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Thankfully RDM is back. Got a bit worried without a dose of RDM for over a week!

He's right on the button, even if Microsoft and a large part of the media loathe and fear him.

I don't think we will ever see an Apple frifgtened of of anything coming out of Redmond again.

Spot on! October will be here before you know it!

Vistapocalypse -- LOL!

You guys got that one right!

...and Digg will bury it. What's up with that?

Has anyone started an office pool predicting Ballmer's departure? If so, put me down for February 2009.

I look forward to October as well, but honestly, June is much more of a concern to me!

This sounds like the excuses of an apologist! What he says may well be true, but the whole tenor of the piece sounds like an excuse for Apple's failure to meet it's own deadline. "While I'd like to have Leopard running on my Mac, I'd rather have a frustration free experience with Tiger now and look forward to a solid release of Leopard later in the year..." is all well and good, but we have three products stacked up behind the iPhone's problems.
One of the reasons the Mac is doing better than the MS share of the market is because Apple's dedication to doing things right rather than accepting good enough. This article claims Tiger is good enough - a horrid precedent to set. Yes ... Tiger IS good enough, good enough to trump Vista. Had MS not blown it, would it have been good enough to trump the Vista that was being touted four years ago? Maybe not. Leopard was supposed to be the cat that did that. Now it's been delayed for four months so the iPhone - announced to the world as a working product more than three months ago - can get a boost in its final two months pre-sales? Ten-point-five, iLife and iWork are delayed for four months for this?

It sounds to me like someone dropped the ball in a big way and Daniel Eran is telling us "it's OK, because ..." Except that it isn't. OK, it isn't the disaster it might have been. Still, it might well have been that disaster. We got lucky. MS did its usual "good enough" thing. And it wasn't. When is the next "Vista" due? Sooner, rather than later? And better, rather than just "good enough"? Maybe as good as Longhorn was claimed it would be? We need Leopard and "puddy-tat" before then.

Just my opinion ... nobody asked.

DLMeyer - the Voice of G.L.Horton's Stage Page Pod Cast

In marketing, we recognize Points of Parity and Points of Differentiation. Allowing Tiger some time to stand up on its own against Vista establishes points of parity (and many points of differentiation in the form of Tiger's advantages). Every new feature added in Leopard represents points of differentiation against Vista. I know Apple probably didn't plan it that way, but the Leopard delay is actually a positive development, strategically.

"Vista, all on its own, is weak."
I think Vista is as good as Mac OS
Of course, I mean Mac OS 7.5
And even that's debatable ...

the delay of Leopard shows what a non issue Vista is.

I think it's a great slap to the face of Gates by Jobs.

"We are not scared of Vista."

I agree with the author of the article. If it was an issue Apple would push Leopard out the door on schedule.

@DLMeyer: You need to read the final line of his article to understand more of the why. Find out more next week...

Another story about Leopard's delay? Hasn't this dead horse been beaten enough already?

Using this logic then Apple no longer needs to bring out any new OS.

I think Apple shouldn´t lower its standard of performance, or just get lucky just because MS blew it again.

By standards of performance I mean at least the following:
a) Announce products when they are available
b) No delays on products

This seems to be changing, yes I know Apple does better than MS, but to compare to MS is to use a lower standard of performance.
just my 2 cents...

I agree with the article. Then again, running a PPC machine, I wasn't in a great big hurry to run out and buy 10.5 anyway.

If Apple rushed through its arse to strip features off of an OS and ship a buggy product just to meet an arbitrary deadline, they'd be....Microsoft.

I prefer to think of Apple as that Gallo commercial with Orson Welles: "We will ship no wine before it's time."

Great article. Those guys at Roughly Drafted are some of the best editorialists on the entire web. Very well done articles on their entire site.

Scott Rose
Certified FileMaker Pro Consultant, Los Angeles
http://www.scottworld.com

@Dl

or maybe it's because Vista is so weak Apple thought it was OK to delay it a little further to help promote the iPhone.

On the off chance Vista was a stronger product they may well have released Leopard

Good article.

While I concur that Leopard should not be rushed, it should also not be late - again. I hope that Apple has given itself the real time that it needed to get it down right because another delay will be perceptual challenge for Apple, more from a new or considering-switcher pov, but a challenge none the less.

Not the point. Apple missed its own deadline.

Just my $0.02

Only a website like MDN would quote Roughly Drafted as a credible source. RD is a fanboy's site just like this is. So yeah, it makes sense for MDN to quote it, but doesn't make it any more credible.

What a magnificient website, I am gonna download the whole website for future reference.

I really hope Apple announces a coupon for highly discounted (or free) Leopard with the purchase of any Mac after ADC in June. If they do this, I won't mind the delay as much. If not, there are likely going to be a lot of people waiting to buy, which would be bad during the back to school market.

Eran writes, "While I'd like to have Leopard running on my Mac, I'd rather have a frustration free experience with Tiger now and look forward to a solid release of Leopard later in the year..."

Amen to that brother.

Software development ( I'm guessing ) is a dynamic process with hundreds of branches ( features ) racing towards a self-imposed and arbitrary deadline and anyone who looks on a missed deadline as any kind of failure, is delusional. Whose to say Apple is not reintroducing features stripped out of the original product or is perhaps refining the parity between the OS and all other Apple products?

While I'd like to think that Apple's only real competition is past accomplishments, all of their work will stand or fall on its own merit, however, the marketing forces at play here, are very compelling indeed.

Imagine how much mileage Microsoft and Apple's detractors could get from pointing out Leopard's shortcomings? Why give them the chance?

Refinement is the name of the game and instead of releasing
a point-1 update closely on the heels of 10.5's debut, why not continue to polish the product?

The point that Apple exaggerated when Leopard would be released is TOO obvious and the current hypothesis that 10.5 is still buggier than a Windows beta is TOO simplistic. I think that the true story hasn't been told, but I'm cynical and skeptical therefore suspect some deeper, insidious, and malevolent reason for the lack of Leopard sightings.

For example, I think that the programming grunts are sick and tired of 60-hour weeks, stale burritos from the vending machine, and the constant drone of Steve Job’s maniacal exhortations piped into the cells cubicles urging them to push harder and faster. I think the troops mutinied and Steve Jobs acquiesced. Yeah, Steve Job’s dream of burying Microsoft is a nightmare for the slugs in Cupertino, but united we, the proletariat, shall prevail!

Hey, is it just possible that the people who work at Apple are human, and with so much on its plate, simple missed a deadline set over a year ago?

Occam's razor, anyone?

I'm cool, I can wait...I just want it right. The less Beta testing during the 10.5 ot 10.5.3 the better.

Macaday and others have mistaken my comments to mean "I want Leopard when it was announced, rather than wait until it's ready". Not my point at all. My comment was directed as much at the article as at the situation. When Apple screws up this badly, we need to hold their feet to the fire, not say "It's OK - because ...". It isn't OK. Leopard is already late, soon it will be reduced to "just another announcement". In Chess they call it a "tempo" ... a "time" advantage. Apple had one, and wasted it.
Sure. Leopard is a bit of overkill. Tiger is "good enough". But when has Apple ben about being "good enough"?

Jordan

Only a website like MDN would quote Roughly Drafted as a credible source. RD is a fanboy's site just like this is.

That's probably the dumbest thing I am going to read today.

But since you obviously have no idea about Roughly Drafted, it's not like you are going to defend your "opinion".

Trainwreck

What a magnificient website, I am gonna download the whole website for future reference.

Daniel Eran's Roughly Drafted is the most comprehensive history of everything Apple you will find anywhere on the web. Unlike the pathetic Microsoft fanboy tech "journalists" we regularly slag in here, Daniel references his data, backs up his opinions with facst, and has a savant like grasp on the interconnections between Apple, Microsoft and the history of both.

Look up his painful dissections of the glossed over Microsoft failures (glossed over by almost all tech press) or his history of Apple's near-death experience as an insight to just how well rounded and informative Eran's site can be.

The Secret Failures of Microsoft

Why Apple Failed

If Apple wants to remain credible, Leopard had better not be delayed again and Leopard had better be frikkin' awesome and Lepard better run flawlessly on my PPC. Is that too much to ask?

Oh, and Eran’s incessant monologues are always consistent, “Apple, good. Microsoft, bad. I like Apple, I good.” Even Apple’s stock options blunders and Leopard's delay won’t restrain Eran’s sycophantic obsession with Apple.

What I feared has come to pass, but it is not half bad. The Cupertino slaves have been pushed too far; a rest is in order, and we can wait because Vista is driving Mac market share as much as OS X and hardware is.

Wait for a better Leopard? Why not, it'll deliver more bang for our bucks. Wait for more careful programming from a less stressed workforce? Yes...what's to complain about an OS launch with less bugs and issues? Or developers given more time to tune their offerings.

I don't mind waiting. I'm still on 10.3.9, enjoying a great system, and saving to upgrade to the meanest high-spec pro machine running Leopard, whenever that'll be.

Bring it one! Whenever you're ready.

10.3.9? HEATHEN! He's a witch!

I'm not really surprised by the delay though. There has been a lot of speculation about the "Top Secret Features." The developers haven't even seen them yet, so how can they be thoroughly tested. It makes a lot of sense that the feature complete beta ships in 6 weeks with a few months to work out any bugs in the newly released features. This gives the users 4 months to drool and the hype can build without the fear that early adopters will be the beta testers. Just the hype that will be generated in mid June is going to make all the comparisons a joke with OS X coming out so far ahead.

DLMeier wrote: "...so the iPhone - announced to the world as a working product more than three months ago - can get a boost in its final two months pre-sales..."
The iPhone demo was not feature complete and I don't think it was ever claimed to be. They had plenty to demo, but many of the hands on reports said that some of the icons were just icons and nothing more than that (i.e. not clickable). So, I can see that there is still a lot of issues to be worked out.

I think he's hit the nail on the head. I always wait for about a month after the release of a new OS just to get the bugs out the system and let all the software developers catch up. Whats the rush anyway we know we getting an even better product which will out class windows for years to come.

Time will tell.

Oh, and Eran’s incessant monologues are always consistent, “Apple, good. Microsoft, bad. I like Apple, I good.” Even Apple’s stock options blunders and Leopard's delay won’t restrain Eran’s sycophantic obsession with Apple.

So you have a comprehension problem and or a short memory. That's not Eran's fault.

And the simple fact of the matter is that "Apple Good, Microsoft Bad" sums up almost the entire history of desktop computing for the last 20 years.

Eran’s sycophantic obsession with Apple is not Eran's fault, you say. Hmmm. Well, it is his neurosis, his weakness, his singular reason for living, I guess. Eran's infatuation with Apple has clouded his reason and impaired his judgment. I have higher expectations of Apple and I have no problem holding Apple to the standards of honesty, integrity, and innovation.

As bad as Microsoft is, it is illogical to conclude that Microsoft’s faults make Apple flawless or beyond reproach. Apple stands or falls according to its own virtues and transgressions, and whatever Microsoft does or doesn’t do is immaterial.

Time will tell.

Eran’s sycophantic obsession with Apple is not Eran's fault, you say.

Nice try at misdirection, but I was speaking of your lack of comprehension, not Eran's Apple bias.

Eran's infatuation with Apple has clouded his reason and impaired his judgment.

And like any worthy critic, you can back this claim up with examples? Or will you just admit you've never actually read much of Roughly Drafted and move on?

As bad as Microsoft is, it is illogical to conclude that Microsoft’s faults make Apple flawless or beyond reproach.

Nice Strawman. Burn it elsewhere.

I'm impressed, Shadow. I never imagined that I would read a thread that was complete and utter nonsense. You certainly win the grand prize for absurdity. Eran may permit you to become his special toady-in-training and altar boy at the shrine of Steve Job’s toenail clippings.

I never imagined that I would read a thread that was complete and utter nonsense.

I can't be held responsible for your stunted imagination, nor will I take the blame for your sporadic reading efforts.

You certainly win the grand prize for absurdity.

You would certainly win some respect by demonstrating that you understand that word. It will be a simple matter to point out where I have posted anything absurd, or how any thread in this Fray called the MacDailyNews Forums is any more absurd than another.

Steve Ballmer was the malignant ice-cream truck-driver I use to run after when I was a kid. His boss was a man named Gates who liked to lean far back in his squeaky office chair while folding sweaters in his mind. Gates didn't like kids. One day they both started living in someone elses imagination. They were the most important and influential men on the planet ....executives that ruled the known world ....but in truth Mr. Ballmer still spends a lot of time wiping ice-cream off the front of his shirt and Mr. Gates still enjoys folding sweaters in his mind. We have a long-standing deal. I let them live in my imagination and they get to fuck off all day.

"Hey, is it just possible that the people who work at Apple are human, and with so much on its plate, simple missed a deadline set over a year ago?"

No No! That cannot be true. Are you not comprehending anything people are writing here.

It's a clever plot to outflank Microsoft by delivering a product slower. Delivering brilliant new product faster than your competition can is obsolete, last millennia's business strategy.

"savant like grasp"

He's like an idiot savant without the savant bit.

I think that Apple's emphasis on the developers doing something solid with the iPhone before Leopard's release is a good thing. The experience and the challenges of working on the iPhone's UI can certainly have a positive outcome as Leopard is finalized. Even if the insights and ideas gained from working on the iPhone will delay Leopard additionally, sobeit. We're better off with the result.

EranSucks

"savant like grasp"

He's like an idiot savant without the savant bit.

And again, if any of you guttersnipes you can back up the contention that Daniel Eran is an idiot, or a blinkered fanboy with nothing to say, go ahead and do it. Otherwise, kindly STFU.

Magic Word: "respect" as in some in here have no respect for their betters.

"or a blinkered fanboy with nothing to say, go ahead and do it. "

Just read his site. Res Ipsa Loquitor.

EranSucks

Just read his site.

How else do I know his detractors are hollow cliche spouting blowhards? If Eran's articles are so easily dismissed or lack depth, surely you can provide an example? There are only about 200 or more articles. Report back when you've one some homework.

Otherwise, again, kindly STFU.

"Report back when you've one some homework."

As I said, if it's not completely obvious to you that Eran's an idiot fanboy from reading ANY of his articles, then you're as stupid as he is.

EranSucks

As I said, if it's not completely obvious to you that Eran's an idiot fanboy from reading ANY of his articles, then you're as stupid as he is.

Thanks for admitting you have nothing to back up your worthless opinion. This is point at which you can just go away.