“Microsoft confirmed Wednesday that it will yank yet another feature from Windows Vista, this time PC-to-PC Sync, a P2P-based technology for keeping files up-to-date on multiple machines. ‘While PC-to-PC Sync is a great feature that improves productivity and collaboration we don’t have it at the quality level our customers demand,’ a company spokesperson said in an e-mail. ‘As a result the decision was made to remove it from Windows Vista,'” Gregg Keizer reports for TechWeb News.
“The departure of PC-to-PC Sync comes just days after Microsoft said it was pulling other features from Office 2007 and letting computer makers install the OS sans the company’s new XPS electronic document format, all under pressure from Adobe,” Keizer reports. “The spokesperson also said that PC-to-PC Sync would be the last feature to be dropped from Vista, and that it hoped to provide it in some fashion down the road.”
Full article here.
[Thanks to MacDailyNews Reader “Mikey” for the heads up.]
MacDailyNews Take: “Quality level our customers demand?” So, when did Microsoft hire Mohammed Saeed al-Sahaf as a company spokesperson? Anyway, just when you thought the ineptitude couldn’t get any worse… Hey, let’s see if we can all come up with a list of all the promised features that Microsoft has gutted from Windows XP SP3, er… Vista. We’ll start: WinFS…
Advertisements:
• Introducing the super-fast, blogging, podcasting, do-everything-out-of-the-box MacBook. Starting at just $1099
• Get the new iMac with Intel Core Duo for as low as $31 A MONTH with Free shipping!
• Get the MacBook Pro with Intel Core Duo for as low as $47 A MONTH with Free Shipping!
• Apple’s new Mac mini. Intel Core, up to 4 times faster. Starting at just $599. Free shipping.
• iPod. 15,000 songs. 25,000 photos. 150 hours of video. The new iPod. 30GB and 60GB models start at just $299. Free shipping.
• Connect iPod to your television set with the iPod AV Cable. Just $19.
• iPod Radio Remote. Listen to FM radio on your iPod and control everything with a convenient wired remote. Just $49.
we don’t have it at the quality level our customers demand. […]As a result the decision was made to remove it from Windows Vista.
Redmond, just be happy you do not sell to Apple users: we would have required you to remove the entire OS!
“While PC-to-PC Sync is a great feature that improves productivity and collaboration we don’t have it at the quality level our customers demand,”
Your customers demand quality?!?!? That’s a headline all by itself.
And if they keep on removing features even calling it Windows XP SP3 would too much. Vista is becoming more and more just a modded Windows XP SP2.
MDN “thirty” as in if we carefully look at it, 30 disappeared features should be easily accounted for by the time modded XP SP2 is released.
EFI bios was removed
“we don’t have it at the quality level our customers demand”
OMG, that is really bad because they have very low standards. Full of bugs wouldn’t be bad enough nor would causing the computer to crash. Must actually catch the computer on fire or something…
the quality level our customers demand . . . . . . . fookin hell, the funniest thing I’ve read.
MDN word . . works, as in, well you know that anyway.
The spokesperson also said that PC-to-PC Sync would be the last feature to be dropped from Vista….
Wonder if their nose started to elongate when they made this ridiculous statement?
” width=”19″ height=”19″ alt=”shock” style=”border:0;” />
DAMMIT.
If it was actually in Vista, Apple might’ve dropped the price of .Mac.
The Windows Powershell (whatever it’s called – the command line interface) has been taken out of Vista.
Peace.
Sadly, I suspect until they drop solitare & minesweeper the average Windows user won’t care.
paraphasing Orwell: (customer) ignorance is (Microsoft’s) strength
,Mac sync still sucks. Apple is constantly mucking around with .Mac mail, sync, backup, etc. If they pro-rated my .Mac renewal based upon unavailability they would owe me money.
I guess they couldn’t perfect a new version of a dialog box showing an animation of a piece of paper flying from one folder to another, like older Windows.
RE the XPS file format thing… Can someone explain why Adobe aren’t making similar moves on Apple for their integration of pdf at the system level? Not trolling – just curious…
If they drop ALL of the planned features they can ship Vista early!
Listen, do you want safe Windows or connected Windows – You have to choose you know.
Don’t forget they took out the Kitchen Sync
Chris said:
“If they drop ALL of the planned features they can ship Vista early!”
Well, no they couldn’t. that would have been three years ago. LOL!
MDN MW=since: how long since the last new system?
Remember MS stated they had to re-write 50 million lines of code inorder to get Vista out the door by Feb 2007. They won’t have to rewrite now, just keep dropping stuff and they will make it soon.
Vista: The “Operation Iraqi Freedom” of the tech industry.
I wish Macs had that feature. What are we gloating about?
The need to coordinate with super-slow, often unreachable .Mac sync servers in order to synchronize a desktop and laptop in my own apartment is silly. This should be a rendezvous… I mean “bonjour’ feature. Of course, that might eat into Apple’s .Mac subscriber justification.
If Macintosh were not the only really viable alternative to Microsoft crud–their big saving grace–they would be wearing the “evil empire” mantle as well.
The hits just keep on coming®.
Dumb asses!
MDN Magic Word: Built. When Winblows XP3 is finally built, will any “new” features be left?
all you people acting like you actually read the whole article didn’t… because MDN’s link to it is broken!
… One more thing®
Rock on Steve!
” width=”19″ height=”19″ alt=”raspberry” style=”border:0;” />
Maybe Apple Should Take Notes:
“.Mac sync still sucks. Apple is constantly mucking around with .Mac mail, sync, backup, etc. If they pro-rated my .Mac renewal based upon unavailability they would owe me money.”
If PC-to-PC Sync was as bad as .Mac, as you contend, rest assured it would have been included in Vista. Because PC-to-PC Sync is not included suggests that, according to your standards of excellence, Microsoft cannot even design something as lame as .Mac . This is hardly a rousing endorsement of the programming acumen at Microsoft.
At the rate Microsoft is deleting features from Vista that do not meet Microsoft’s “standards of quality” it seems that Vista will be nothing more than a minor update to XP rather than the breakthrough OS promised a decade ago.
Another thing, if .Mac is a bad as you claim why haven’t you demanded Apple to prorate your purchase and stop using the product altogether?
“The spokesperson also said that PC-to-PC Sync would be the last feature to be dropped from Vista”
But what he failed to mention was that PC-to-PC Sync was the LAST new feature left!
” width=”19″ height=”19″ alt=”cheese” style=”border:0;” />
MDN is obsessed with Windows…
“the quality level our customers demand”
He he he he he! Thats great!
As the old programmers used to say:
“Lose Lisp, sync ships.”
With .Mac I’ve not had a major problem with it. I have just one machine in my 5 mac setup be the one to send data to .Mac and have the iDisk drive icon on the desktop. Each of my Macs sync with each other on an hourly basis.
Sure there’s the occasional downtime due to maintenence issues. which IMO is standard practice in about every server room in any organisation. Each organisation has to do that in order to provide the service they offer such as you and me, the general public or for the organisations own internal needs to allow it to function in a tech age.
Now since Vista won’t have a .Mac type service for its (future*) users and yes it would be nice to have a price drop should PC-to-PC Sync have gone ahead, but at least now the Mac OS is yet another step above Windows, even more so than before!
*Future, what future, who am I kidding!
MW: alone, as in Mac users will soon no longer be regarded as being an oddity alone in a Windows world.
R if I’m not mistaken I believe that Apple licensed PDF from Adobe when developing OS X.
“we don’t have it at the quality level our customers demand”
…but it IS at the quality level their customers deserve.
What is sick is that Microsoft admits not that it aims low and merely codes to a quality level their customers demand, rather than having their own internal high standards and leading the way by innovating.
—
MDN Word: ‘doubt’; I doubt Vista will ever ship before 2009.
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahha.
we don’t have it at the quality level our customers demand
Translated: the damn thing doesn’t work, nobody knows what’s going on, and we gave up out of sheer hopelessness.
MS needs to release all existing Windows versions as freeware, and then shut down the Windows division for good. The beast is dead and rotting, just bury it already.
The more feaures and functions Microsoft deletes, slashes, and removes from Vista the less Vista it becomes. At this rate, the only original thing about “Vista” when it is finally released will be the packaging. “Yes, folks, after years of hard work we now present a pretty new cardboard box with a joke inside.”
“As it has in the past, Microsoft cited quality concerns as the reason for the feature’s exit. ”
If quality is the main concern for Microsoft, which would certainly be a first, then why not just pull the plug on the friggin’ product all together.
Microsoft’s new tag line should be: Microsoft “Crap-In, Crap-Out”
<u>LOLLIBAGGER</u>I guess they couldn’t perfect a new version of a dialog box showing an animation of a piece of paper flying from one folder to another, like older Windows.
Yeah, they’ve dropped that for a new dialog box showing an animation of a chair flying from one side of Ballmers office to another.
This is new Windows.
MW: I’m looking at many Switchers comin aboard!
“the quality level our customers demand”
It must have been really crappy if they figure that they should pull it now, because 6 months of further development, beta testing and quality assurance isn’t gonna put lipstick on that pig.
I hereby request MDN to post the features and functions promised by Microsoft first in Longhorn then later Vista and now deleted as of 07 June 2006. I need a good laugh.
Excellent request, maczealot.
“Microsoft lops off yet another Windows Vista feature: ‘PC-to-PC Sync’ bites the dust.”
Yeah, but Minesweeper and Solitaire will have transparent windows and net-enabled tournament play.
“Instead of studying for finals, what about just going to the Bahamas and catching some rays? Maybe you’ll flunk, but you might have flunked anyway; that’s my point.”
– Jack Handey
Yeah. Let’s see the list.
I love the comments here. You guys all rock.
Microsoft not so much though…
I don’t think they’ll ship within 12 months.
maczealot asks:
1. WinFS
2. virtual folders
3. Replacement for System Tray in Sidebar
4. Media Center remote for Calendar, Mail, and other components
5. support for RAW image files
6. PC-to-PC Sync
7. Vista Ultimate Extras (features & services), including a Texas Hold-em
8. Virtual PC Express
9. Media Center support for the Xbox 360 Media Center Extender
10. automatic hard disk defragmentation
11. themed slideshows
12. Windows Movie Maker HD
13. resolution-independent vector graphic icons
14. EFI Boot support
Oops, I meant ‘now’, not ‘not’:
“What is sick is that Microsoft admits now that it aims low and merely codes to a quality level their customers demand, rather than having their own internal high standards and leading the way by innovating.”
BTW, coding to “a quality level your customers demand” is the cart leading the horse. Listening to customers is one thing, but solely crafting your product to petty, small-minded user demands for workarounds, fixes and gee-whiz features leads to mediocre products that scream “slapped together”.
A really innovative company can have the foresight to create well-designed and well-implemented features in ways that the user didn’t imagine they could ask for (in a good way) – paradigm shifts etc., not mere incremental refinements to ease complaints, or one-up the other OS for gloss.
Over-hyped tweaks and desperate imitation won’t get Microsoft anywhere, especially when poorly implemented. Oh, wait…I take that back…
What were: ‘Avalon’; ‘Indigo’; ‘Fundamentals’?
Meanwhile, Microsoft has an eye on Adobe’s project (formerly Macromedia), Apollo, that combines PDF, Flash and HTML. The embrace, extend and extinguish machinery rolls on.
.Mac rules. I’ve never had any serious long-term problems with it. It’s saved my bacon a few times, especially when I dropped my laptop at school. Installed a new hard drive, and bam… my Address Book and Calendars were there waiting for me after a sync.
Tommy Boy:
Thank you. I enjoyed a good chuckle after reading the list. However, now I have nothing but pity for the pathetic Windows user. It’s no wonder that the people in the IT department mumble incoherently, fidget with their hands, and avoid eye contact when Leopard and Vista are mentioned. The shame of Microsoft must embarrass PC users tremendously.
I heard that the name Vista is going to be changed to Copland. Oh man, karma IS a bitch.
I can see the MArketing theme now:
Vista – keep looking!
As I remember from my programming days, removing code can cause more problems than keeping it in and making it work. This was especially true when the code base is a convoluted pile of spaghetti.
If you remove something, you’re going to have to do a lot of retesting of test conditions (and even re-defining of test conditions), causing more delays. At this point, nothing comes free…
I can’t see the VISTA because the WINDOWS are shut.
after all the features are gone, they’ll start removing the letters from VISTA
VISTA
ISTA
STA
TA
A
puff! true vaporware
From R: “RE the XPS file format thing… Can someone explain why Adobe aren’t making similar moves on Apple for their integration of pdf at the system level? Not trolling – just curious…”
and
From yadayada: “R if I’m not mistaken I believe that Apple licensed PDF from Adobe when developing OS X.”
yadayada, fortunately for Apple you are mistaken.
The history of Apple’s interface for OS X goes approximately like this.
Way back when (80s) NeXT licensed Postsript and did limited co-development with Adobe of Display Postscript, but IIRC Adobe got all rights to it. NeXT used Postscript as its printer language (the main box did the raster image processing (RIP) rather than the printer) and Display Postscript for its display.
Move forward a decade…
Apple buys NeXT and starts developing OS X in earnest.
Apple investigates buying a license from Adobe for Postscript, Display Postscript and PDF interpreting/rendering technology for their computers. Display Postscript was slow and considered by some to be “not the best technology for screens” but… This would have let Apple keep a lot of the rendering technology from the NeXT OS in the future OS X and help get OS X out the door as quickly as possible.
Adobe wanted a FORTUNE for the license. So…
Apple decided to do the interface on OpenGL and an in house crafted version of a Postscript/PDF interpreter. Apple generated all the code related to the screen rendering software doing the Postscript/PDF pieces by itself using publicly available data. Apple did not — and does not — have to pay a royalty to Adobe to do it. Apple does not pay a royalty to Adobe for the included PDF functionality for every copy of OS X shipped.
As an aside, if you search the ‘net you can find several free PDF interpreters — none of which pay royalties to Adobe.
Now over to Microsoft…
Microsoft’s plan was to have the new Microsoft Office 2007 be able to read old MS Office files as well as Adobe PDF documents — then have MS Office applications be able to modify them as if they were standard MS Office docs. Then MS Office could save the files as either MS Office docs, Adobe PDF docs, or MS Office XPS documents (based upon XML).
Being able to import old MS Office docs and Adobe PDF docs then be able to export them in a proprietary MS XPS doc format is another iteration of MS coopting a standard then extending it with its own proprietary technology then trying to kill off the standard leaving only the MS proprietary technology.
Adobe worked directly with MS to implement the PDF functionality in MS Office 2007. MS was supposed to pay a royalty to Adobe in order to include the functionality in MS Office 2007. The discussions broke down because Adobe wanted a lot more money than MS was willing to pay.
The only way Adobe could force MS to pull the PDF functionality from MS Office 2007 is if either 1) Adobe code is used in the implementation or 2) if Adobe engineers were advising MS directly on how to implement it. Thus Adobe said that MS either had to pull PDF import/export from MS Office 2007 or get sued. MS, knowing it would lose any suit, pulled it.
Adobe has said they are OK with MS having the PDF functionality be a separate download (no doubt with “Adobe PDF Technology” stamped ALL over it). I’ve heard varying stories as to whether the download will be available for free or some small fee. If there is a fee, however small, I’d bet a huge percentage of it goes to Adobe.
Why did MS pull the functionality to output XPS too? I have yet to hear of a solid reason why from people I trust. However, some speculation leads to…
Without the ability to import and manipulate PDF documents the whole “coopt, extend, kill” plan is moot and there’s no real reason to include XPS.
or
There may be some level of Adobe technology at the core of XPS, and MS can’t ship it as part of MS Office 2007 until they do a complete, in house re-write of that code.
Either or both could be true.
I normally don’t do this, but it is way too directly applicable this time.
MDN Magic Word: beyond…
As in “It’s beyond me why MS didn’t just write clean room code to do all the PDF stuff so they didn’t have to deal directly with Adobe or pay any license fees at all.”
Ampar, “I heard that the name Vista is going to be changed to Copland. Oh man, karma IS a bitch.”
My first reaction was to literally laugh out loud. Then I looked at the relative timelines. Thus I’m not ready to say Vista is Microsoft’s “Pink” yet, but they’re getting close.
(Pink was initially running in a limited fashion inside Apple in 1990. In 1997 it still wasn’t ready to ship, and after doing the renaming game a few times Apple finally outright killed it. The big difference between Apple’s Pink OS and Vista is that Apple wanted Pink to be all things to all people [future and past OS users] and include lots and lots of cutting edge technology at any cost while MS seems to be happly throwing core features overboard in an attempt to get it to ship, eventually.)
where is Tom Cruise at a time like this??
Clippy says : I’ll be back
Eventually, MS will have to call it, “\” because that’s as small as Vista can get.
Murray Todd Williams:
“I wish Macs had that feature. What are we gloating about?”
Microsoft boldly promised consumers a decade ago PC-to-PC Sync as well as a multitude of other unique features and innovative functions that are currently eliminated from Vista. Microsoft has failed miserably to achieve the goals that they set themselves and by which they are judged. No one else can be held responsible for Microsoft’s depressing failure nor held accountable to Microsoft’s own audacious benchmark of performance.
Microsoft and lackeys continuously and loudly proclaim Windows as the worlds dominate OS. Microsoft was desperate to substantiate this belief. It has now been revealed that Microsoft’s presumed technological preeminence is nothing more than a massive hoax. Longhorn and Vista were to be the absolute proof of Microsoft’s technological prowess and validate Microsoft’s ubiquity. However, it is unmistakably obvious that Microsoft is woefully incompetent, hopelessly befuddled, inherently unreliable, and dreadfully leaderless.
I had hoped that Microsoft’s promised accomplishments with Longhorn and Vista would stimulate Apple’s competitive juices, because this would ultimately benefit all Mac users. Now it seems that Apple’s greatest competitor is itself. It will be a testament to Apple’s commitment to excellence not to lapse into complacency. I hope that Apple does not disappoint.
Promise little, deliver much is sound advice.
shadowself–thanks for that bit of history, that was amazingly helpful.
They already bought FolderShare. http://www.foldershare.com
It works on Macs and PC’s. Why not just use this?
Great posts that actually say something really useful, thanks to shadowself.
And yep, I’m with you meatofmoose, MS Windows is just a big con. But isn’t it amazing that the can perpetuate it? Making its customers buy protection from itself goes down in history as the most extraordinary business concept ever.
Let’s hope it all ends soon.
for Micro$oft “OS” stands for ON STRIKE
“FEWER FEATURES!!! LATER RELEASE DATE!!! FEWER FEATURES!!! LATER RELEASE DATE!!!! FEWER FEA…”
New in “07
DOS VISTA
Not that anybody cares, but .Mac works just fine for me. Never a glitch in my mail or backups and my web sites just sit there taking the hits.
“at the quality levels our customers demand”….
what, having it actually work? Lord forbid!
So besides updated icons, what is actually IN Windows Vista?
I mean, besides the higher price tag and seven version choices.
Which brings up the next question: How do you have seven different versions of an OS when there’s no features in any of them?
We just need to start a new phrase, usable every time another feature gets dropped…
Hasta la VISTA, baby!
OzzysCross101: this one’s for you.
The New Vista copy dialog
http://manufracture.livejournal.com/160764.html
With the latest Vista announcements I’m getting a mental flashback from the “Wizard of Oz” with “Toto” pulling the curtain back and revealing the “Great and Powerful Oz” as this bumbling old guy putting one over on everyone for years.
This is Microsoft’s story–inept and deception. Their great and powerful leader(s) keeping the residents of “Oz” (workers and clients) bluffed and believing.
Wake up PC users, and return to Kansas.
Or click your ruby slippers 3x and you’ll wake up in an Apple Store.
If I still owned a PC, I would make that my dialog for everything, even if it wasnt throwing something out/moving something. Thanks!
” width=”19″ height=”19″ alt=”raspberry” style=”border:0;” />