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Sad, but true.

I will have to agree, if it were not because I could not play Tribes 2 on PC, I would own a Mac. That said I am still in process getting a PowerBook anyhow. I'm really tired of PC updates and crashes. Mac is starting to get all the popular games now, so that article will soon be null. Tribes 1,2 and the upcoming 3 are all on PC only, so that is the only thing that is salvaging my computer from become scrap metal. I <3 MAC.

Well, I've died, and I'm in hell now for all the lying I did about Macs. They are the best. Even when I was pushing OS/2, I knew Macs were better.

Too take to apologize, but take my advice, don' believe a word I said...ahhh, it's hot! Ow ow ow ow ow!!!

I'm looking to get a new Win POS for no other reason than to play Dark Age of Camelot online with my friends. I'd much rather using my mac (I've played some robust stuff on my PowerBook) but the game titles just aren't being made readily available.

Sigh...

Typical Windows mentality. They need to remember, Productivity=Linux, Creativity=Mac, Games=Windows.

PC gaming is dyeing as majority of games sold are played on the consoles. I read a while back in the US Electronics Boutique may stop selling PC games as they don’t sell a lot compared to consoles.

gamers. heehee.

This may all change when the when xbox and PS3 switch over to the PPC.
It should be easy to port these games over to Mac.

Who are these sad people that really spend that much money on a game machine?!?! You can get a good game machine for lots less that is made for games, and it doesn't crash!!

If you are that addicted to gaming, you need to take your whithering little gray body out in the sunlight and find real life. Gollum!

Jimbo is 100% right. If I played games regularly (and I don't), I'd plunk down $200 for a PS2 to hook up to my TV.

Exactly. I'll take a PS2 anyday over any "gaming" PC, Mac or anything else...

artist: I don't believe that. Xbox PPC won't make a port any easier. It's not the processor that is the big deal, it's the Windows API different from the Mac API.

Any programmers here? Am I right or wrong?

Though consoles are more popular for gaming, games still make a big difference to a family buying a computer. They will choose the one that provides the most bang for buck, and satisfying a child's need for games is a big bang.

The problem with Dvorak's theory is that family computers account for a very small slice of the computer pie. Even if the Win/Mac gaming situation were reversed, Mac's market share would still be small. Most computers are purchased for work (I have no statistics to support that statement, so quote 'em if you got 'em).

Dvorak once said the mouse wouldn't fly, err the mouse was not going to gain popular acceptance. This guy is just trolling for hits again. Anyway, Steve now says get a Playstation, Gamecube or even a Xbox if you want to play games.

?

!

You guys pushing PS2 and other consoles don´t get the PC game world. Our household has PS2, GameBox and PCs.
Our teenagers never touch the game consoles, but spend hour after hour on their PCs playing games over the internet.
It is just an entirely different world.

Oh yeah, we were going to Macs for the boys, but they wanted PCs so they could play the newest games.

If in the customers wants to play games on their computer - they will choose Windows.

For years PC users used to sneer at Macs because, in their words, "they were just toys and were only good for games and pretty pictures". Now, in a complete about face they appear to be saying they won't buy one because Macs don't have all their favorite games -- yet. Come on, guys. That's the stupidest excuse. Make up your minds. If you really want to do serious computing get a serious machine that does EVERYTHING well -- including games. Get a Mac!

I rarely play games on my mac or PC. I play them on video game systems. I hate playing computer games.

Matthew

Thank someone, because this will change soon.
Sony/Nintendo/xBox uses IBM´s RISC chips. Conversion is much easyier today. I still need my SAP and other REAL Business Suites to run on my Mac.
(Not toys like Mickey Mousesoft)

So, finally the truth comes out. Macs != toys. PCs == toys.

Hogwash... Corporate purchases drive PC purchases... It used to be that you purchased a Windoze box because that's what you had at work, and that's all that work purchased.

Apple continues to attract free-thinkers and Windows users - especially with its stability and lower cost of ownership: not to mention the whole virus plague.

If Apple would put a voice recording capability onto their iPods - then corporations would embrace the iPod in lieu of the Sony Digital Recorders (which are pretty much the same price).

People are switching... Windoze is also under attack in many countries, as governments search for stable and secure alternatives.

In two more years, Dvorak will eat his words.

Actually Apple lacks the high end business and low end consumer...
That is SAP and Games...
High end media and middle consumer and the UFO consumer are well covered.

So it doesn't help that Command & Conquer: Generals, Unreal Tournament 2004, Warcraft 3, and a bunch of hot games are out of the Mac?

I hear rumours that 'M$' maybe working on a FlightSimulator version for OSX! Probably the only thing I miss from windows.

True that little gaming is available on OSX

I think it's a bit of a sweeping statement by Dvorak, however there is a lot of mileage in what he's saying. Adolescent children tend to drive the purchase/upgrade of the family computer as they enter the high schooling era. The last thing kids at this age wish to be is 'different'! Conformity and acceptance is the key for early teenagers. This is an incredible pressure placed on the parents who primary motivator is the gaming not the education. It then establishs an OS comfort patern for the rest of their (and their younger siblings) computing lifes.

I think Dvorak's on to something quite important in this case.

Glick7 has it right. Most computer purchases are by employers, and
1) inertia and
2) "compatibility" with the Windows world
are the dominant reasons for eschewing Macs. Then, employees buying a computer at home think they need a Windows computer in order to access their work files.
The current virus plague is making a lot of companies rethink--Apple needs some killer boxes to grab their attention. My hope is that the new G5 servers will open the floodgates, get IT divisions comfortable with Macs, and then lead to future corporate desktop/portable Macs. Once servers get in, Apple just needs some (relatively) cheap, fast G5s (esp. cheaper displays).

Why I choose Mac for games:

1. There are more great, top-end games for Mac than I could ever afford or have time to play. Even some Mac-only and Mac-first ones.

2. My Mac runs them well and without fussing around--the same thing that makes my Mac better than Windows for productivity.

3. I get the benefit of having OS X for everything else too, and don't have to find space in my life for two computers.

4. I can aim with a mouse and download maps and demos--unlike a console.

5. I like portability. Play on TV, throw it in a bag for LAN fun... You can't build your own laptop.

A PC is a fine gaming choice if you are willing to tolerate troubleshooting, patching, and protecting Windows. PCs can also give you maximum frame-rates for a low price--and certain games come only to PC, or come to PC sooner. I consider those last to be more bragging rights than anything vital, but they ARE legitimate factors for a CERTAIN SEGMENT of the gaming public. Also, unlike many technologies which Macs get first, some gaming technologies (surround sound, force feedback) have historically come first to PC. And lastly--the most important in my view, but affecting only a tiny fraction of users--editing tools are often late or absent on Mac. (They may run in VPC. I've built Descent 3 levels in VPC.)

In short... PCs are ONE valid choice for gaming.

Macs are, and will remain, another.

EXACTLY.. I've been saying this for years..

The average parents don't know squat about computers, but their KIDS DO!

And the kids lie to their parents, saying stuff like, oh macs suck, they break down.. no one has one.. no one gets those.. they must be bad...

all the kid wants is to play games...

this, of course, is purely based on market share...


It's STILL alot of money to switch platforms...

once you get to a certain age, gaming gets less compelling, so dvoraks argument means little to anyone who's not got kids

Well, even a blind pig finds an acorn once in a while, and in this case Dvorak is correct.
I play chess, and my kids have Gameboys and various 'boxes'. So we are a 100% Mac household. About 11 active Macs.
But to a LOT of people games are a deal breaker when they consider a Mac.
If a family is going to buy one or two computers for the house, the ability to play the most (latest? best?) games steers the decision to a Pee-Sea.
I'm not a hardware person, is there NO WAY to fix this? I remember emulation boards for certain Macs. So you could run Windows on an 8100.
Giving up the high end because of cost, is it possible to build in or add on the hardware for the family who has two kids under 12?
Dvorak (King of the Troll Whores, who will say anything to get hits, get talked about, or stir up controversy AND WE FALL FOR IT EVERY TIME) is RIGHT.
Because Apples numbers are so low, it wouldn't take much to double the 'Marketshare'. My understanding is that business and government sales take over 50% of the so-called Marketshare. The rest goes to education and 'people' I believe.
Every time I try to 'switch' someone who is on the fence, or is defending their choice to buy a Pee-Sea, my argument goes into the ditch when they mention games. Many probably would have bought a Mac if not for the 'Game factor' for their kids.
Actually, it's kind of ironic when, in the previous sentence, the possible switcher call the Pee-Sea a 'business computer'. And the Mac is seen as cute and more frivolous.
I agree that if Apple could get back the family game market it would not bring them back to 20%, but darn-it, even a 6-8% 'Marketshare' would help change the mindset of developers AND customers.
Those extra points won't be seen as 'Gamer' points. They would just make people perceive Apple as being stronger, bigger, and in for the distance.
Also, some people want to be assured they COULD play the latest games, even if they NEVER do. All the time people make buying decisions on features they NEVER use, just might want to. Or hope they have time to learn and master.
After all these years, and billions of dollars, it's strange that so much hinges on games. I know there are some techno-savvy brainiacs here, can this be fixed? Not a slow software fix, a hardware fix for a special kind of eMac say? That would not push the price 'too high' for the cost conscious consumer?
david vesey

His reasoning only applies to a small percentage of people. Most computers, regardless of platform, never touch a game. The real reason is much more complicated than that. As Glick said, a lot of it is that people buy what they have at work. Since most businesses have been dominated by PCs over the last 20 years, that's what most people buy. Add to that, even if they decide they want to switch down the road, they have too much money invested in Windows software and the thought of having to replace it all is too scary. I know two people like that now, and there's nothing I can really say to refute that. On top of that, I still think there are a lot of misconceptions about the Mac. People remember the Mac circa 1996 and think it hasn't changed much. Apple needs to really market the pros of using OS X instead of showing how cool the box is. I'm glad the box is cool but people don't buy computers for that reason. Dvorak has WAY over simplified it showing, yet again, that he has no clue.

Nagromme: "certain games come only to PC, or come to PC sooner." I know that used to be true, but I thought that had changed with the advent of Xbox. I thought any game made for windows would run (with very little adjustment) on an Xbox because it uses Windows. I figured all games for Windows would be release for Xbox too.

I'm not much of a gamer any more, so I'm just guessing. Is that how it is?

BTW, my talk about Windows/Xbox game development makes me wonder if an Apple-branded game box running OS X would attract more game developers.

Nevermind. Stupid thought. Consoles are too cheap for Apple to fiddle with.

I have an XBOX and a GameCube. Thats all the gaming options I need and care to have.

When you spend 10-12 hours a day working in front of a computer, the last thing you want to do in your free time is spend more hours in front of one.

Even when you have a Dual G5 and dual 20" Cinema Displays! ;o)

I guess the whole PC/Game thing really demonstrates what the average PC user does with their machine. Basically, nothing worth mentioning. ;o)

Yea...I want my kids to sit around and become fat while playing games and not learning how to function in the real world instead of actually learning something useful. I guess I will never have that problem.

I think he is only partly correct. These people who use games as an excuse to buy a PC are also the same people who don't really have a clue why the Mac is far superior. But most people who are real game fanatics have already gone the XBox, PS2, etc. route.

Does playing pc games on VPC degrade the experience? Seems like a good solution if not.

Hi RV, nice to see you get through an entire post without using "moron" or "stupid".

I like the idea of playing games, and buy some from time to time, but never end up using them - instead I end up listening to music, playing the piano, reading the news, cooking, or watching TV. And if I did have time to play a few games, all the major ones make it to the mac. I'm not anti-game but I don't care much about them. Am I the only one like this?

Anyone that drops that much $$$ for a computer to play games is a loser, IMHO. I have game consoles for such things, and the few computer games I do want, I can get.
I'm not even pretending to be a "gamer" I have my Macs for other things...
I just can't believe how much time people piss-away playing games.

SB

vpc will very much degrade the experience. emulating any system will never give you the full experience of the actual system.

Games? Is that it? wow- Is that why Windows users arent switching? Last time I looked it seemd as though many major titles were Mac ready. There are some good titles for kids too.

Well, all I can say is the last game I bought was Jedi Knight II in April last year and still havent finished it. But then I am a self employed designer, recovering Quake Arena addict , have a family and frankly as much as I enjoy gaming, right now its last on the list of things to do. I'd prefer to get out more.

I have friends who are both PC and Mac users and none of them have any major titles apart from the odd game for their kids. Seems to me Mr Dvorak is simply generalising.

All this foofraw about Windows v Mac and games is disgusting. Games are the most worthless things to come out of the personal computer era.
The idea of spending hours and talent to create yet another kill-and-be-killed fantasy is apalling. Read a book. Volunteer for community service projects. Use that energy and talent for something useful.

I play games on my Mac. Starcraft, Diablo II, Warcraft III. I even saw an ad for Call of Duty, which was the only reason why a PC friend said he wouldn't switch. Now he has to re-think his PC only position. If the game isn't out on the Mac, I don't even consider it, plain and simple. And I would never put up with all that PC hassle just for the PC-only games.

dw
and then you woke up.
Sony is the leader for games in the world. Sony out numbers PC/Microsoft in both money and volume. If you really want to play games... You do not choose PC. You choose PlayStation. There is Nintendo, xBox, PC, Nokia, Apple and so on. PlayStation is the winner here. Apple has to do all it can to make it better = more games. PC/Microsoft is not the winner here. Move on. No news here.

dw:
Please, explain to me how reading a book makes you so much smarter than either playing a game or watching a movie. I don't get it. All you are doing is entertaining yourself. What's the difference with any other medium. I'm so tired of the superiority attitude from book readers looking down on other entertainment media. You are just reading words written by someone else and making a little movie about it in your brain! big freaking deal! Why don't you just pick up a playstation and stop wasting your time with that reading nonsense.

Peace

Apple would never get into game consoles. How much money has Microsoft list in XBox? A bunch. Lunch money for Bill Gates, no doubt, but for the rest of us, empires have risen on less money.

Games?

Get a life.

I play Halo, Nanosaur II and Jedi Knight on my DP G5: the performance is crisp and the graphic quality superior. I will continue to buy games for my recreational pleasure and I expect that, as more 64-bit extensions are incorporated into OS X, they will contain features that simply can not be attained by 32-bit architectures.

The argument doesnt hold any real water...

Kids play what you plunk down in front of them, and when they arent playing gamecube, their always playing something on the Mac.

Folks need to stop letting the tail wag the dog.

I suppose reading these posts is not dissimilar.

All these fat kids need to stop gaming so much and go outside and run around. Get the hell out the house! :-D