Stocks turn negative after U.S. special counsel Mueller indicts Russians for alleged interference in the 2016 U.S. presidential election

156 Comments

“U.S. stocks erased earlier gains on Friday after news broke that special counsel Robert Mueller indicted 13 Russian nationals in and three Russian entities for allegedly interfering with the 2016 U.S. presidential election,” Fred Imbert reports for CNBC. “The Dow Jones industrial average traded just below breakeven rising as much as 232 points. The S&P 500 also fell below the flatline, after advancing as much as 0.9 percent. The Nasdaq composite slipped 0.2 percent.”

“The major indexes still remained on track to post strong weekly gains. The Dow, S&P 500 and Nasdaq are up more than 4 percent for the week,” Imbert reports. “Stocks closed sharply higher on Thursday after choppy trading. The Dow finished 306 points higher, while the S&P 500 and Nasdaq gained more than 1 percent. They have also rebounded sharply from the correction levels seen last week. On Feb. 8, the major averages closed 10 percent below all-time highs set last month.”

Read more in the full article here.

“The indictment says that a Russian organization called the Internet Research Agency sought to wage ‘information warfare’ against the United States by using fictitious American personas and social media platforms and other Internet-based media,” Mike Calia and Dan Mangan report for CNBC. “While that effort was launched in 2014, by early to mid-2016, the defendants were ‘supporting the presidential campaign of then-candidate Donald J. Trump … and disparaging Hillary Clinton,’ the indictment charges.”

“Under U.S law, foreign nationals generally are barred from federal election efforts,” Calia and Mangan report. “‘By in or around May 2014, the organization’s strategy included interfering with the 2016 U.S. presidential election, with the stated goal of ‘spread[ing] distrust towards the candidates and the political system in general,” the indictment said.”

“Three defendants are charged with conspiracy to commit wire fraud and bank fraud,” Calia and Mangan report. “Five defendants are charged with aggravated identity theft.”

Read more, including the full indictment, here.

“Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein announced Friday the indictment of Russian nationals and entities accused of breaking U.S. laws to interfere with the 2016 presidential election. The defendants conducted information warfare against the U.S., Rosenstein announced Friday. Twelve of the individual defendants worked at various times for Internet Research Agency, based in St. Petersburg, he added,” CBS News reports. “They set up a ‘virtual private network’ in the U.S. – making it appear that the social media accounts they were using were controlled by people in the U.S., Rosenstein said.”

“There’s no allegation that any American was knowingly involved in the conspiracy, Rosenstein said. Nor was there an allegation that the efforts of the defendants affected the outcome of the election,” CBS News reports. “The indictment, he told reporters, is a reminder that ‘people are not always who they appear to be.’ He said the defendants wanted to undermine confidence in our democracy.”

“Rosenstein and FBI Director Christopher Wray briefed President Trump on the indictments Friday, CBS News’ Major Garrett reports, according to two sources familiar with the talks. They told him that that the indictments did not allege cooperation or collusion with Trump campaign,” CBS News reports. “In addition to disparaging Clinton, they denigrated other candidates, “such as Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio,” and they supported Bernie Sanders and then Donald Trump… After the election of Donald Trump, the defendants allegedly planned rallies in support of President Trump. They also planned rallies against Trump titled, ‘Trump is NOT my President.'”

Read more in the full article here.

“Some of the defendants communicated with ‘unwitting individuals associated with the Trump Campaign and with other political activists to seek to coordinate political activities,'” NBC News reports. “‘There is no allegation in this indictment that any American was a knowing participant in this illegal activity,’ Rosenstein said, adding there ‘there is no allegation in the indictment that the charged conduct altered the outcome of the 2016 election.'”

“The indictment, brought by a federal grand jury in the District of Columbia on Friday, charges all of the defendants with conspiracy to defraud the United States, three defendants with conspiracy to commit wire fraud and bank fraud, and five defendants with aggravated identity theft,” NBC News reports. “Rosenstein said his team has not had communication with Russia about the indictments and would go through normal channels for the extradition of those indicted. However, the U.S. government has no extradition treaty with Russia. In the past, Russia has not cooperated with these requests.”

Read more in the full article here.

MacDailyNews Take: The stock market rollercoaster never slows down!

SEE ALSO:
Apple has what it takes to weather market turmoil, says market watcher – February 9, 2018

156 Comments

    2. was part of the conspiracy. This includes Don.
      And, “information warfare” is a new tactic or a surprise from Russia…or China, or the US, for that matter? “Disparaging HC?” Snowflaking spreads its wings to the Justice Dept.

      Besides this, the markets act again like children w/ tantrums, or clever deviants enabling big $$ to realize more gain.

      Reply

      1. The thing I’ll never understand about RINO’s like you is this idea that if Donald Trump worked with the Russians to get elected, you’d all of a sudden be against him.

        Winners do what they need to do to win, he did AND there’s no organization that can touch him. Again, my only fault with Trump is that he denies it like he’s afraid of the consequences. There ARE no consequences when your party is in control. In fact, go ahead and admit it, watch nothing happen, and then do it again in the fall to show the liberals how you REALLY stay in power LOL!

        Reply

        1. If so, I’m about as close to a rino as you are to logic. I assume you (WA) are saying Mueller is just going through the motions, as it’s reasonable to assume he knows as much, or more as you?

        2. Mueller can do whatever the hell he wants. But all he can do is say “Yes it happened, and someone should do something”. That’s IT. It would take congress (not happening) the senate (not happening) or the Supreme Court (not happening) to actually do any kind of “punishment”.

          And if you’re saying that Russians helping Trump win would turn you against Trump, then, yes, that’s makes you a RINO.

        3. Unlike many of the posters here, Wrong Again understands a significant feature of the Common Law in most English-speaking jurisdictions: the “law of parties.”

          Essentially, IF a trial jury finds (1) that a criminal conspiracy existed; (2) that individual A, a party to the conspiracy, foreseeably committed crime X in furtherance of the conspiracy; and (3) that individual B was also a party to the conspiracy, although he did not work with A or even know him, THEN it can convict individual B of crime X. That’s why the getaway driver in a foiled bank robbery can be charged equally with the people inside the building with guns.

          Wrong Again recognizes that the latest round of charges shows that the Special Prosecutor thinks he can prove both (1) and (2): A conspiracy existed that committed enough federal crimes to fill a 37-page indictment. All that leaves is (3): by proving that a particular individual belonged to the conspiracy, he can be convicted as a party to all those crimes.

          Wrong Again thinks that IF the Special Prosecutor can prove that Donald Trump or significant figures in his campaign were parties to the conspiracy THEN the political reality is that nothing further will happen other than a few days worth of bad publicity. The courts won’t prosecute a sitting President, the House won’t impeach him, and voters will have forgotten the whole thing before the 2020 election.

          I don’t know if the Special Prosecutor can tie the threads for proving (3) together. The general public simply doesn’t have enough information available to do more than guess. I am fairly confident, though, that there would be consequences if the Special Prosecutor did so. In that, I differ from Wrong Again.

          So, apparently, does Donald Trump. If the President did not fear the possible consequences, he would not be trying so hard to stop or discredit the investigation.

        4. “If the President did not fear the possible consequences, he would not be trying so hard to stop or discredit the investigation.”

          Putting words in Trump’s mouth and you also KNOW exactly how Trump feels? Hmmm, how is that possible?

          Oh yeah, right, FAKE CONSERVATIVE BLOVIATING OPINION …

        5. If Mr. Trump shares Wrong Again’s conviction that Muller’s investigation cannot harm him, why would he not be anxious that the truth come out? Instead, he is doing everything in his power to shut the inquiry down. Unless you are suggesting that our Commander in Chief is totally irrational, he must have some reason for opposing the investigation. If it is not fear of possible consequences, what could it possibly be?

          I eagerly await your answer. It should be an entertaining bit of fiction.

        6. My post which you almost totally ignored and pitifully tried to deflect by dragging Wrong Again into your reply — doesn’t cut it, coward.

          I’m talking to you and you alone. I called you out for putting words in the President’s mouth, pretending to know exactly what he is thinking without facts to back it up. What part of this do you not understand?

          You can bloviate all you want. But don’t make the mistake that your anti-Trump comments, are FACTS …

        7. I’ve said before that the only thing I fault Trump for is just not owning this. BUT, you can be assured that when Mueller finds the information he needs (which he may already have) Trump’s tune will change from “I didn’t” to “What does it matter, wanna give back that big tax break and those stock market gains and the crackdown on immigrants, etc.”

          Part of this is politics as usual, which, as we have seen, Trump is above. BUT this particular thing plays into the same character trait that makes him automatically wants to say there was no collusion. That, right there, is a LOT more explainable than… well than pretty much anything else out there TRYING to explain it 🙂

          The main reason why my point of view differs from many here is that I don’t have to write three pages OR include any names other than Trump and Russians to lay it out. There’s SO many connections to Russia… so, just assume, Trump worked with the Russians. If that bothers you, then you’ll flip and turn against Trump OR you’ll continue to create theories far less elegant than mine. If that DOESN’T bother you, then you’re like me, just waiting for all of this to play out. Situations that would have destroyed prior Presidents don’t leave a scratch on Trump. This is just one more that won’t.

          Also, if “Trump worked with the Russians” as a sentence just sends you into a rage, then perhaps you were never FOR Trump in the first place. You were in it for what you thought he could do for you or maybe just trolling the liberals. And you know, that’s fine. Just remember this fall to vote (R)… and you and me? We’re good.

        8. Just to repeat what I have said many times before:

          I don’t object to your opinions about Donald Trump, gun control, or anything else. I don’t even care about them. You are entitled to a point of view and I would strongly defend you from any effort to suppress your freedom of speech. As long as you stick to expressing opinions and backing them up with real facts, I will never respond. I would much prefer to discuss the news about Macs and other Apple projects.

          However, I will object—and strongly—when you repeat provably false “alternative facts” or violate the universal rules of logic. My fear is that if I do not refute your untruth, someone else will believe it or repeat it.

          So, “I don’t believe that Donald Trump colluded” won’t get a response because it is opinion. “The indictments prove that Donald Trump did not collude” will, because it is clearly untrue.

          “Gun control is bad” is an opinion. “Guns in private hands save more lives than they take” is an assertion of fact, which can be discussed on the basis of evidence. “The CDC has conducted research that proves guns save more lives than they take” is quite clearly untrue and someone needs to say so when the untruth is repeated.

          In this case, we have something called “The Law of the Excluded Middle.” Any assertion in the form “X is Y” must be either true or false. If “this ball is red” is true, “this ball is not red” must be false, and vice-versa. So, logically, either “Donald Trump wants the whole truth to come out” or “Donald Trump does not want the whole truth to come out.” It does not require “putting words in his mouth” to see that he does not want the investigation to continue until the whole truth comes out. He has put those words in his own mouth.

          That just leaves the question “Why not?” That is the question that you have refused to answer and have once again regarded as some sort of personal insult.

        9. So your take is that if nothing happens Trump is guilty?
          Well, can’t argue with that (il)logic.

          If this were another election cycle in the past, the Russians might have used disinformation and propaganda for Lyndon LaRouche or Jesse Jackson.

          Point is, I think they went with the two outside “crazies” of Sanders and Trump just to fuck with the system, but there is no way they could have asked for a better partner than Hillary unless it was Sanders. Not saying the candidates would have wanted their help, but Russia gains way more in power when dealing with Democrats than Republicans.

          Can you name anything Trump has done to help the Russians in any way compared to what Barry gave them?

          No, you can’t.

          The real news is the damage caused to our system by the DOJ/FBI/CIA leaders. This is treasonous.

        11. No, my take is he IS guilty and no one who matters gives a damn. If this had been admitted months ago, we wouldn’t still be talking about it now. Mark my words, when he’s found guilty real Americans will continue to stand behind him Russian deals and all because the alternative is liberals.

          “Russia gains way more in power when dealing with Democrats than Republicans.”
          Heh, whatever you have to tell yourself, RINO.

          “Can you name anything Trump has done to help the Russians”
          Nope, but I can name ONE big thing they did to help Trump, AND IT WORKED! Why is it no one wants to give the man credit for taking the system in the most ULTIMATE way? You sound like another “Oh I’m for Trump UNLESS they find out he dealt with the Russians” conditional RINO.

        12. You really are full of baseless claims.
          After all the Democrats did under Obama to truly undermine democracy and our Republic, empty words like yours have no bite to their meaning.

          I’m not proud of what is going on right now, and I sure wasn’t a Trump supporter in the beginning (because I am a Conservative, not a RINO), but he has really done more for Conservative causes in one year than we could have possibly imagined.

          Also, I’ve been here at MDN for 11 years so feel free to come back in 3 months, 6 months and a year to remind me how I am wrong.

          Good luck….

        13. I get it, I’m so full of baseless claims that you decided to join the fray with more baseless claims, in the second sentence no less! Bravo!

          So, then it’s true, you don’t like Russians and if you find out that Trump worked with the Russians, you’re going to pull your “I WASN’T A TRUMP SUPPORTER IN THE BEGINNING” card and jump ship. No worries, to each his own. You won’t be jumping ship TOO far, though, because, in case you didn’t know (D) doesn’t support many of your ‘conservative’ views. Can’t convince you you’re wrong. Heck, even Mueller, when he brings out the info, won’t convince YOU. But, just keep voting (R). You don’t have to like the fact that he dealt with Russians to help ensure that nothing’s ever done about it.

        14. Wrong Again, put down the breibart kool aid. There are three RINOs in the White House. The orange one is a showman who has no compass and still doesn’t understand that the billionaire Mercers put him in office by riling up the lower classes. The other two RINOs, Ivanka & Jerod, hobnob with anyone who has money– Democrats, Arabs, Chinese, Russians. Don’t matter as long as they can unload some real estate albatrosses.

          Going online to try to paste everyone as a RINO is only showing how little you understand the lay of the land

          By the way, your orange hero fired the Mercer mole, the RNC mole, and is basically making policy from the Goldman Sachs democrats that own the swamp. Open your eyes.

        16. Kook is too kind a description for trump. the rotating door, zero of swamp drainage, and lack of any executive lead on any issue shows total ineptitude

          High school kids are now holding events and press releases that are telling the president to do his job. They sound more professional and prepared than the potus

    3. Indict the lobbyists all you want, on what charge?

      Remember the Republican backed Citizen’s United, that turn a company into a person? If a company is a person, why don’t their stockholders that voted as individuals get arrested for voting more than once? Huh?

      Reply

  2. Uh oh… looks like hammer is about to come down. After Steve Bannons 20 hours of testimony this weekend and Rick Gates’ plea deal, this could get super ugly really fast. I’ve even noticed Twitter is actually blocking bots now, c’mon Bobby three sticks a nation turns its lonely eyes to you. Go get ‘em.
    NOTE:
    I will not respond to botvinnik, or any other nonsense today. You can spin your ever living head off, but we know the hammer is coming down. I’ll just say, and with all due respect: Kindly go screw yourselves.

    Reply

      1. Key phrase “this indictment”… you need to learn legalese a little better. There are still over two dozen sealed with the grand jury, that phraseology by the deputy AG does not preclude there not being anything in those future indictments. If you understand the law (TxUser should be back me up here), this is a shot across the bow to let a specific audience know how deep the data goes. This is my no means any indication that higher ups weren’t involved, in fact it’s the exact opposite. Study case law regarding RICO and the mob roll ups in the 90’s and you’ll see very clearly what Mueller is doing here. This is a wide ranging RICO case in spirit and methodology, with different targets. I’d peg the indictment count somewhere north of 70 when we’re all done here.

        Reply

        1. Emperor,

          While I agree with your take on “speaking indictments,” it doesn’t require a law degree to realize that “There is no allegation in this indictment to assert X” is not remotely the same in either English grammar or universal logic as “X is not true.” The former statement has the same probative force—none—as “There is no allegation in Moby Dick to assert X.”

          All we can say with certainty is that (1) neither Herman Melville nor the Special Prosecutor have chosen to make any written allegations directly against the Trump Campaign as of this time; and (2) neither has chosen to exonerate it.

          That does not imply one way or the other whether the Special Prosecutor might now (or might in the future) possess inculpatory or exculpitory information against Mr. Trump or his campaign. To make a judgment one way or the other about Mr. Mueller’s intentions is simply not possible with the information available to the public.

          What the indictment does show is that a federal grand jury has determined that there is enough credible evidence of Russian interference in our elections to support a criminal prosecution of thirteen people and two organizations. It was also announced that a fourteenth individual has already pled guilty to crimes related to the Russian project.

          So, alleging that there is NO evidence of Russian interference is clearly incorrect. Whether or not there is enough evidence to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, there is clearly SOME evidence. That was also the unanimous judgment of all the Trump appointees running our intelligence agencies. How wide the conspiracy against our constitutional Republic might have been is yet to be determined.

          Suggesting otherwise smacks of desperation by those who want this investigation over before it has reached the truth.

        2. Thank you for the clarification, and yes that’s what I think as well. I was attempting to tamp down the nonsense from the previous poster. You’re explanations are always so well done.

      3. Oh and to follow up, this is what is referred to in criminal law as a “speaking indictment”. What that means is that it is an instructive document that sets up the rest of the case. Again, this is just the beginning.

        Reply

      4. Well Pete, the investigation continues and it’s quite obvious that the revolving door at Mar-A-Lago has seen many unscrupulous characters wander through it.

        Richard Nixon wasn’t a crook until proven guilty either.

        Reply

        6. How many innocent people — journalists, political opponents, business rivals, etc — have Putin and his oligarchs bullied, stalked, intimidated, and MURDERED by now ? Have you had your head in the sand over the past decade or two ? Oh, your man Trump likes the Russians …so it is okay for you to ignore reality.

    2. And by having a “Trump is NOT my president” bumper sticker on your car and endlessly repeating that phrase to everyone, you do realize that it is indeed YOU who is colluding with the Russians (since they are the ones who created the phrase).

      You should indict yourself for collusion.

      Reply

      1. Got it, the same thing has happened to me here more than once. I agree with you, and ever since I saw the initial line up of candy dates I went with the chump, no one could put a better show than him and your nation just loves the show, with little or no regards to substance.

        Case in point, there is a post about Tim Cook offering sympathies for the victims of the latest massacres at one of your high schools. I stayed on focus and added my sympathies to the rest. Now if you are so inclined you may want to have a look at how many others added their sympathies for the 17 victims at that high school. I don’t see any myself and with over 150 posts there it’s a tell tale sign.

        Have a good weekend.

        Reply

  5. Silly Dem/Lib/Prog’s fantasies come crashing on the shoals of reality!

    • “There’s no allegation that any American was knowingly involved in the conspiracy.”

    • “Nor was there an allegation that the efforts of the defendants affected the outcome of the election.”

    • “There is no allegation in the indictment that the charged conduct altered the outcome of the 2016 election.”

    #MAGA #TrumpPence2020

    Reply

    1. Pffft…this show has only just begun and perhaps your “fantasy” is about to founder on the shoals of a reality beyond your ability to discern truth from deranged fanboy.

      Reply

      1. One more time since you obviously missed these three points:

        • “There’s no allegation that any American was knowingly involved in the conspiracy.”

        • “Nor was there an allegation that the efforts of the defendants affected the outcome of the election.”

        • “There is no allegation in the indictment that the charged conduct altered the outcome of the 2016 election.”

        #MAGA #TrumpPence2020

        Reply

        3. You know all Mueller can do is say “Bad things happened, Congress do your job” right? Let’s imagine it’s the day after the truth comes out.

          Ryan: I don’t think any further action is warranted.
          McConnell: Last I checked, he has (R) after his name sooo… nah.
          Chief Roberts: If Congress is good, I’m good.

          And this all becomes one for the history books 🙂

        6. No indicted Russian will ever be tried in a court of the US. No evidence will be offered. No debate among lawyers will occur. No press coverage of a trial will ensue. No truth will be revealed.

        10. First 2014,
          You go right on thinking that that’s all there is.
          If cadet bone spur thinks that too, perhaps he won’t try another Saturday night massacre.

    2. You seem to think this 37 page indictment is the conclusion of the investigation. it is not. Some people were named while other not. You also seem to think these 13 Russians nationals just independently decided to raise millions of dollars and create a very organized campaign to ensure Hillary lost votes. They did not.

      Reply

      1. Between the conventions and the election, all of their activities were aimed at either supporting Trump, except in one case where they supported Jill Stein, or opposing Hillary. After the election, however, they began conducting attacks on both Trump and Hillary, including arranging competing rallies on the same day in two different cities:

        If nothing else, this makes the purpose of the operation clear — to stoke mistrust in the election and to damage the winner. Had Trump been considered a favorite to win, the Russian operation may have targeted him more before the election, but they clearly didn’t hesitate to attack him after his win. — Ed Morrissey, February 16, 2018

        Reply

        1. …”let me add one more observation. This indictment shows that the issue of Russian interference into US elections was not and is not a “nothingburger.” The Russians apparently threw a ton of resources into this, and it didn’t just result in propaganda, but also wire fraud, bank fraud, and identity theft, among other things. It also doesn’t prove that “collusion” is a nothingburger, but it doesn’t give any indication that there’s anything to it either.”
          — Ed Morrissey, February 16, 2018

        3. I think it is you who have concluded it, not Mueller.

          Mueller is nowhere near done at this point. He is far from done concluding. All we have so far is that Russian interference apparently wasn’t a hoax, fake news, it was real.

        5. The estimated annual budgets for these Russian organizations is several times that of Breibart. I realize the Breibart fanatics here think they are the reason Trump won the election, but it is obvious much bigger forces were at work.

          If you value the constitution, justice, and rule of law, you wouldn’t jump to the defense of any politician. You would encourage thorough investigation and air out all actions. Legality will be determined through the judicial process, as it should be.

          It does bear discussion– Trump has a clear history of ignoring details, engaging scumbags in deals, and cutting corners legal and otherwise to enrich himself or score egotistical wins. He doesn’t even know the law, he lets his lawyers deal with the unending string of lawsuits that he has incurred for decades. If all his team ( or unscrupulous Kushner, specifically) did was legal, Trump wouldn’t have been in such a rush to get rid of Comey without even having a replacement planned. Only after that did Trump learn that the president cannot fire a special prosecutor.

          You cannot be a patriot and also put party politics above justice.

        6. This indictment of 13 Russian nationals shows the Russian interference with the US election is not fake news. These Russians conducted an attack or two on Trump as a cover. If you look to the social media of the time period Trump news consisted of covering Trump’s own words. While Hillary news was that she was about o get arrested.

          Even today social media especially youtube is filled with stories of Trump being chosen by God and shows Hillary being arrested. It was actually when she almost fainted and had to help to the van.

          “You seem to think this 37 page indictment is the conclusion of the investigation. it is not. Some people were named while other not. You also seem to think these 13 Russians nationals just independently decided to raise millions of dollars and create a very organized campaign to ensure Hillary lost votes. They did not.”

        7. It’s still #FakeNews. We’ve been hearing about Russian collusion 24/7 for over a year. There was no collusion.
          They found that there were some Russian trolls on facebook. These guy didn’t interfere with anything.

        8. You sound very much like that Baghdad Bob (the minister of information of Iraq), who kept saying the Iraqi army was destroying US marines, until the moment they got into Baghdad and captured him…

          These indictments tend to prove that indeed, there was Russian interference with your US election. Massive money was invested in the operation (trolls on Facebook, right…!).

          It isn’t a leap of logic, and further indictments will show, how deep the connection was with the Trump campaign.

          Let’s watch.

        9. i am thinking that trump supporters are getting a little too happy a little too soon, on evidence that, for the moment is a little too thin.

          you are most likely correct that this indictment is not the end of the investigation, it is simply a mile post.

          while this indictment indicates that the participation of some “lLOCAL trump campaign officials or supporters” was unwitting, it says nothing about those in upper echelon campaign leadership positions – that is still an open story.

          the investigation has been ongoing for a year or so, so if there was insufficient evidence to charge the higher ups i suspect they would have been able to say so by now.

          methinks there are many more of the millipedes’ shoes to drop.

          the basic question one must ask themselves is – if mr. trump is innocent why is he acting so guilty?

          why continue to deny any hint of russian interference, when even his appointed heads of all of our security organs say that yes the russians most certainly intervened ?

          why did he not say, “this must be investigated thoroughly until we get to the bottom of this question !” rather than look to impede the investigation and try to delegitimize it in the eyes of the public?

          small wonder mueller keeps digging, when the president acts in ways a person with nothing to hide would not normally act.

          simply put, mr. trump continues to brings suspicion upon himself through his own words and actions.

        11. hi botty,

          sorry i couldn’t reply directly but your response lacked a reply button, so i had to do a work around and reply to myself.

          likely he no see no moose or squirrel,

          but i strongly suspect he has boris, natasha and fearless leader vlad in his sights.

        12. It is plain as the nose on your face that Trump is being blackmailed by the Russians. To paraphrase the president, you know that, I know that, everybody knows that.

      2. No one has said that the 13 Russians raised the money to fund themselves. This undoubtedly came directly from the Russian government.

        As for the Russians working against Hillary: the DNC (led at the time by Debbie Wasserman Schultz) absolutely, positively worked against Bernie by secretly choosing Hillary BEFORE the primaries had even started. Why is it that I don’t hear you complaining vehemently about that?

        Reply

        1. Yes, Hillary colluded with a Rissian intermediary to get dirt on Sanders all the while promoting Trump because, she wrongly thought, Trump would lose her. Polls showed the apposite. She gave the US the present state of Trump.

          The delisious irony and duplicity is that she, herself, colluded with Russia but then blamed Russia for influencing the election. That’s how scheeming, conniving, and vindictive Hillary and her Pink Pussy Hats gang are.

    3. I would not read too much into “allegations not being made” at this time. It is early days.

      Did anyone make any allegations that the investigation is over ?

      Reply

    4. Oh boy, you can cut and paste lies from Twitter, goody for you, partisan asswipe. You, Goeb, and Botvinnik have all the signature signs of a Russian Troll.

      If you haven’t yet been named in the 37 page indictment directly, we hope you disappear from MDN soon as the Mueller investigation continues closing the noose around your crooked neck.

      Despite the BS tweeting from Trump, this latest round of indictments does not exonerate any Trump officials in any way.

      The indictment directly names Russian national defendants and ORGANIZATIONS hellbent on destroying America’s democratic systems: “Some Defendants, posing as U.S. persons and without revealing their Russian association, communicated with unwitting individuals associated with the Trump Campaign and with other political activists to seek to coordinate political activities.”

      These criminals steal information and commit fraud of all kinds to fund their continued misinformation campaigns. These networks lied about democrat candidates, they also spread falsehoods about republican and 3rd party candidates. This week’s indictment shows that the Russian organization overtly and repeatedly spread pro-Trump propaganda while simultaneously spreading conspiracy about the validity of U.S elections (ideas which Trump himself re-tweets to this day).

      As you know, two former Trump staffers have already been indicted for their connections to Russian organizations and their cover-up. Additional links are being investigated.

      Russians unlawfully used stolen social security numbers and birth dates of Americans to open accounts on the PayPal digital payment platform and to post on social media using those fake identities. Trump and his supporters claim none of this matters, even as they blindly copy and paste partisan propaganda originating in Russia.

      It is beyond shameful how any American could claim that there is nothing to see here. Stop repeating the Trump lies. The charlatan will say anything to deflect attention.

      The investigation continues. This isn’t even close to the end of the beginning.

      MAGA: finish the investigation and hang all the criminals, including those with Trump ties or Trump himself if he was directly involved. Democratic republics cannot exist if election fraud of any kind is allowed.

      Reply

  7. #MAGA #TrumpPence2020

    Reply

      2. It was #FakeNews.
        No collusion was found after a year of #FakeNews media screaming “Russian collusion! Russian collusion! Russian collusion!”

        The only Americans colluding with the Russians was Hillary and the DNC.

        Reply

        2. No allegation of collusion was made in the indictment. But this is not to say there was no collusion, or even that no collusion was found. For example, no one has officially said: “After extensive study, we have confirmed there was absolutely no collusion between Trump’s campaign and those Russians who were trying to get him elected over Hillary Clinton”.

          Meanwhile, we do now know with complete certainty that there was extensive, organized, fraudulent, Russian interference in the election. This, despite Trump’s constant assertions that there was none …and that Mr Putin seems like a very nice man. Forget the dozens (or more) of innocent journalists, rivals, or potential political competitors Putin and his merry band of Russian oligarchs has murdered over the years.

    2. The Russians setup their network in 2014 and Trump announced his US presidency bid in June 2015. The Russian indictment is proof the Russians did not end their campaign after Trump announced his radiancy, they only intensified it.

      Reply

    3. Your powers of logic are shockingly bad, First Whatever.

      By your line of thinking, $130k payoffis in hush money to silicone playboy models is evidence of marriage fidelity and christian values.

      #Trump4Prison

      Reply

      1. Perhaps the most disappointing feature of the past couple of years for me has been how many leaders in the Judeo-Christian community are willing to excuse someone who has shown complete disrespect for both the First Amendment and the Seventh Commandment. Are support for Israel and opposition to abortion really so important that they excuse absolutely anything else? He can’t even get the trains to run on time.

        Reply

        1. Despite good intentions of the meek followers, it’s quite obvious that many judeo-christian churches have become corrupt. They use their faith as an excuse for their self serving actions. Anyone who calls himself a christian while politically supporting candidates that have proudly broken almost all of the 10 commandments is no friend of mine.

        3. Mussolini did get the trains to run on time, but fell short in other areas of importance to the citizenry, and was consequently mutilated by them. Too many American church leaders are equally vociferous, self-serving, and cowardly as fascist leaders like Mussolini. The things they tell their captive congregations!— Mainstream news doesn’t report them, but just read their newsletters. They are little politicians in their own right, seeking to undermine the separation of church and state whilst cowering under the protection of the Constitution and benefiting from tax-exempt status. Do I have that right?

        5. Beautiful Mussolini reference, if subtle.
          Since when after Vietnam, but especially after Reagan, has a so called conservative believed in any Amendment other than the 2nd?

          I’ve said this before… I would take Goldwater’s grandfather over this clown…, and I’m an avowed liberal (in the true sense of the word, not the conservative redefinition)

        1. You give the cut-and-paste troll too much credit. Have you heard an intelligent original thought from him? Like goeb and botvinnik, he’s another troll with zero reason to be on a tech blog. He comes here only to paste ultra right wing propaganga. This is as likely to be from the Putin team as anywhere.

    1. After he was Director of the FBI and before he became Special Counsel, Robert Mueller was a partner at Wilmer Cutler Pickering Hale and Dorr LLP, which is a prominent Wall Street law firm with roots back to 1918.

      What is your evidence that he hates his former employer and clients, or the American economy?

      What is your evidence that a federal grand jury issued a passel of indictments without hearing evidence?

      What is your evidence that Mueller, a lifelong Republican, would heed any prompting from an utterly powerless defeated presidential candidate?

      Reply

      1. While FBI director under Commodore Mom Pants, St. Mueller The Marionette personally hand-delivered uranium samples to Russian intel on a Moscow tarmac.

        sure doesn’t sound like much of a “Republican” to me.

        Reply

      2. The facts on this are very well known: Western intelligence services ran a sting operation in early 2006 that resulted in the seizure of a quantity of highly enriched uranium in the Republic of Georgia. They attempted to get the cooperation of the Government of Russia in investigating whether the uranium had been stolen from a Soviet-era stockpile in Russia (as everyone thought likely). Russia said that they could not help unless they were provided with a sample of the seized uranium for an isotope analysis and comparison with the lots in storage.

        After considerable to-ing and fro-ing, both sides agreed to the delivery of a 10-gram sample (about 1/2500 of the amount needed to build a bomb). The Russians insisted that the Americans could not possess fissionable material on Russian soil, but needed to hand over the sample immediately on arrival at the airport. The Americans insisted that they would only hand it directly to the chief of one of the Russian security services. The Russians agreed, but only if the handoff was from one of our chiefs to one of theirs. Hence Mueller’s trip to Moscow.

        It took me all of about 15 seconds on the Internet to discover references for all that. It might have taken me longer if I were a conspiracy theorist.

        Reply

      1. “Rick Gates, will plead guilty on Friday to conspiracy against the United States and lying to investigators, according to court documents, in a sign he will likely cooperate with a federal probe into Russia’s role in the election.”

        “He will likely” say what? The Russians have been interfering in U.S. elections for decades. And what you and your ilk will never admit to, so has the Americans.

        As long as not one vote was changed in the ballot box — BIG NOTHING BURGER …

        Reply

  9. Muller, the FBI, the CIA, and the NSA belong to that Black Hat part of the Deep State that is desperate to not lose support for their profit making wars, so Muller is jingoing up a renewed Cold War, as Hillary prompted him to. All of those Hillary supporters are vindictively jingoing up a renewed Cold War because she and they are still bitter that she lost the presidency to Trump. It was a big and embrrasing loss considering that Trump slapped her in the face when she learned that he did not even want to win from the get go.

    And make no mistake, this “Russi, Russia, Russia; Collusion and influenced elections” blather is all fake.

    Reply

    1. Whatever helps you sleep at night, RINO. You would turn your back on Trump for something as inconsequential as working with Russians to secure the election for the RIGHT team.

      You’re still living in the old world where the Russians are the bogeyman, not where they’re working WITH us to stay in power. Don’t believe everything old people tell you about the Russians. Once Mueller’s song and dance is done and Trump is found guilty but NOTHING happens to him AND we win the midterm races, you may eventually come to see the light.

      Or maybe you’ll be so stuck in Russians=Bad that you’ll be claiming Russians helped the democrats to uhhh LOSE because the liberals WANTED TO LOSE IN 2018!! Part of their master plan of, ummmm….

      Reply

  11. Whole lotta faithless RINO’s out today. Would TURN THEIR BACK on our President just because he had the skill to do what was needed when it needed to be done. Think of what we have accomplished.

    Now, imagine that he didn’t have the guile to work with Russians and Hilary had got elected. That could have been the world we live in. Think, would you rather be dealing with, TRUMP and the RUSSIANS or HILARY?

    If you don’t know the answer, you’re a liberal or a RINO, there’s no in between.

    Reply

    1. Wrong again is … wrong again.

      In such a complex world, how do so many people get sucked into shallow binary thinking?

      Trump, a former democrat with a very spotty conservative record at best, reverses 140 years of Republican values one by one. But you have chosen to bind yourself to this buffoon and feel the desire to throw out the mainstream conservatives out of the GOP?

      While many of the old guard GOP are just holding their noses and going about their business under the trump smokescreen, shallow thinking voters like you apparently think the Trump smoke and mirrors are solid foundations on which to build a political base. It is not. Trumpists driving the GOP to become the rabid delusional nationalist party will swerve too far right to win another election.

      You have lost your moorings, mister RINO label maker. The more you insult principled conservatives, the less likely we will vote for extremist Trumpian candidates with zero experience. The lies and ineptitude is too much to ignore. If everyone you meet is politically left of you, then obviously you have allowed yourself to be herded by fear and hate propaganda off the deep end.

      Reply

      1. I see, so you, TOO, would TURN YOUR BACK on our President once it is proven that he had the skill to do what was needed when it needed to be done, work with the Russians to secure the election.

        I see what you did there. “the less likely we will vote for extremist Trumpian candidates”
        Be as LESS LIKELY as you want, you and I both know that’s an utterly empty threat. As long as there’s an (R) on their name, you’ll vote for them. Thanks for your 2018 and 2020 vote!

        Reply

        1. Do you hear yourself? COMMIT TREASON to WIN the election?
          That’s why Muller!!!!!

          Funny how the domestic and foreign emoluments clauses to the US Constitution don’t mean anything to you.

          New Rule….
          The entire Constitution shall be titled “Second Amendment” so these idiots can support it!

        2. Mueller’s only power is to find the truth, and that is that Trump worked with the Russians. He must then hand that over to congress… they will do nothing. Raise it to the Supreme Court if you want, they also will do nothing. You can THINK that Mueller’s words will change something, but they won’t. Treason is what congress says it is, and we both know they will say this isn’t it.

          “don’t mean anything to you”
          Doesn’t have to mean anything to me, just has to mean something to those in power that are in a position to do something about it. Doesn’t seem like they care about it very much 😉

        3. Interesting theory. Let’s assume Mueller finds more Americans that broke the law. You say that because the Republicans currently have a majority in Congress, they will do nothing? You think the American people will sit back and allow miscarriage of justice? That might be the surest way to brand the Republican party as corrupt for decades to come.

          The more the Trumpists here claim “nothing to see here”, the more it looks like they have something to hide. I predict some big fireworks coming this summer. Bannon, having no reason anymore to keep protecting the Kushners and Trumps, just gave Mueller a list of suspects a mile long, it will be interesting to see how far this goes. Or BigEgo Bannon may have implicated himself for all we know.

          ~20 years ago the republicans were in full support of the nothing burger Starr investigation which unequivocally proved that Jenny Craig deals are possible for interns who willing blow unscrupulous womanizers. Now some of these same republicans don’t want to know what political influence connections exist to foreign powers, they can’t bear to allow light to be shed on their party politics. The dramatic difference in importance to the health of the Republic is somehow lost on the partisan trolls.

        4. So if you think that someone colluding with a foreign power to win an election is only treason if they get caught, and it’s not worth exploring, then let’s just close the whole thing down.

          I understand the practicalities you bring up, which is what I really you’re saying, but win at all costs, even if it involves treason is clearly contemptible.

        5. I’m not saying, “nothing to see” 🙂 I’m saying, “There’s something to see and the people in power don’t care!” Neither do I, but I don’t have the power to have a say in it!

          Treason is considered “High crimes and misdemeanors”. That is all the detail you get. AND, guess who’s job it is, in the Constitution, to define what the heck a “high crime and misdemeanor” is? I’ll let you Google that 🙂 And, yes, it may be contemptible, BUT… is it a “high crime” or “misdemeanor”? LOL

      2. There is absolutely no difference between the globalist policies of The Clot, Commodore Mom Pants, Dubya, Horndog Billy and CIA George…

        “A new world order is fading from view…”

        Reply

        1. Why stop there? Let’s also include every president since Truman of both parties.

          Ever since the USA became a manufacturing superpower over a century ago, and most especially in the post WW2 era, the USA has always stood for free trade and international cooperation.

          Teddy Roosevelt didn’t dig the Panama Canal for the fun of it.

          Marshall didn’t feed and clothe Germans and easern Europeans for the entertainment.

          The UN is hosted by the USA because until this administration, the USA welcomed diplomacy as a way to resolve world problems peacefully.

          While Trump was fed a steady stream of ultranationalist/ isolationist theory from Bannon and the Mercers, Trump is as globalist as any prior president. He owns property and golfs in Scotland. He has outlandish parties of unknown outcome in Moscow. He loves bowing to Saudi princes as long as there is a hotel deal potential.

          Why do you think the USA could ever be stronger standing alone in the world? Everyone else knows that trade and diplomacy pay enormous dividends. At some level, even Trump knows this. That’s why he leads a life completely opposite of the America First ideal he sells to the working class.

          If America is first, then why has Trump chosen to commit US troops to Nigeria and Middle East missions? Why did he travel to Saudi Arabia, Davos, and China without anything to show for it? If America is the focus, why is chief strategist Kushner focused on Israel ahead of US interests?

          Isolationist rhetoric is belied by the globalist actions.

      3. “shallow binary thinking?”
        Let’s look at complex reality, I’m sure we’ve had an even distribution of Presidents from all over the political spectrum. What’s that you say? The vast majority of the time it’s (D) and (R)? Woah, reality is complex though, it can’t be shallow and binary!!!

        Hmm, maybe because people power the process and because THEY are shallow and binary, it leads to shallow and binary results!!! Nah, think I’ll stick with my complex reality theory. I mean, it mirrors reality so well except when it absolutely doesn’t.

        Reply

    2. One dimensional thinking points out that you’re Wrong Again Wrong Again!

      How about thinking outside your DOT and considering a USA without any The Trump, any Russian Pooty Poot interference or any Princess Hillary? That’s a start on improving the situation.

      As for ‘RINO’s, it’s become a meaningless term as I’d NEVER call the ‘RINO!’ shouting destruction agents of the ‘Republican’ party any kind of real Republican. It’s all about PROPAGANDA. Wake up.

      My usual, ongoing clue regarding what’s going on with the ‘Republicans’:

      Starve the beast

      It’s psychopathy politics. Hate they neighbor, etc.

      Reply

      1. “How about…considering a USA without any The Trump”
        You can “consider” all you want. Though some would call that dementia. Unless you’re talking about impeachment which, in that case, not going to happen.

        But sure, if “considering” a fantasy world with your pure and virtuous never-cheats-on-his-wife-hates-the-Russians President helps you sleep at night, by all means have at it. Just make sure that in the real world you vote (R). Well, doesn’t matter what you vote, really, we’ll tweak it on the back end 🙂

        Reply

  12. Once again, the election of 2016 was never about republican vs democrat or conservatives vs liberals…it was, and is, the struggle between American sovereignty and global governance.

    Reply

    2. Oh absolutely, because members of both parties supported both points of view evenly! There were just as many liberal democratic American sovereign-ites elected into office as conservative republican American sovereign-ites. And that’s what makes it SOO clear!

      I swear, some conservatives are sounding more and more like gobbledygook liberals every day. But, doesn’t matter, as long as you’re checking the tick mark by (R) I don’t give a darn what story you have to feed yourself.

      Reply

      1. Nationalism IS sovereignty*…the sheep pen is to your left.

        America First.

        *sovereignty |ˈsäv(ə)rən(t)ē|
        noun (pl. sovereignties)

        • the authority of a state to govern itself or another state: national sovereignty.

        Reply

        6. One of the many dictionary definitions of nationalism is :

          excessive patriotism; chauvinism

          look up chauvinism and you will find poster boy botvink in full assholitude.

  14. Most of the discussion on these two pages is stupid, because this case has NOTHING to do with collusion.

    Fact 1: Russians carried out a massive, multi-faceted cyber attack to interfere with the election. (How successful they were or were not is irrelevant to the FACT of this being done.)

    Fact 2: This government is doing NOTHING to protect the integrity of future elections.

    Collusion is a separate matter, which will come further down the road.

    Reply

      1. Mueller, like Comey, is just another dirty cop. The most blatant instance of this is when, as Obama’s FBI director, he personally hand-delivered uranium samples to Russian intel on a Moscow tarmac in 2009.

        “Tell Vlad I’ll have more flexibility after the election.”
        – Commodore Mom Pants, muslim filth.

        Reply

        1. Truth? You can’t handle the truth. You prefer lies like the falsehood that an effort to get the Russians to cooperate in a criminal investigation of fissionable material thefts by exchanging evidence was in any way improper. You suggest that a man who has repeatedly violated sacred vows to three wives can be trusted to keep his oath of office.

        4. You are just envious because nobody will join your circle. This isn’t about “Facebookers.” It is about Russian nationals who engaged in identity theft, wire fraud, and 37 pages worth of other crimes while spending millions of dollars to influence American elections, which is itself illegal. Apparently, you and Our President think that fact is unremarkable, and that investigating it is unpatriotic. Sad.

  15. Donald Trump is a big reason for that. Ever since it debuted in 2004, his reality TV show The Apprentice, about entrepreneurial achievement, was much better than the hugely popular Keeping Up With the Kardashians, a program about vacuous consumption. As I have argued here previously, his becoming President of the US is now the best reality show of all. Granted, his new role has more bandwidth and distribution channels. He is bound to surpass P.T. Barnum in fame, displacing the famous businessman and circus ringleader (currently portrayed by Aussie Hugh “Wolverine” Jackman in the blockbuster film The Greatest Showman.) “There’s a sucker born every minute,” but P.T. Barnum never said that himself—it’s what we used to call “misattribution” and now call “fake news.” Still, the aphorism rings truer than ever.

    Reply

  16. You know that the Mexicans and Canadians are actually going to build the wall and finance it by them self’s according the 1818 boarder. The projects name is KTIITW. (Keep The Idiots Inside The Wall)

    Also the Indians are celebrating Trumps victory and promise to deport all the immigrants and their children including himself. They try to negotiate with the Europeans to accept them back. EU is not interested though. Negotiations are going to take a while. Nobody watts the idiots.

    Reply

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