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"…copied to a blank CD in Microsoft's Windows Media Audio format."

And that, boy and girls, is why the whole effort is a waste of everyones's time. Who's dumb enough to make an unpopular format even more abhorant? Asked and answered.

They're COMPUTERS for fuxsakes! If you can play it back, you can copy it digitally. Like all the other ill-fated methods, this will be be cracked by one entrepreneuring hacker and shared with the many within the usual timespan of 24-72 hours.

You used to be able to circumvent this protection by holding down the shift key when inserting the CD. Apparently works on the Dark Side. This may be an "enhancement" to that system though
mw: Spirit as in "not in keeping with the"

More reason to buy your music from the iTunes music store...

To answer the MDN take, it's another type of CD that consumers should refuse to purchase. Should this become mainstream, I will never buy another CD again - I'll stick with iTunes. It's funny that they try to appease the consumer by offering picture galleries on the CD. What a joke.

Ok sooooo

I find it hard to believe that someone won't crack this before the end of the week.

I also don't understand how the disc could possibly tell my computer that it can ONLY rip .wma files.

This sounds like a product that will work like intended in Windows, but NOT like intended on Mac's.

I feel like buying one just to see what can.. and can't be done.

"The DRM embedded on the discs bars the burned CD from being copied..."

It sounds like you can't copy a burned disk to iTunes or an iPod. It doesn't say anything about copying an original CD to iTunes or an iPod. So what is the big deal?

Sony BMG labels are:
Arista Records
BMG Classics
BMG Heritage
BMG International Companies
Columbia Records
Epic Records
J Records
Jive Records
LaFace Records
Legacy Recordings
Provident Music Group
RCA Records
RCA Victor Group
RLG - Nashville
Sony Classical
Sony Music International
Sony Music Nashville
Sony Wonder
Sony Urban Music
So So Def Records
Verity Records

So now you know who to avoid. But if you like all the top 40 music and want to buy those CDs, you're going to have a hard time avoiding what they are forcing on you.

"Under the new solution, tracks ripped and burned from a copy-protected disc are copied to a blank CD in Microsoft's Windows Media Audio format. The DRM embedded on the discs bars the burned CD from being copied. "
- It sounds like it might only apply to songs ripped in the WMA format. So as Escaport said, you probably can still rip the original to iTunes and then transfer to an iPod.

- If you can still do what you like with the original, then I don't see this as too much of a problem, but I agree with JadisOne that if at all possible, consumers should not buy and support this CD format.

You guys are all criminals. Stop music piracy. The intellectual property is exclusive to the corporation and musician, not for your unfettered sharing and use.

CDs with this kind of copy protection are, AFAIK, not Red Book-compliant CDs and should not be marketed as such.

Copy protection should be implemented using SCMS technology and players like iTunes, Windows Media, etc. should be obliged to recognise SCMS flags - however, given that every man and his dog seems to be able to write a media player nowadays, the likelihood is that this situation will never occur.

So, assuming that there is no warning on the exterior packaging of what we shall now call "The Fake CD", here's the answer…

1) Buy the CD - even if you don't want it.
2) Take it back to the store the next day and say it doesn't work in your Mac or in conjunction with your iPod.
3) When record stores get tired of processing 30,000 refunds for every Sony BMG release, they'll flag them with "The Mark Of Cain" by informing you in store that the disc won't work with an iPod.
4) The 12-34 age group will stop buying the Fake Discs in store.
5) The stores will cease giving the Fake Discs shelf and warehouse space
6) The record companies will be left with huge volumes of redundant stock

And what's to prevent someone on any machine from sucking the audio off the "protected" CD at a later time using the various software offerings that are out there for directly tapping into the audio feed?

The rest of it just doesn't make sense on so many levels.

"You guys are all criminals. Stop music piracy. The intellectual property is exclusive to the corporation and musician, not for your unfettered sharing and use"

And you're an idiot. I think most people here are just referring to the fact that they want to be able to put it on their iPods, and cannot.

Does that make us criminals? The answer is no.

I just read an article where Alicia Keys brags about how touring is so much better now because thanks to iTunes she can take her entire music collection with her on tour without it taking up a lot of space. She also said she owns a Mac. Alicia is with J records, a Sony/BMG label.

MW = "dead" (no lie!)

I'm fine with whatever restrictions that music companies impose on their property.

You should be fine with it too. If not, don't buy their product.

Bunch of mac-whiners. Boo hoo, it doesn't work with my precious iPod.

How can a DRM protected CD that is encoded with WMA be played on a regular stereo system? Has Sony abandoned all of the billions of plain CD players from the past? Is everyone going to play their music through their computers now?

I think if it can be played on my Bang & Olufsen, then there will be a way to rip it into iTunes and the iPod. At least, I hope so...

That article gives no clue as to how this works. If it burns in Windows Media format what can you play that on? Does it only copy to a blank CD (requiring 2 drives) or does it rip to your hard drive first...?????

If it doesn't adhere to the compact disc standards setup 20 years ago (by Sony no less), it shouldn't have the "compact disc" logo/blurb on it.

These guys are also focussing on the wrong people ... it's the pirates they should be chasing - sending people to markets and the like where pirates run rampant... busting them for their dirty deeds. It's the average consumer who tries to the right thing who ends up getting screwed in all of this (and this has been said time and again by just about everyone).

It'll come to a point where no one will want to buy stuff from these guys due to excessive restrictions, incompatibilities and anything else these dickheads come up with.

I for one won't buy protected cd's, not because i can't rip them and make copies, (since I generally don't), but b/c of the slavish mentality they foster... we're "guilty until proven innocent" in their eyes.

Screw them by not buying music. Rip it off radio or do it analogue from your mate's discs... who cares... on an iPod it's compressed to the sh*t anyway.

Nick is right: all the more inducement to purchase music online via iTMS, with a fair DRM and as many CD hardcopies as you want.
These guys at the big labels are trying desperately to squeeze the toothpaste back into the tube. Buying CDs is so out...

MW "gave" as in: Sony BMG introduced copy protection and nobody gave a shit.

"I also don't understand how the disc could possibly tell my computer that it can ONLY rip .wma files."

I think this is a variant of a copy protection technique tried before. The end user's computer does not "rip" the CD tracks, it copies existing WMA files from the disc. And those WMAs are already "protected."

Kind of a stillborn idea IF it will not work with the number one selling music player on the market...

I forget his name, but he's sad and friendless.

Sorry, that was {mean}.

i'm with stantheman, this guy is truly a visionary and not at all a complete turnip.

You do mean "Sony BMG" in the headline, and not "Song BMG" don't you?


joe

http://www.rogueamoeba.com/audiohijack/

Move along folks, nothing to see here.

"Bunch of mac-whiners. Boo hoo, it doesn't work with my precious iPod."

Well, looks like someone got beat up a lot as a kid.

"Bunch of mac-whiners. Boo hoo, it doesn't work with my precious iPod."

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't the majority af iPods sold to PC users?

Any company willing to exclude 20% of the world's computer users, many of whom are in the 75th percentile for income and consumer spending, is just stupid.

Someone's smokin' crack in Tokyo.

"So now you know who to avoid. But if you like all the top 40 music and want to buy those CDs, you're going to have a hard time avoiding what they are forcing on you."

Most people will avoid what music companies are forcing on them by doing what they've always done, namely download the music they want from P2P networks. Only the most optimistic PR type doesn't think that this DRM will be cracked, and their "protected" content flooding the Internet before they can say "BitTorrent".

My heiny is sore from Dell support.

Not again...what's burning!!??

[NO CARRIER]

Only a dumb person would buy such a disc which shouldn't be allowed to be put in the same inventory as a compact disc since the audio is in a degraded format and not an aiff format. Boycott Sony BMG CD's! Now if Apple is able to continue to sell Sony BMG discs encoded in iTunes without this abstruction then I guess that's the only way I'm going to purchase my music from Sony BMG label. So this can only help iTunes even more while hurting themselves being Sony that is. Otherwise they lose in two ways. Buy selling such a degraded disc that no one will buy and also limiting the content from iTunes music store. For if such content cannot be encoded then Apple can't put it up in iTunes either. It would seem like a contract dispute between Sony BMG and Apple would insue since Apple did make a deal with all the record labels to be able to sell there music on the iTunes music store.

This system does not work well with the way I legally use my music.

In the old days I would simply play my original CD's until they became scratched and then listen to them scratched.
Nowdays I usually copy my favorite CD and I play both copies. I listen to my burned copies in the truck. I listen to the original at home.

I have at times been thankful that I had a back-up CD because over time the original got scratched. I simply made another back-up of the burned copy.

This may not be the best method of doing things, but it has been my pattern. I'll have to change with this new technology at the cost of 1 extra blank CD for every albumn I purchase. Assuming they let me make 2 copies.

Am I the only one, who has had an original CD that was a scratched and it skipped.
You made a back-up copy of the CD because it was starting to skip.
The back-up copy ended up not skipping and became your master copy.

Surely I can be alone on this one.

Stantheman why don't you read what were talking about instead of making dumb comments that don't relate to anything but your stupidity!

Everyone here buys there music either from CD in a record store or on iTunes. Our concern is if this copy protection is so complicated and blocks us users of iPods from transfering it to our iPods. And in a format we prefer instead of that crappy WMA format. If iTunes Music store can still sell Sony BMG the way they have been then this is a non-issue. We will just buy it from iTunes and make our own CD's. Otherwise there is some trickery going on here and I'm sure Sony BMG will be getting a call from Mr. Steve Jobs on this issue.

can should have read "can't"

Just another stunt by Sony to leverage Apple a bit and get them to come back to the table. This is bigger than CDs, it has to do with how much Sony will have to bend over to distribute their movies. If Sony can annoy Apple by creating CD with un-FairPlay DRM, then they have another chip with which to bargain.

Is Apple refusing to license it's software or is Microsoft refusing to port it's software to the Mac? The FUD works both ways in this case.

Who would buy these CD's? Get the good singles from iTunes or P2P, if you must. Someone will break the DRM and upload them. Or someone from outside the States will make them available.

"So now you know who to avoid. But if you like all the top 40 music and want to buy those CDs, you're going to have a hard time avoiding what they are forcing on you."

Which leaves you with the sole option of developing your own musical judgement instead.

Do you really think the 'artists' the popular musical establishment is marketing at any given time offers anything musically that hasn't been done before in the past, and far, far better at that? iTunes is essentially a giant library of all kinds of Western music over the past 500+ years. Open (& turn on) your mind, maybe pour yourself a beverage, sit back and surf around some of the recommended playlists in iTunes, and LISTEN to some of the great music out there, instead of responding to the shallow veneer of image and marketing. Listen to Keith Jarret. Bill Evans. Listen to Yes. Listen to Egberto Gismonti. Listen to some great classical guitarists. Listen to Bach. Paco. Maybe a few Grateful Dead tunes. Music is huge, people. Once you start really listening, these corporate people will cease to have the kind of power over you they currently enjoy.

Here are some tunes to get you started:

http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=916132&selectedItemId=954324
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=18294676&selectedItemId=18294721
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=578843&selectedItemId=578822
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=3271089&selectedItemId=3271072
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=1178111&selectedItemId=1458430
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=5171071&selectedItemId=5171769
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=371867&selectedItemId=371849
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=1364000&selectedItemId=1363992
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=2736066&selectedItemId=2735993
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=12449&selectedItemId=12377
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=2620110&selectedItemId=2620090
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=13346&selectedItemId=13340
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=2561353&selectedItemId=2561283
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=3502085&selectedItemId=3502456
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=24088166&selectedItemId=24141036
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=30464&selectedItemId=30454
http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewAlbum?playlistId=16046155&selectedItemId=16046352

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

GREAT!! If you seriously think people are going to ditch their iPods because Sony doesn't like Apple, you're nuts.

This is too funny. TOO FUNNY.

It's just a pain in the ass and a nuissance for customers. YAY!

Oh well, I'm sure not many people will complain.

"I'm fine with whatever restrictions that music companies impose on their property. "

assuming you're not joking, your position is bizzare. It implies that law abiding, non-pirating music buyers MUST not want anything other than what the music industry gives them. However, it is totally possible to completely follow the license and NOT like the restrictions they company imposes. Consumers should and do have every right to tell companies their opinion of the product. Following the agreement and being "fine with" it are two different things. Music buyers shouldn't pirate, but they should loudly and consistently bitch about retarded DRM schemes that make what was standard use for 30 years now impossible or difficult.

This actually could be a threat to Apple. It's not so much that people will ditch iPods they've already purchased, but some new buyers will be less likely to buy an iPod if they can't play new Sony BMG tunes. If this were to catch on with other companies in the recording industry it would, of course, kill the iPod. Do I think that is LIKELY? Well, I don't really know enough about the recording industry to know who would win that pissing contest, and it definitely would be a declaration of war by Sony.

Why would anyone want to copy a disc to another disc. Wouldn't most people just want to have their original disc sitting on the shelf and a copy on their mp3 player or computer.

It only takes one to crack this, share it, and BAM. Whoever wants a copy will find it.

mmmm.. competition. Don't you just love it.

I hate record companies. They have no concept that the world is changing and deserve to die and go to hell.

You could still play the CD on your stereo and record it through line in with an iMic. A bit more cumbersome, and it would have to be done in real time but it is doable.

I am not going to boycott Sony/BMG.

If, in an off-chance, I actually buy one of these non-standard CDs and it doesn't work properly, I will be one son-of-a-bitch with the retailer.

"Don't tell me I can't return an opened CD. Its supposed to be uncopyable. Why the paranoia?"

"Don't tell me the disc isn't defective. It was mislabled as a Compact Disc. It isn't a Redbook Standard Compact Disc."

No retailer's policy is going to get in my way. Sony will likely receive a large number of returns from PO'd consumers.

Until and unless Apple increases the bitrate of their iTune store songs, I won't purchase anything from them. CDs remain the only option for me.

What it will come down to at some point is whether Apple has reached critical mass on ITMS and iPods. If the store bought CD does not work on iTunes and it is available on ITMS then people will buy from ITMS and it will end up helping Apple. The push will come to shove if these are made only available through the store bought version. The question will be whether music companies can afford to blow off that much of the market.

Does anyone know what percentage of the Market is now using the iPod? You can't just look at straight user numbers either. The people who buy iPods are generally the people who are more into music and who buy more music.

And then of course DVD Jon will probably turn his attention to this at some point and make it all irrelevant again.

Stantheapologist:
"I'm fine with whatever restrictions that music companies impose on their property. You should be fine with it too. If not, don't buy their product. Bunch of mac-whiners. Boo hoo, it doesn't work with my precious iPod."

You'll be fine with it, too, when Sony CDs can only be played on Sony CD players through Sony amps and speakers, too, right? What, do you work for Sony?

When I buy a CD, I buy the music, not the plastic disk. The law states that I have the right to copy that music onto cassette tapes, CDs, or whatever media I like as long as it's for my own personal use. This is know as "fair use".

Get a clue. You're as arrogant as the record companies.

ed, as much as I agree with you, the reality of the situation is that the CDs that top the charts are the ones that get heavy rotation on the airwaves and as a result, those CDs are the ones most purchased. What we have here is the record industry trying to control and change the behavior of the masses.

I like your recommendations. Might I suggest a little Debussy or Liszt for your listening pleasure? Um, William Shatner?

Waith until we buy Sony.