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Q: What do Republican supporters on this site have in common with
George W. Bush?

A: Just read ron and Fred Mertz's posts and work it out for yourself.

fsck Demoncats and fsck Repugnicans

Just like computer users are going Mac, so are people saying "fsck you" to the two-party system.

Something Microsoft is sweeping under the rug is that for their search to be anything like Spotlight, Longhorn needs to utilize a whole new file system, WinFS. They have already announced that WinFS will NOT be on Longhorn, and was one of the missing major features that made their beloved Longhorn go from being "revolutionary" to "evolutionary".

To make it worse, even when WinFS comes out, the older files will remain non-WinFS files and they will not be able to be indexed with the same detail. This means that even WHEN WinFS is added to Longhorn and IF they have a Spotlight-quality search function, all of the older files could remain partially hidden from the new WInFS search.

With Microsoft at it's unimaginable best, it is still a very poor copy of Apple.

It makes no difference who thought of it first. I can draw a picture of a flying car that a 10 year old could operate, but it is totally useless if I can't create the plans to build one. Having an idea is far different than being able to make it come true. Apple not only does it, they do it right!

So instead you gussle down Steve Jobs Baby Badder huh??

All of you are Knob Goblin', Spunk eaters.

Get a life.

(MW) Closed, as in, who gives a fsck? Except, ofcourse, all of you.

Re: politics...

We ain't no republic and we ain't no democracy. There is absolutely no doubt that the US has evolved into a oligarchy of the wealthy, individuals and large corporations. The people merely vote for which person seems to be the best liar that can best convincingly tell them what they want to hear. The two "parties" are merely political groups, both controlled by the wealthy, that cater to two slightly different types of corporations. That's it!!

If you don't believe me, read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligarchy , and tell me that it doesn't describe the current political condition of the US!!

Not so long ago I read comments from someone at MS admitting that their search technology was partially inspired by iTunes. MS is trying to rewrite history again.

I wish Apple had copied Microsoft. Would have given MS a taste of their own medicine. fortunately for us, Apple does just fine on its own.
It's so satisfying to sense the fear coming out of Goliath.

Mike,

Great link. I like Wikipedia.

Didn't Apple register some patents regarding Spotlight?

If Longhorn has been in development this long WHAT HAVE THESE PEOPLE BEEN DOING. They must be getting payed by the hour

Drunk New Orleans Guy.

OOOOwwww!!! Toucy, Touchy. Algore will love you when you're sober. Line-up for your check. Or do they mail them now?

I had desktop indexed search in System 7 with a wonderful program called Thunder. Also used a time and contacts manager called Datebook/Touchbase Pro. Someone needs to copy both.

I was more productive in 1991 than I am now! Example: If I wanted to address a letter, I looked up the name in Touchbase, and selected a menu item that placed a properly formatted name/address on the clipboard, which I could then paste into the letter. Total time taken: about the time it took to type in the name and grab the mouse. You can't do that in Address Book, at least that I have found. Sigh.

Now, I know that we don't write as many letters as we used to, but WTF?

Did anyone listen to what Steve said in the Keynote. To paraphrase, he said that they realized they had already solved the speed of searching with iTunes.
Has any build of Longhorn been out longer than iTunes??
Duh!...I don't think so!! Buncho dweebs at M$.
Besides, it don't really exist until it's out the door...if you can't use it,
then what does it matter who was first.
M$in should be happy because they now have something to copy to get theirs right...but will they get it right?? I won't be holding my breath.

Where does the "Algore" stuff come from? Is that a Rush Limbaugh creation?

Ron, et al, you have your heads up your asses.

I am so tired of reading moronic political namecalling on these boards. It's even more annoying than all the lame nicknames for Microsoft and Longhorn.

Please, people, can't we act like adults?

And now a short comment on Longhorn.
...
Thank you.

The story just claims that the concern is "internally within Microsoft." Not the same as Microsoft making the claim.

BTW - isn't internally within redundant? Must have read it out of context.

D New Orleans G.

Al Gore DID say that! He was just not in the USA when he said it!

Stillborn well.
>Please, people, can't we act like adults?>
>you have your heads up your asses>

You mean your kind of adolt?

On Location was a very fast archive search engine for the Mac back in the early 90's. Spotlight reminds me of that except that SL does more.

well,

call me lazy...
5 minutes of googling will produce results like.

http://macobserver.com/article/2005/01/27.10.shtml

or to be precize:

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&u;=/netahtml/search-adv.htm&r=2&p=1&f=G&l=50&d=ptxt&S1=apple.ASNM.&OS=an/apple&RS=AN/apple?JkoMt



obi

For the MS/Bush hegemony (former wouldn't exist without the compliance and assistance of the latter), lies are the planks of their platform. So they will invent everything, fight for freedom while trying to kill it, steal while claiming to hate theft, cry for compassion while hurting people, and generally act in a way inconsistent with the truth.

Spotlight is an evolution of an Apple search technology called V-Twin developed in the 90's. You can look at one of the first public mention of it in archive.org pages that date from 1997: http://web.archive.org/web/19970708094220/http://www.atg.apple.com/research/tech/V-Twin/ (Note that there is tons of other cool stuff on these pages, like a 3d Finder)

Guess what was planned for Copland using V-Twin? Smart folders and system wide find by content searches adapted to different file formats (modular descriptions of content format for easy indexing), and also integrated in applications like email... Rings a bell?

Spotlight is almost exactly what Apple planned in 1997 and probably even before. V-Twin was also used in subsequent Mac OS versions but in a very reduced form. They had been distracted by the failure of Copland... It was the dark days of Apple and then they had to transition to OS X, but now OS X is mature enough so that Tiger enables them to at last realize V-Twin's potential.

These Microsoft employees are blatantly spreading FUD since Longhorn is looking more and more like their own Copland...

Microsoft's losing their collective mind. Perhaps MS should spend less time trying and failing to rewrite history and more time actually trying to rewrite Windows to overcome its many failings?

Good call.. i was gonna say, "Losing their mind? Since when is lying odd behaviour?"

But you're right.. lying lying lying..

Hey wait a minute.. iTunes was ripped off from longhorn too..cuz that's where the fast search idea originated..

"Comment: From: Occasional Poster May 16, 05 - 01:49 pm

D New Orleans G.

Al Gore DID say that! He was just not in the USA when he said it!"

No, he really didn't. The "journalist" responsible for starting that rumor was Declan McCullagh, who has somehow since landed himself a position at c|net. I went to school with the guy at CMU, and liked him at one point, but you don't have to look much further than the student newspapers at the time (and the incident blotter) to know why I would take his assertions with a grain of salt.

Al Gore really was a visionary in the area of funding the Internet and promoting its cabailities within the government. The project that started the WWW was partially funded by a program he pushed through Congress. He co-sponsored the bill that moved the Internet from academia to commercial use. All the way back in 1986 he was giving speeches to Congress talking about how people would shop, bank, communicate, and such over the Internet... this was at the time of the '286, Windows 1.0, and 300 baud modems.

It's a pity that the ridicule is diminishing his actual contributions to the Internet, because we probably wouldn't be having this debate in this forum if not for some of his work in the government.

http://www.sethf.com/gore/
http://www.firstmonday.dk/issues/issue5_10/wiggins/

Here's a TinyURL of the link that Obimk1 posted:

http://tinyurl.com/7kccl

No URL needs to break over two lines...

"bolted on hack"

Nice. Can I use that?

I feel so sorry with MS...

^Crap^

I can't do a Fu**ing thing right. Microsoft stole that from me. And I want to be compensated for it. How about you guys release Longhore now. Or later they will still both work the same way.

OT: The US has "evolved" into an "oligarchy"? It is to laugh.

Do you think that Jefferson, Washington, or FDR, were paupers? Have you ever heard of the railroad barons and other wealthy industrialists of the 18th and 19th century who basically ran this country from the shadows? Apparently not.

Furthermore, you totally ignore that the last 6 presidents came from average to humble roots. The Bushes do not represent old money any more than Clinton, Reagan, Carter, Ford, or Nixon. GHWB came up through government ranks as essentially a white collar middle manager. His son, was just an average, middle of the road businessman. His rise to POTUS was not because he was a failed oil-man in Texas but because he was a highly successful governor of Texas.

The last really filthy rich "oligarchy-like" presidents were Johnson and JFK. And not to put too fine a point on it, let's look at some of the losers in presidential races. The guys from the ultra wealthy ranks (Al Gore, Steve Forbes, Ross Perot, etc, etc.) were simply unable to buy themselves the job. Why is that? Obtaining the presidency requires not only wide spread grassroots support but also a certain down-home personal charisma. W, Clinton, and Reagan won the office because of this. The other recent presidents won in spite of not having this charisma but still won without being part of some oligarchical system.

The wealth in our government is and always has been found in the Senate. Those are the positions that you have to buy. Fine, that is the way it has been from day one and thank goodness for the House and the Presidency where one needs widespread popular support to get the job.

-B

People, I have to say something:

I love macs, but Spotlight completely and utterly sucks. I would do everything to get the old search back. Sorry.

Wasn't Spotlight patented in 2001? There wasn't even an workable version of Longhorn back then.

FOR THE LAST TIME, EFF'ING DRUNK NEW ORLEANS GUY...PAY ATTENTION...

"During my service in the United States Congress," boasted Al Gore to CNN's Wolf Blitzer, "I took the initiative in creating the Internet."

You are right to correct those of us who mock Gore when we use the term "invent" along side his name. "Create" is what Al said, not "invent". Had he said "invent" everyone would have (rightly) branded him a liar. But, as Virginia Postrel wrote in Reason magazine,

"Al Gore was not lying to Blitzer. The vice president almost certainly believes that he "took the initiative in creating the Internet." His claim reflects a particular understanding of the world and of recent technological history. As such, it reveals more than mere grandiosity and spin."

The entire article is the definitive summary of the history of his claim (read the whole thing here: http://reason.com/9905/ed.vp.source.shtml)

Be an Al Gore apologist if you will but recognize that there is very little difference between the common understanding of the words "invent" and "create".

cre·ate  (kr-t)
tr.v. cre·at·ed, cre·at·ing, cre·ates

1. To cause to exist; bring into being.
2. To give rise to; produce.

-dictionary.com

Yes, maybe it is unfair to use the term "invent" in a derisive way when we all know he said "creating". However, the problem is not that Gore was just being his normal self-serving, "look at me" arrogant jerk when he made his boast. Many people, myself included, believe he actually thought (thinks?) that without his "initiative" in to fund the university oriented NSFNet in 1987 that the Internet would not exist today. In other words, either he was trying to put one over on the unwashed, Windows using masses, or he was delusional enough to actually think that there was no Internet before he started promoting it at the legislative level.

But that said Drunk Guy, you're right, we Republicans should quote Al correctly. Hopefully you'll let us just use the shorthand: "Al Gore created the Internet" because it is still just as absurd and funny. Two traits we like about Al.

-B

Spotlight is okay, i think MS did a fairly good job on MSN Desktop Search...And since I use MSN Messenger all day...Its nice to be able to search within those IM records as well.

If we could just cut Microsoft's taxes, then they could finish up Longhorn and still have time to go to church.

Praise Jesus.

Here is an article written by an Apple employee regarding WAIS and Rosebud in 1991. The indexer only worked with text files at the time, but I think the basic idea behind Spotlight and other free-form text search engine are decendents of WAIS. I don't know if Apple had minor or major part in the development of WAIS, but I'm sure Microsoft was still too busy copying Apple's GUI at the time.

http://www.dcs.gla.ac.uk/idom/irlist/new/1991/91-viii-34-77/Introduction_to_Wide_Area_Information_Servers_by_Steve_Cisler.html

First, apparently Al Gore fooled the people at the Webby Awards, so they must be stupid. Or is it the folks who can't read the history of the internet who fall into that category?
Second, is being a Bush supporter the same as being thong underwear?

Since Spotlight is arguably OS X Tiger's most questionable feature, it certainly qualifies as the type of feature that might have been lifted from Longhorn, even though it wasn't.

"Yawn" to all of you.

The ARPA Net [Internet] started prior to 1968 at MIT.

What in the dickens has this got to do with MS stealing Apples ideas?
Or am I missing the point tooo . . yawn . . .

Bill Gates: smooth criminal

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/mugshots/gatesmug1.html

Microsoft recently chastised H.G. Wells for promoting Wells’ time machine as an "independently engineered and developed means of 4-dimensional travel.” Microsoft vigorously stated that Wells device is an exact replica of their apparatus for transversing the time-space continuum code named POS. Microsoft fully expects to release the beta-version of POS by late 2007. Microsoft did not divulge further details.

Oswald reports. "Some within have claimed that Apple lifted the idea straight out of early builds of Longhorn..."

BWAAA-HAHAHAHAHAHA! that's funnier'n Hell!!
ROTFLMAO!!!

Al Gore rocks.

Yawn said: "What in the dickens has this got to do with MS stealing Apples ideas? Or am I missing the point tooo?"

I think the point was a not so subtle attempt by Ron to make a connection between the absurd claims of Gates and Co. regarding the creation of Spotlight-like search technology at Microsoft and Al Gore claiming to have created the Internet while in Congress. Both technologies predated their supposed "creator" so the comparison seems apropos.

Gates could have just as easily made Gore's claim: "During my service at Microsoft I took the initiative in creating the search technology behind Spotlight."

Who knows, in a few years when Longhorn comes out with searching capabilities now found in Spotlight, it will likely become wildly popular with the masses. Thus, just as Gore was indeed responsible, at least partly, for popularizing the Internet, Gates will be responsible, at least partly, for popularizing the Spotlight search technology.

So if by "create" both these guys mean "popularize", then both have a point (in an absurd sort of way).


-B

MW: "Neither" as in, neither created anything.

Isn't MS's Longhorn search feature based largely on the WinFS filesystem which MS has said will not ship in Longhorn after all? Since WinFS won't be in Longhorn, it's hard to believe/accept that Longhorn will come close to Spotlight's nearly instantaneous file searching.

No, if Apple lifted the idea from anything, it was BeOS (BeOS had instant file searching in 1997 thanks to its ahead-of-its-time database file system). This is also where MS got the idea (because no one in the industry had a working model of real-time searching before BeOS shipped).

Having successfully run OS/2 Warp for 6 years on my home PC, I've seen a lot of things that Microsoft lifted from competing products and their wild marketing claims that MS invented each one. It's rather funny to see them whining about another company doing it.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: you Americans are one bunch of dumb people.

Ya can't argue with god... he knows his stuff.

gods such a asshowl, he givd us Algore, Gaets and GW, now this spootlite thing. i am so confuzed.

Whoa, America guy; you got me there. I stand corrected.

I waited for Spotlight since 1995, when I received the Apple Demo CD for Mac OS 8 "Copland". I felt in love with dynamic search folders.
Actually, most of the features of Copland are integrated in Tiger, so I am quite happy.

Obviously, Apple doesn't need to look at M$ but at its own ideas in the past.
QuickTime Conferencing->ichat AV
AppleTalk->Bonjour
Copland Search->Spotlight
...

In 8.1 or so, you could alt-click in the search field and select a 'search by content'. It was slow, but worked...

MSN- Hey! They copied us! Of course they came out with it first and their product actually works, but they copied us!! Of course we copied them first by talking about making something like sherlock, but they copied us second!!