[UPDATE: April 27, 2010: This article was originally published on April 26, 2010 at 1:24pm EDT with an attribution error. We have changed the headline and also changed body of article to correctly identify “Australian PC Authority.” We apologize to “PC Advisor” for our error.]
“This works to a degree, but the unfortunate side effect is that when things run really hot the entire laptop body heats up to an uncomfortable level. This can quite easily shift a laptop from being pleasantly warm in one’s lap to something that is dangerous to one’s health,” Baxter and Gillooly report. “Such situations are why product marketers made a concerted effort in the early half of this decade to shift the naming of such devices from laptop to notebook.”
Baxter and Gillooly report, “During testing of the latest Core i7-620M based 17in Macbook Pro we noticed that there were problems running certain tests in our benchmark suite. The score being spat out for the Photoshop tests – fourth in a suite of six test applications – in particular was quite low, and we wondered whether it was down to heat issues. When the test was then successfully run as a standalone test with the Macbook sitting on its side, unibody base exposed to the air, we suspected that the Core i7 was struggling within the Aluminium shell of the Macbook.”
MacDailyNews Note: Just a bit of clarification: The MacBook Pro was being put through benchmark tests which naturally push the hardware to its extremes in order to measure maximum results. During normal use, these extremes might never be reached. (Unless you’re trying to watch an Adobe Flash video. 
)
Baxter and Gillooly continue, “To test our suspicions further we booted into Windows (hooray for Boot Camp) and watched what happened when the CPU was loaded to full… We then switched to Maxon’s Cinebench 11.5. This is a 3D rendering benchmark that is used to test multithreading in CPUs, and loads up all cores with rendering tasks. During this test the Core i7 spiked at 95 degrees Celsius, tantalisingly close to the boiling point of water.”
MacDailyNews Note: The temperature noted is under Windows, not Mac OS X, running a benchmark app designed to max out the processor, and measures the processor surface temperature, not the MacBook’s external case temperature.
Baxter and Gillooly continue, “We repeated the Cinebench test in OS X, and, as with the Windows version, the CPU temperature climbed precipitously high – topping out at 90 degrees Celsius. The underside heat sensors were only registering 39 degrees when this happened, even though the underside near the CPU was almost too hot to touch.”
MacDailyNews Note: 39° C equals 102.2° F.
Baxter and Gillooly continue, “Worryingly the heat buildup in the CPU doesn’t register on the enclosure sensors. This is despite the chassis getting hot to the touch, and the heat buildup being registered on all the hardware-based sensors in the Macbook Pro.”
MacDailyNews Take: What the hell is worrying about that? It’s proof positive of Apple’s excellent hardware design. The part that the user can touch gets warm, but not dangerously so, while the processor when abnormally stressed to maximum levels hit temperatures that do not exceed Intel’s thermal spec for the MacBook Pro’s Intel Core i7 Mobile Processor (I7-620M) of 105° C.
Baxter and Gillooly continue, “To test just how much an influence cramming the Core i7 into the unibody Macbook Pro has we re-ran the tests on a Fujitsu Lifebook SH 760. This uses the same Core i7-620M CPU as the Macbook, but is designed with a copper heatsink that vents out the left side of its plastic shell. The CPU started out with an idle temperature of 40 Degrees. After 3 consecutive Cinebench runs the maximum CPU temperature seen was 81 Degrees, a full 20 below that experienced with the Macbook. It was also cool to the touch.”
MacDailyNews Take: Meaningless. Baxter and Gillooly’s own tests prove that Apple’s 17-inch MacBook Pro Core i7 processor does not exceed Intel’s thermal spec of 105° C even when running a test designed to maximize processor load. Australian PC Authority has added an update to their article: “Update: Just to clarify the comments about the HWMonitor screenshots. The version used (1.15) predates the Core i7-620M CPU’s release. This means that HWMonitor incorrectly reports the CPU as a Core i5. The Cinebench program in the background of the shots reports the CPUs correctly as 2.6GHz Core i7-620M models in both laptops. The references to the CPU in the Fujitsu Lifebook are correct.”
Baxter and Gillooly continue, “Apple sits the Core i7 at the top end of its Macbook Pro Range. From our testing in both Windows and OS X it seems that while the CPU is powerful, the heat output associated with it running at full load is definitely a cause for concern. In this case the fantastic looks of the unibody Aluminium design are let down by the sheer amount of heat buildup experienced.”
MacDailyNews Take: Bullshit. The MBP’s i7 heat output is within Intel’s own safe operating temperatures and the MacBook Pro’s case seems to be executing one of its main missions, to dissipate a processor’s heat before it reaches the user, in excellent fashion, as Baxter’s and Gillooly’s own tests prove.
Baxter and Gillooly continue, “The generally cool styling of the Macbook Pro just doesn’t seem too capable when put up against the sheer output of Intel’s Core i7 processor. This is reinforced by the Fujitsu Lifebook running 20 degrees cooler in the same tests with the same CPU.”
Full article here.
MacDailyNews Take: To recap: The MacBook Pro’s Core i7 processer never exceeds Intel’s thermal spec limit. The MacBook Pro’s case gets warm under maximum and abnormal processor stress, up to 3.6° F above normal human body temperature, or 98.6° F. OMG, alert the media!
Enjoy the overblown hyperbole this piece of propaganda is sure to generate among the less-than-critical thinkers throughout the blogosphere and mainstream tech media.
At the very least, Apple ought to demand a prominent retraction and apology.
All macs have thermal sensors in them which monitor temps. If the temp goes over the spec limits the Mac shuts down. So the fact that the MacBook Pro never shut down during there bench marking also proves that it never reached or passed unsafe temps.
@MDN: could you please give us their email….. I think it’s time to flame the trolling hit whores.
They were running FLASH …
Oh hear we go again lol
There is something of an update to this, too, on the issue of the i5 screenshot. The article now states that the tool that shows the temps and processor was written before the i7 was created and is erroneously showing the i7 as an i5.
So, if true, they really did compare it to a Fujitsu with an i7. Not that the article isn’t without plenty of flaws still. The fact that they initially included that screenshot without that explanation shows shoddiness at best.
Call 911, send out the police to confiscate all data, machines, and idiots responsible for this story, and add this prosecution to the DA’s pending list.
This story is unforgivable – there’s never anything wrong with any of Steve’s products. Never.
@Dinjin201, “@MDN: could you please give us their email….. I think it’s time to flame the trolling hit whores.”
http://www.pcauthority.com.au/Info/Feedback.aspx?Author=138500
My core2 mbpro gets to hot to put in my lap after a period of time. Even with 3rd party fan controls cranked. My dells get hot too but not near as much. Haven’t used the i7 but the iPad is awesomely cool.
I do agree that it may not exceed spec, but I don’t doubt it’s way too hot for comfort. Spec does not equal comfort.
The critical issue about the article remains the fans being presumably stuck at idle (2000rpm) even while the CPU is near its maximum temperature – that is extremely implausible with a properly functioning MBP. The fans should be revved up to or beyond 6000rpm at that point, and should be clearly audible.
The testers have neglected to mention anything about that, even despite presumably having used tools which clearly indicate the fan rpm.
This is either an intentional hit piece, sabotaging proper operation of the cooling system of the MBP or plain old shoddy journalism, possibly while being too incompetent to detect a system malfunction which is not present in regular units.
the lifebook is defective by their tests. Core iX processors are supposed to over-clock automatically until there thermal limit is reached. A 105 degree chip should be at around 100 degrees when maxed out. The lifebook operating at 80 under max load should not happen unless its thermal limits had been set lower. That said if the MBP is getting that hot on the outside it is defective the i& has the same max TDP as the previous core 2 and should not run any hotter.
Fact: Fujitsu Lifebook is 20 degree cooler.
Our PC users just got the new Dell Dell Precision M4500 laptops with the i7 Procs and they are running extremely hot as well. Just installing the OS and basic programs the things are HOT!!
Let this thing play out. There may be some validity to the Aussie PC report, or there may be one or more flaws in their methodology. If their temperature story is valid, then additional testing will be required to determine whether the problem is systemic to the MBP lineup, or isolated to a subset of units. I seem to recall that there was an issue of a defective CPU heatsink bond in the past.
After seeing quite a few Windows and Apple laptops at work, it is apparent that the MBP is quite a bit thinner and more compact than most Windows portables. So it wouldn’t be all that surprising to discover that the MBP has more difficulty dumping the heat of a hard running, high end CPU. Perhaps Apple’s fan management settings favor battery life a little too much relative to CPU operating temperature – Apple has issued fan management firmware updates in the past.
The key is not to get too worked up over one report. More testing is needed. If there is a thermal issue, you can bet that Apple will jump on it. The MBP line is their bread and butter.
If they commented that it was “almost too hot to touch,” implying that they didn’t believe the case sensors, why didn’t they just touch a thermometer to the case and measure it themselves?
Kick ass MDN. Nice sanity inducing commentary!
In any case, I have never sat an Apple ‘laptop’ directly on my laptop in many years. I use a same-size portable desk on which to sit it, bringing it along with me in my laptop bag. I’ve tossed on a couple ‘feet’ directly on the portable desk to provide some more air space under the laptop. Love it. No hot lap, and my Apple laptops run cooler as a result of better heat dissipation.
The Belkin model portable desk I have is no longer made. But there are plenty of thin and light models around, including some with built in fans. So if you don’t like lap temperatures above body temperature, get one.
omg is MDN rly blind… all u need to point out here is 2000 RPM fan speed and u can see that PC authority article is BS…
Whether or not the tests or methodology used is flawed, there seem to be reports of some heat issues with the i7 MBPs. I wonder how well the 15-inchers deal with it.
This is a concern for me because I’m about to order a 15″ i7. My other concern would be over time, as the MBP sucks dust inside, it will further raise the temperature.
My current MBP (a 2008) occasionally shuts down due to overheating (damn that Call of Duty 4
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102 degrees is hot to the touch. That is hot tub temp. While 98.6 is our internal or core operating temp our skin temp is more than 25 degrees lower. See we have a stuctural cooling system too.
So while I’d agree that the MBP might feel hot these two are clearly seeking a differance between a PC and a MBP and writing so as to deliberatly gain attention. It seems to me that the correct response is to conclude that there is not much to see and move on. However, we all know that’s not how journalisms works these days. Wait for the headlines folks. OMG OMG The MBP adds to Global Warming, or more likely some varient of Source of Polar Melt Down Found it’s Apple Computer.
I’m old enough to remember when having something hot sitting on your lap was a good thing.
I remember a Mac portable computer weighing about 25 pounds. I almost bought it.
@ Big Al
Good one…
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This is why I use a desktop and soon, an iPad.
Ah, I see that the article has been rewritten due to Macdailynews’ need to save face by printing some glaring mistakes, such as the comment about the i7 showing as an i5, when in fact that is normal because the CPUs are so architecturally similar. Nevermind the fact that the CPU is still getting extremely close to the absolute max temperature value of the CPU
MacDailyNews Note: The temperature noted is under Windows, not Mac OS X, running a benchmark app designed to max out the processor, and measures the processor surface temperature, not the MacBook’s external case temperature.
———————
Why would someone want to measure the Macbook’s external case temperature? The temperature of the case is easily measured by the users HANDS, while the CPU needs to be monitored by a diode in order to prevent damage and thermal throttling.
MacDailyNews Take: What the hell is worrying about that? It’s proof positive of Apple’s excellent hardware design. The part that the user can touch gets warm, but not dangerously so, while the processor when abnormally stressed to maximum levels hit temperatures that do not exceed Intel’s thermal spec for the MacBook Pro’s Intel Core i7 Mobile Processor (I7-620M) of 105° C.
Proof positive of Apple’s thermal design? If the author doesn’t know how to interpret these results then they need some very basic education in thermodynamics and heat transfer. If the source of the heat has a thermal diode and it reads a very high temp, while the heatsink attached to that device is relatively cool, then the heat isn’t being transferred. Wow, proof positive of Apple’s design all right. It’s proof positive of a flawed thermal design that isn’t properly displacing the heat from the CPU, which is the most critical component in the laptop (and the most sensitive to heat)
Just because it is below the absolute maximum doesn’t mean that it’s a good thermal design. Most laptops with i7s aren’t anywhere near this temperature range. This could EASILY be alleviated by the following:
using higher quality thermal paste
using larger diameter fans or increasing the RPM
using larger mass in copper heatsinks
using larger exhaust ports
The fans obviously aren’t behaving normally in these laptops, or people wouldn’t need to install SMC fan control software just to prevent their laptops from overheating.
MacDailyNews Take: Bullshit. The MBP’s i7 heat output is within Intel’s own safe operating temperatures and the MacBook Pro’s case seems to be executing one of its main missions, to dissipate a processor’s heat before it reaches the user, in excellent fashion, as Baxter’s and Gillooly’s own tests prove.
Exactly how is allowing the CPU to reach a few degrees from TjMax ‘executing one of its main missions, in excellent fashion’? If it were doing it in excellent fashion it would be running temperatures that of every other laptop on the market, some 30C lower.
If you guys were true Apple fans you would be concerned that your beloved Apple was selling you products that performed so poorly and do something about it instead of just putting your head in the sand and denying the problem exists, such as adjusting the fan profiles to prevent problems in the long run (yes, it is possible to cause desoldering at these temps, not to mention premature thermal paste failure)
It’s an absolute joke to think that temps over 100C are anything but alarmingly high. Just google ‘macbook pro overheating’: it’s not like this is a new problem.
http://blog.ziggytek.com/2010/01/06/why-your-macbook-macbook-pro-is-overheating/
http://www.appledefects.com/wiki/index.php?title=MacBook_Pro
Apple forums
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=11360530�
Also check this thread at a forum with comments about the article. There are a handful of people admitting that their MBPs ovearheat frequently, and they’re not frothing Apple fanboys like some of the commentors here. Just becuase you like Apple laptops doesn’t mean that you can’t objectively look at their products and recognize a problem when one exists, and it obviously does.
http://www.overclock.net/hardware-news/720246-pcauth-new-mbp-cant-handle-i7.html