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Apple’s iTunes Music Store: ‘one billion suckers served?’
Friday, February 24, 2006 - 04:20 PM EDT

"Personally I've never bought an iTune and I don't own an iPod. I think Apple's DRM is awful and represents a major step back for us all. I think those that are investing in iTune digital libraries are suckers. You are basically betting that Apple's proprietary DRM laced format will be the standard for the rest of your life. You are paying too much for your music and tying yourself to only Apple products going forward. More innovative ways to play your music may indeed come in the future but unless they are marketed by Apple you will not likely be able to use these devices with your iTunes files due to Apple's tight proprietary control," Thomas Hawk writes for eHomeUpgrade. "Personally I want nothing to do with it."

MacDailyNews Note: Apple's iTunes lets you burn as many custom CDs as you like without DRM. You can play these music CDs anywhere. iTunes also lets you make MP3 CDs. Audio CDs play in CD players like the one in your car or home stereo. MP3 CDs play on Mac and Windows computers and in MP3-compatible car stereos and CD players. Data DVDs are great for archiving and backup, but they only work in your DVD-equipped Mac or Windows PC. If your optical drive includes a DVD burner, you can use iTunes to archive your entire music library on DVDs for safekeeping, storing the equivalent of up to 150 CDs on each DVD-R disc. More info here.

Hawk struggles onward, "So who owns the music anyway? You or them? They do. You bought nothing. You bought the right to play their song on their product. It might work today. But I'm not about to bet that this will be the format du jour 10 years from now."

MacDailyNews Note: See our note above.

Hawk tries this one, "And if you think Apple will be opening up their proprietary format anytime soon, think again. Apple makes virtually nothing on their iTunes downloads, after paying the labels, marketing costs, bandwidth costs, etc. they make peanuts. They make a *ton* of money on the other hand on selling iPods. This was the genius deal between Steve Jobs and the hacks over at the record labels who are just as big of suckers as you are and basically have done nothing but cannibalize existing more lucrative CD sales. They were short sighted and never thought to try to get a piece of the hardware sale and now they are yammering on about raising iTunes prices on you because they are bitter dogs over the screwing that Jobs gave them."

MacDailyNews Take: Do TV show producers get a cut of every TV sold? Do radio producers get a cut of every radio sold? Do software companies get a cut of every computer sold? So much for the idiotic argument that record labels should get a cut of every iPod sold.

For some reason, Hawk insists on continuing, "And what if you are just dying to get the latest CD from that hot new band. Again, theoretically, would it be possible to go down to Amoeba records, buy it for $14, take it home and rip it, then return it within 7 days to get 75% credit back? What's that like $3.50 for the new CD? And with 12 songs that's like what 29 cents a track? Hmmm... would I rather have a crystal clear high bit rate mp3 track for 29 cents or a sure to be antiquated DRM bloated track from iTunes for 99 cents? Now don't get me wrong. I'm not advocating piracy here, per se. But the way I see it, if Apple is going to go to war with me the consumer to lock up my music and keep it off my innovative new devices of the future, then this doesn't really represent a valid step forward away from piracy at all."

Full article here.

MacDailyNews Take: Hawk's not advocating piracy per se, just ripping off brick and mortar CD stores by stealing their product and driving them out of business even faster. The reason DRM exists is because of people like Hawk. Is it just us or does it seem like the biggest DRM complainers tend to be the biggest thieves? What a ridiculous article penned by someone with a total lack of understanding about iTunes, iPod, Apple's FairPlay DRM, and how each of them works. What makes someone think that, if they've never bought a song from Apple's iTunes Music Store and they don't own an iPod, they're qualified to critique them? Shut up, go buy your CDs, and play them on your CD player (without stealing the music and then returning the CDs). You want a legal online music service without DRM? Stop stealing, keep dreaming, then tell it to the music labels, not Apple.

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Related article:
Apple's vs. Microsoft's music DRM: whose solution supports more users? - August 17, 2005
The de facto standard for legal digital online music files: Apple's protected MPEG-4 Audio (.m4p) - December 15, 2004

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Reader feedback page 1 of 3 pages:  1 2 3 >
Feb 24, 06 - 05:43 pm Comment from: Jack

Yes one dumbo in a billon.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:43 pm Comment from: Tommo_UK

Don't even bother contacting this guy.. he's just looking for hits. Plainly obvious from his sign-off sentence:

"And.... let the Appleheaded fan boys flame comments begin.... 5, 4, 3, 2, 1… now."

Attention seeker. Ignore him and he'll go away.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:45 pm Comment from: DudeMac

between Apple and Microsoft serving their proprietary DRM schemes, I'd rather have Apple dominating the circuit because it was left up to Microsoft, we'd all be shackled to Windows-only forever! Microsoft is the anti-choice faction of the world my friends!!

Feb 24, 06 - 05:47 pm Comment from: Thomas Hawk

Come on people -- send me your jabs and insults! It will help me fuel my message and make my site even more popular! Come on, don't hold back!!

PS -- I'm going out to my mailbox to see if my check from Microsoft has arrived yet. Be back after I take it to the bank.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:48 pm Comment from: Steve Ballmer

What a dork.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:48 pm Comment from: Andy C.

What a dufus.

Moving right along, I wasn't aware the iTunes would allow you to burn an mp3 CD from iTunes purchased music. Can someone please confirm this? If it is true, I'd say that's a hell of a lot easier than burning audio CDs then re-ripping them back to iTunes.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:49 pm Comment from: Ben Dyer

I don't mean any offense, so don't take this the wrong way, but why bothering linking and responding to trolls? This idiot clearly did it to get attention. He has no valid arguments that everyone hasn't debunked a million times already, so why bother wasting your time?

The best way to destroy a troll is to ignore it because then it cuts off the one thing they so desperately crave: attention.

I mean, has anyone heard of this site before now? Nothing but a big attention whore.

Move along. Nothing to see here.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:51 pm Comment from: ppc

YAB: Yet Another Bozo.
Don't feed the trolls.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:51 pm Comment from: Turd Ferguson

Obviously this guy hasn't seen the new ePod case or else he would have just chilled out...

Feb 24, 06 - 05:52 pm Comment from: Flashxl

You know, he says he is not advocating piracy "per se", but it sure sounds like he is.

He belongs in the USSR, circa, 1960. Some kinda of commie he is, share it all, with nothing for the artist.

What a meaningless rant. Offers no solution.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:52 pm Comment from: daveo

well...he has one valid point. what happens if apple isn't the leader anymore and you want to have the newest and coolest device and your itunes songs don't work with them?

i'm sure you can convert them. somebody will develop a conversion program. it probably won't be an issue.

but he's an idiot. still buys CD's and rips to mp3s. i did that in 1998.

itunes is the leader and it rocks. we'll see what happens if that changes and i want to move my songs to something else...

Feb 24, 06 - 05:52 pm Comment from: Andy C.

Ben Dyer,

Here, here! We don't negotiate with terrorists! Um, oops, wrong web site...

LOL! My MDN magic word is "freedom"!

Feb 24, 06 - 05:52 pm Comment from: Ken S

What a f*%#ing idiot !
He must use windoze.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:53 pm Comment from: Ken

Why do you give these whining babies that cry, "I want everyting for free or I'll steal it" any attention? Let them cry in their little corner of cyberspace, ALONE!

We have better things to do!

Feb 24, 06 - 05:55 pm Comment from: Eric

WTF? eHomeUpgrade? What the hell? Never heard of it. Or him. I personally have not purchased much off the iTunes store, but I do buy used CDs and rip them to AAC mainly cause it's smaller, and sounds better (160) than MP3 (192K) to me.

So, does FORD still own the car I bought then? Can I take it back and get it fixed for free then? Or can they repo it whenever they want?

Feb 24, 06 - 05:55 pm Comment from: Beavis

What an ass-clown.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:57 pm Comment from: Judge Bork

daveo,

As MDN explained, you would burn the songs to external media, thereby stripping the DRM.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:57 pm Comment from: linthouse@mac.com

WANKER, JERK, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL HIM !!!!!! Spent enough time on him, move on !!!!

H

Feb 24, 06 - 05:57 pm Comment from: Some of the Billion

Please don't contact this guy - you all know better than to waste keystrokes on him. He'll just use your words in justifying his next rant.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:58 pm Comment from: Tommy V

That really does have to be on of the most ignorant angry rants I have seen in a while.

Even if you don't like your ipod for some reason, why so angry that other people do? It's just weird.

Feb 24, 06 - 05:58 pm Comment from: Andy C.

Daveo,

You can already convert them as MDN stated in the article, plus there is a program called jHymn, that will strip the DRM from iTunes music you legally own.

There are probably others, and there are always the analog solution. WireTap Pro and Audio Hijack are two programs that do digital to analog to digital conversion.

So there's really nothing to be worried about.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:00 pm Comment from: Flashxl

When parity does occur, the store will become the focal point, not the player, and at that point, the music will more likely become more standard, and hopefully more playable on any device.

Then again maybe not, and we will be screwed. But think that the transition to any device will be possible, no matter what it is. Apple or any other manufacturer, would likely make certain of that. It would just be bad business to not allow that to happen.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:02 pm Comment from: Lurker_PC

Hey! Look! John Dvorak has got a new pen name!

Peace.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:03 pm Comment from: r_y_a_n

"Personally I've never bought an iTune and I don't own an iPod."

Wow, that will show 'em tough guy! You go! Before you know it your stand against iTunes and the iPod will run Apple out of business.

This dork is probably a Microsoft Windows Butt Monkey Lemming™, so this "tough guy" stance really holds no substance.

My 2¢

Feb 24, 06 - 06:04 pm Comment from: JadisOne

What a hack.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:05 pm Comment from: Mork not Mindy

Flashxl,

The transition of iTunes Music Store purchases to any device is already possible, as MDN has explained.

Can people read and comprehend anymore?

Feb 24, 06 - 06:06 pm Comment from: NewType

Someone should forward his article, which cynically advocates CD piracy (by way of plausible denial) to the RIAA, Wal-Mart, Best Buy, and Virgin.

Then maybe he'll get a clue as to why DRM exists at all, and it has nothing to do with Apple.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:07 pm Comment from: Georgy Porgy

How can he write anything at all when he admits in the first sentence that he hasn't even tried it. Yet another Doofus PC weenie!!

Feb 24, 06 - 06:11 pm Comment from: Gordon

I wonder how long this turd took to move from cassette tapes to CDs? I suppose he's going to wait for the "next thing" in 20 years time to move on. So he'll be sucking sour grapes for 20 years while the rest of the world enjoys technology. Idiot!

MW: "changes" - very appropriate.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:14 pm Comment from: CandTsmac

I agree with him, but not 4 his reasons. 128 bit files, in my mind, are not worth paying for. When i can buy them lossless, I'm in.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:14 pm Comment from: CandTsmac

but i love my iPod

Feb 24, 06 - 06:15 pm Comment from: MacDude

We are indeed suckers.

Every last one of us.

You se all you have to do is get a cheap PC with a large hard dive and subscribe to Yahoo! Music.

For $5 a month you can download up to a million songs.

Using certain software you can then strip the music of M$ DRM and burn cds.

Once you loaded up your iPod with MP3's, and all your friends, burned DVD-R full of tens of thousands of songs.

You quit the subscribtion service, because now you have so much material you can easily trade cd's for any new music that arrives.

So yes we are suckers, if your a cheap thieving ba$tard

Feb 24, 06 - 06:22 pm Comment from: John

Whatever? tongue wink

Feb 24, 06 - 06:25 pm Comment from: ???

exactly WHERE can you buy a CD and return (opened) for 75% of the price? i've only seen returns on unopened discs.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:31 pm Comment from: macview

If the saying "write what you know" still stands then Thomas Hawk's page should be blank.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:34 pm Comment from: R

Dumb argument-- there are opportunity costs for all choices-- when you get one thing, what is it you can't have?

The real question is whther you're satisfied. Seems like that has been aswered loudly with a resounding YES!


MDN: "opened" as in MacDude opened mouth and inserted hoof.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:36 pm Comment from: Not a sucker

Personally I've never heard of Thomas Hawk and I've never visited eHomeUpgrade. I think Hawk's article is awful and represents a major step back for us all. I think those that are investing in reading articles on eHomeUpgrade are suckers. You are basically betting that reading Hawk's opinions are worth wasting 5 valuable minutes out of the rest of your life. You are paying too much for your time and tying yourself to only Hawk's opinions going forward. More unbiased ways to get your technology news may indeed come in the future but unless they are written by Hawk you will not likely be able to reconcile your opinions with his drivel due to Hawk's tight sphincter control. Personally I want nothing to do with it.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:37 pm Comment from: JoeKnows

I can't believe the replies. OK, so he's picking on iTunes to troll for hits on his website ( BTW, it is working ). Overall his real gripe is with DRM. Although Apple's Fairplay is better than most DRMs, it is still DRM.

What happens when you want to play or stream your fairplay songs to some other non-Apple device? You can't. Unless Apple starts licensing fairplay, you never will.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:40 pm Comment from: MacDude

Brick and Mortar stores won't go out of buisness because most people use cd's and don't want/care/have money/stupid to use a computer.

So there. The poor, technically challenged get RIPPED, like always.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:41 pm Comment from: Mac12EightK

Actually, you can't burn MP3 CD's without DRM using iTunes Music Store music.

Feb 24, 06 - 06:44 pm Comment from: MacDude

A lot of stores don't accept returns on opened media anymore.

Gosh the days of re-shrink wrapping the cd's are long gone.

http://www.officezone.com/shrink1.htm


Or are they? Hahahahha! weeehooo!

Feb 24, 06 - 06:46 pm Comment from: F.U.B.A.R.

We CAN thank him for coining a new term, he has never bought an "iTune" not that he has never bought from the iTunes Music Store.

Has anyone call a track from iTMS an "iTune" before, I've never heard it, but I like it.
smile

Feb 24, 06 - 06:52 pm Comment from: FUDsucker Proxy

JoeKnows...NOT!

"What happens when you want to play or stream your fairplay songs to some other non-Apple device? You can't. Unless Apple starts licensing fairplay, you never will."

Did you read any of the previous post BEFORE you wrote this BS? You can burn from iTunes to a CD and the DRM is removed, then put the MP3's on any damn device you want, moron!

Feb 24, 06 - 07:03 pm Comment from: Gordon

I don't know about the rest of the posters here, but I sure did NOT give him a hit.

MW: "single" - not a single hit!

Feb 24, 06 - 07:07 pm Comment from: Jeff

To understand a man like Hawk all you have to do is remember the line in Top Gun, "he was abused as a child."

Feb 24, 06 - 07:11 pm Comment from: CG5Addict

I'm with Ben,
"I don't mean any offense, so don't take this the wrong way, but why bothering linking and responding to trolls? This idiot clearly did it to get attention. He has no valid arguments that everyone hasn't debunked a million times already, so why bother wasting your time?

The best way to destroy a troll is to ignore it because then it cuts off the one thing they so desperately crave: attention.

I mean, has anyone heard of this site before now? Nothing but a big attention whore.

Move along. Nothing to see here."
x2

Feb 24, 06 - 07:12 pm Comment from: Double J

Last time I checked, I CAN'T buy a CD from a music store, rip it to iTunes and then RETURN it - FOR ANYTHING! Not 75% (as he said), not 50%, NOTHING! Every music store I've been in has signs posted at the counter stating that refunds are given on unopened CD's only. Once its open, you can only exchange it. Besides, where is he finding $14 CD's? The bargain bin at Wal-Mart? The last CD I bought cost me almost $22 after tax.

Feb 24, 06 - 07:21 pm Comment from: Nobody

is really stupid enough to think the DRM is Apple's idea. Try the RIAA.

They think Apple could have said no DRM and the iTunes store would exist? Not. All the other stores have DRM too.

You want it gone? Re-rip to Apple Lossless. Storage is cheap.

Feb 24, 06 - 07:33 pm Comment from: Dandy Boy

It's not Apple's fault there's DRM. It's the music industry who made them do it.

Feb 24, 06 - 07:39 pm Comment from: entanglement

i agree with Tommo_UK.
i didn't click on the link. pls don't

Feb 24, 06 - 07:55 pm Comment from: YankInOz

Do you think he really cares about what he says? Or is he just looking for a reaction? smile

I woudl never have thought of the retrun the CD thingo until he mentioned it... so I guess he is promoting piracy - where are the men in black when you need them?

I do know that I was the real 1,000,000,000th download but it was a day ahead of the guy who won - so it didn't count...

raspberry

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