w/ a restart after every one.
Apple needs a security czar about as much as a dump truck needs to drive through a nitroglycerin plant.
MDN word == times as in “The times they are a changin”
we need a term for when someone tries to criticize OS X by linking to Secunia, thereby instantly shattering his/her own credibility, invalidating all future arguments, and providing good chuckles to all.
Today’s winner at “how to lose an argument before you even begin” was Q-Bert. Way to go chief!
Check out Q-Bert, he just Secunia’d himself.
Toulouse–This guy’s mouth is too loose. Of course, it could be that the MS virus thingies are like lice, and he needs to de-louse the OS.
Yes let me think about this for a moment.
Microsoft, the company with an operating system with so many security holes, that it wants to begin selling users a Microsoft security suite to protect it. Hmmm, if you can’t secure your OS, why would I think you could create a security suite that would work any better? I can hear Steve Balmer now… “Please purchase our poorly secured product, and then pay extra for what will surely be another poorly designed and secured product”. If anyone needs to get their security act together, it’s the one with thousands of worms, viruses, mallware, trojans, spyware, and countless other security problems.
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More of the Redmond Mac OS X talking points. Keep tearing down OS X flaws to make Windows seem not so bad. Isn’t it Vista that has been delayed to “upgrade security”? Why would you have to delay an XP update for another 6 months for a security update? Keep it up with the smoke and mirrors MS! Ballmer’s a frickin’ genious!
Nothing like a great big crap first thing in the morning.
In other news:
1. Kia and Hyundai are going to lecture Volvo on auto safety.
2. Afghanistan will lecture the rest of the world on religious tolerance.
3. Rob Glaser will lecture Bart Conner on how to be slim and fit.
4. The U.S. Congress will lecture American consumers on irresponsible spending habits.
5. William Hung will lecture the remaining American Idol contestants on proper vocal techniques.
MW: future, as in, I believe that children ate our future. Treat them well and let them gorge their way.
Crap. That’ll teach me to read the MDN take first next time.
Khutspe maybe.
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Cojones&defid=593322
And the No.1 reason why Vista has been delayed yet again:
All their betas crapped out on malware.
They would never hire him, Apple already has enough Steve’s.
An ounce of Macintosh prevention is worth a ton of Windows cure.
Hey, Qbert! Do your homework before giving your gripes here! Take a look at their views of XP products:
http://secunia.com/product/16/
http://secunia.com/product/22/
Both have a staggering 21% of vulnerabilities UNPATCHED! WTF!
Look at Apple’s. 0% of vulnerabilities unpatched. Tell me now, who’s on their game?
Sheesh.
Steve is bucking for a raise or a carreer change. Obviously, his current job is being a PM for Vista. He is trying to move over to the department OS X misinformation before the axe falls in his current department.
Great comments Steve. Don’t forget to wear your rain proof coat in the unemployment line…Seattle weather can be really nasty. Oh yeah, and the next time you claim to be the leading OS maker in the world…try actually delivering your product instead knocking the other guy’s.
It is not that OS X in breakable. It is that opposed to MS products, it takes intelligence and hard work to break into OS X. So if you write malware for money, at Network Associates or Symantec for instance, you are going to put your efforts to work on the easiest target. You are not going to waste company resources on hard to hit targets. The day Windoze becomes as difficult a target as OS X…then yes we will see the proliferation of lots of Mac malware.
This guy forgets that Apple has a modern day OS designed with security in mind from the ground up and from day one, unlike his patched up last years swiss cheese OS.
Sure some security issues will pop up occasionally, but does Apple need a czar?? I don’t think so.
Yet another advantage to a complete hardware/software solution. Alienware may make Dells dull boxes look cooler,
but they will still rely completely on an old, patched up OS into 2007 and beyond.
Hi, I’m OJ Simpson, and when I’m not playing golf, I will be writing my new blog. Its about domestic violence, self control issues and fine cutlery. I got the idea after reading about the Microsoft guy giving Apple some tips on security.
Q’bert: you’re as bad as Toulouse. No critical thinking going on with you guys (SOS). I don’t know why you’re that way but his problem is that he’s steeped in the big bureaucracy ways of MS and most big businesses.
Bureaucrats by trade make their living by pushing paper (memos, reports, etc), communicating (we will continue having meetings until we figure out why we’re so unproductive) and setting policies (muliple redundancies and quality gates – anyone read minisoft’s blog from the other day?)… This is in large part, according to many who work there, the reason that MS is such dire straights right now. Policies are to managers what a lamp post is to a drunk. It robs people of the need and ability to think for themselve’s. This guy is not a leader and certainly no one that Apple needs in it’s organization. If Apple wants one specific person for that job it will probably take away from the pirate attitude that has typically held sway over Apple and other software companies, at least during successful periods.
don’t worry ampar, you still had a few good ones in there.
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this whole MS preaching to apple thing is a joke. i laughed at it.
Thanks, matt! The one from O. J. was pretty funny too.
It’s comforting to know that arrogance has no upper limit.
Microsoft’s OS department is still trying to hide behind an SEP field (Someone Else’s Problem), Apple is not.
Security is not an “add-on” to the OS that a third party (or separate department) should sell. It’s the sole responsibility of the OS team.
Expertise in creating and managing security issues from the outside is irrelevent when the problems are tackled at the source.
Sorry Steph. but Apple ha little use for your “talents”. Their OS team is adressing the issues it is responsible for.
Wait…..Microsoft and security used in the SAME sentence????
ROTFLMAO!!! WTF!
I can’t stand it! My stomach hurts from laughing so hard!
Pass the eggs!